Boy, it really is the off-season …


Well, at least there’s a hockey game tonight, Game 6, on the anniversary of that Game 6 in ’94 and the clowns in Vancouver doing the “1940” chant incorrectly and then partying and rioting in the streets as if they won the Cup.

It is also the anniversary of the game after which Iron Mike Keenan — with one foot already out the door — nearly flipped his lid and wanted to take the team from Vancouver directly to Lake Placid because there was an extra day off before Game 7. Wanted to get away from the city, away from the media. Mark Messier, Kevin Lowe and Colin Campbell talked him out of it. The rest is history.

Anyway, I’ve got nothin’. I’m back to my “other” job now that the Rangers are gone. So I’ll be checking in throughout the day, and then see youse all tonight for the game.

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  1. True Fans Bleed RW&B on

    It is also the anniversary of the game after which Iron Mike Keenan—with one foot already out the door—nearly flipped his lid and wanted to take the team from Vancouver directly to Lake Placid because there was an extra day off before Game 7. Wanted to get away from the city, away from the media. Mark Messier, Kevin Lowe and Colin Campbell talked him out of it. The rest is history.

    Anyone have a link or good source for more on this story?

  2. now or never for the kings lose tonight and history will be made since 1942. no way kings win a game 7 after blowing this lead. just my opinion

  3. All the Kings have to do is play hard and they win this thing. They have not been the same team that stomped on the teams in their path to the finals. If they can be half of that team, they will destroy the Devils. I think they finally got their wake-up call and win this tonight. If NJ wins the cup, they could be the worst team to ever win it. They are so far from being a cup worthy team that it makes me sick just seeing them in the finals. It just seems like every team they have played has not been playing their best hockey at all. Not even close. You can’t give NJ the credit for that because they are not a dominant team by any means. This could be the most lucky run to the finals I have ever witnessed.

  4. Unfortunately, king’s luck had ran out. #8 in the west will be no match for one of the best in the east.

  5. Morning all,

    Wow Carp, never heard of that Mike Keenan lake placid story until now. That is interesting. That probably would have caused more of a media scorn. Any other lil tidbits you can share with us?

    Kings close it out tonight! 4-2 final, with Kopitar, Penner, Gagne and Brown your goal scorers…just my guess :-)

  6. I can’t wait for Game 7! A double must-win situation. That’s exciting. Also, the Kings have to break the Devil’s road-win-record. That’s a key in this series.

    Actually, whatever. UEFA Cup soccer is on (Europansy alert) so at least we have something to watch.

  7. Imagine Torts taking the team to Lake Placid during the playoffs to avoid the media nonsense.You’d have kidnapping stories all over the front pages.

  8. I feel so unclean typing this, but….I really, really, REALLY want to see Gary Bettman tonight.

  9. Larry Brooks’ column today is such weaksauce it’s not even funny. Using The Bore as an excuse to take shots at Tortorella. Give it a rest, Larry, would ya?

  10. I see more of you are starting to jump on my Game 7 bandwagon, eh?

    Well, my vision is now complete: the Kings will pull the ultimate choke job and the Devils will do the improbable. Hey, I don’t like it any more than you do, but that’s what I see.

  11. Lev, should we talk about the great 2002 team instead?

    Or ’99-2000. That was a fabulous squad with the signings of Kamensky, Fleury, Tim Taylor, Quintal and Lefebvre, expertly coached by Muck (and Torts).

    Go Thunderballs!

    So some of you guys are throwing dirt on the team THAT’S UP 3-2 in the series?! Geez. No wonder you were out on the ledge so much during the Rangers’ 102 games.

  12. Is anyone ever going to defeat Nadal at the French Open (aside from Robin Soderling, 2009)??

  13. Rico Fata, lmao…thats classic…

    Vladimir Krutov, from the famous KLM line passed away in russia. He was 52.

  14. That’s right, Carp.

    The French Open: Roast Beef on a Multigrain, French Baguette with Grainy mustard, pickled onion slaw and a side of Au Juis for flavor dips.

  15. Speaking of EuroPansy and EuroSoft how about that Euro2012 match upcoming between France and England?!?

  16. Carp, i just dont see any other team continuously talk about a championship that was won nearly 2 decades ago. I get that that team was something special, some great players, players that our youngsters are hopefully going to model their game after, but to continuously talk about it every single day and live off of it just kind of gets tiring. At least for me.

    England-France, doesnt get more *europansy* than that. Go Englishmen and Swedishwomen!

  17. Looking forward to that game, Manny! And the game at 2:30 between Ukraine and Sweden! Great sports day today with possible (please, G*d…PLEASE!!) Stanley Cup raising ceremony to end the day!

  18. Yes. The game this afternoon will be terrific as well! I can’t wait until NOON! Thank God for flat screens in the board room.

  19. Bwahahaha. I just found out the Mets are selling commemorative *bats* in honor of their No-Hitter. WTF?

  20. LA was a better team last game, if they play the same way they did Saturday, they should be able to close it tonight. And the Devils have to minimize the turnovers in order to have a chance.

  21. E3 pimp's angel on

    JR ” by unificating their intensity, the kingd should calibrate the cup tonight”

  22. E3 pimp's angel on

    JR ” coach sutter – you disenfranchised by the last 2 game?”

    Coach sutter ” tubby hubby nubby wubby”

  23. Paul in sunrise on

    Is konopka the plan b to prust?
    If rangers do trade AA and dubi. Who is the third line center?
    If not Radulov or Nash then who?

    My questions.

    Let’s go Phil at the open

  24. And regarding the Rangers, I never thought it was a bad thing to say that this year’s Rangers simply ran out of gas at the end. Some people on here took issue with that, but Doc Rivers, a guy I respect when he’s not whining about referees half the time, said that his Celtics team ran out of gas in the Game 7 postgame conf. Sure, the Celtics had a different team, a much older team than ours, but the Rangers too ran out of gas. And of course, Henrik was Henrik.

  25. In all these years, I cannot believe that England, the oldest joined national team, supposed creators of the sport, don’t have much to show for in major tournaments since 1966… shame, because I always root for them.

  26. Manny, one thing I’ve learned in my life is Hockey and soccer are the two sports were a team getting outplayed can steal a win. Just like germany over portugal the other day. Anyway, I hope my LA prediction comes through rather then my England one :-)

  27. so, if the Rangers ran out of gas after 18 games, how are the Devils still playing so well after 23 games? running out of gas is not a legit excuse.

    and we don’t call people racist, OK. So calm down Tiki.

  28. Only thing that runs out of gas are motors and engines that require fuel.


  29. The Rangers played a more physically demanding style over the full 82 game season than the Devils, filled with blocking shots and hitting. Then played 14 games in their first 2 playoff rounds. All this while sustaining the best record in the conference from the end of December thru the start of the playoffs. I think its fair to say that the physical style of play due to less skill and the injuries due to blocked shots left the Rangers with nothing left in the tank. Similar to the Celtics’ age and injuries leaving them with nothing left in the tank, as expressed by their coach.

  30. Yea, @CCCP@ I thought we learned a lesson from Hitler when his Panzer division ran out of gas during the Battle of the Bulge. I guess we didn’t buy enough.

  31. They should buy more offensive skill so they dont have to rely so heavily on a physical and shot blocking style of play to win. And if given the opportunity to rest players down the stretch of the season, as they had this year, they should rest players a little more instead of going for the 1 seed. I wanted the 1 seed badly too, but in hindsight, home ice doesnt really matter that much. Id rather have a fresh team heading into the playoffs than home ice.

  32. you mean that no hitter with a double down the line?

    No hat for me, thanks.


    a blind ump wouldn’t have missed that.

  33. so, if the Rangers ran out of gas after 18 games, how are the Devils still playing so well after 23 games? running out of gas is not a legit excuse.

    It’s about time somebody said something about the lame excuses of the team being tired. It’s not like the other teams were playing less games. The excuses for the team being tired is just that, an excuse. The real reason is that they just weren’t good enough. Have you noticed that the only people that bring up the excuse of being tired are people that don’t play the game – fans, sportswriters.

  34. So Doc Rivers never played basketball, Charlie? Is his reasoning that his old and injured team ran out of gas a lame excuse? Didnt think so.

  35. The rangers can not be common men, because common men go no where…they need to be un-common. – HB

    Maybe Rammer should put a boat engine in the hot tub to heal the bumps and bruises like they did in the movie major league.

    Forza Azzurri!

  36. And some of you probably wont have the intelligence to comprehend this….

    The Rangers did play more games than other teams.

    How many games did the Rangers take off en route to the 1 seed in the conference for the final 4 months of the season, and a year with a season-worst 3 game losing streak? How many games did the Rangers either win or lose by being blown out in?

    Now, what about the Kings… how many games did they take off en route to their 8 seed? How many games did the Kings win or lose by getting blown out in? They certainly had a cakewalk thru the first 2 playoff rounds, having to expend much less energy than the Rangers did in winning the 1st 2 playoff rounds.

  37. And, I was not commenting on basketball because I really don’t give a carcillo about the Celtics or any other NBA team.

    The Rangers were not an old team. Torts said it more than a few times that the team was not tired. The only people that brought it up were fans and sportswriters.

  38. Charlie, that wasnt a jab at you. But maybe you can tell me, where are the Kings currently and where are the Rangers currently?

  39. So, if the Rangers can’t make it through Game 18, how in hell are they ever going to win a Stanley Cup? By going 16-1?

  40. The Rangers werent an old team, they were a battered and bruised team due to their reliance on physical play and shot blocking, they were a tired team due to playing a full 82 game season while rarely taking a game off en route to the best record in the East.

  41. No, Carp. By acquiring more offensive skill, and relying less on a combination of the shot blocking/physical play. By Henrik standing out on his head and saving everything that comes his way.

    Id even venture to say that ran out of energy long before Game 18 of the playoffs. There were games this postseason which the team, aside from Henrik, didnt even show up. And you couldnt say that about many, if any, of the regular season games.

    Against Ottawa, Capitals, there were games in which we didnt even show up. You even acknowledged as much in your post game reviews. How many times during the season did the Rangers not show up?? Very few, if any.

  42. The key, Carp, is for the Rangers to forfeit just enough games to make the playoffs by the skin of their teeth. That way they will have played less games then other teams.

  43. So, what you’re saying is that all the other teams lounged around during the last few weeks of the season while the Rangers were playing hard. Is that it? Ummm…ok.

  44. Amen, @CCCP@ . England is ruining Futbol by blocking too many shots and playing too much defense.

  45. No, Charlie. What Im saying is that other teams like the Kings gave full effort less often during the entire regular season than the Rangers did during the entire regular season. We all bandied all year about how much heart and soul the team gave on a nightly basis. In the end, it wasnt their will, heart, or desire that gave in, it was their legs, shoulders, and every part of their bruised and battered bodies.

    Again, not a jab at you, but to think that all teams give full effort on a nightly basis during an entire regular season would be naive.

  46. I think Tiki’s point is if the Rangers all out black and blue style, while admirable, can be sustained for a full season and playoff run…or whether it is doomed to fail eventually if it relies only on grit and goaltending. Not so much about excuses but where do we go from here.

    Most (including mgmt) agree there needs to be more offense added to take some of the pressure off the players and Hank. But Torts will have the challenge of finding that right balance where the team doesnt lose its lunchpail character that made it successful.

  47. Matty"AwesomeYear!!"Boy on

    Carp, with respect to your 12:29 and 1:20 questions, I don’t profess to be a hockey know-it-all, but I have been at the games for 26 years now and a fan for 45. I have stated my opinion a few times here. Just no one listens to what I say with any regard.

    I think it’s pretty clear that there were a few factors why the Rangers tired in 18 games:

    1. Torts plays 3 offensive lines, 2-2.5 defensemen system. Whouldn’t you think playing 28 minutes for 82 games might + PO would tire you out a bit?
    2. shot blocking defense
    3. lack of depth — look at what Lou has done. On ‘d’ he has Zidlicky, Volchenkov, Tallinder (now, back too). Along with their other 4 d-men. Compare that to our big 4. Simple math. Their ‘d’ men top out at 22-23 minutes a game at most, but are balanced. Ours play 28-29. Wouldn’t you get tired after a whole year of it? It matters.
    On ‘o’ they have a balanced 4 line, roll ’em system. Their fourth line averages 9-10 minutes a game. What does ours? It wears on you.

    The Dev’s are a year ahead of us in terms of team depth. No one expected us to be in 1st place from December. We have a core, now it is up to our GM to create depth that the coach is confident with. If we role 4 and 3 and our guys get some rest, we will go 23-28 games PO and not tire any more than others.

    If he had added depth before or at the trade deadline like LA or NJ did, we might have been there, too.

  48. Matty"AwesomeYear!!"Boy on

    Tiki, at 1:12, that is a good point. We played 75 games hard this year. You’re right.

    I could swear the Debbies coasted for many more. Agreed.

  49. Afternoon all,

    Tiki – I respectfully disgree with you on the whole fatigue/injury factor being the predominant reason the Rangers didn’t advance to the Stanley Cup Finals.

    The team just didn’t have enough depth on its third and fourth lines to get key contributions at key times – and the top four on D were relied upon for too many minutes right up until the end. Hence the need to solidify a dependable 3rd pairing for the upcoming season.

  50. Well stated Matty. And i didnt even touch on the lack of dman depth as you and the enormous minutes played all season by the stud dmen.

    No harm no foul, Charlie. All i can do is try to impart wisdom on you and others.

  51. Yeah, it’s always the teams that lose that are tired. The teams that win are never tired.

    It’s an excuse and it doesn’t wash.

  52. Matty I agree for the most part. With the style they play they need more depth. If they didn’t play that style then the depth is less impt- many teams have won with limited contributions from 4th line and 6th defenseman.

    I also maintain that depth will result from adding top line talent, when the 2nd and 3rd liners become 3rd and 4th liners. Priority is to add top end skill.

  53. One bounce…one freaking bounce…and instead we’re talking about how the Rangers could close it out in LA tonight….

  54. Hey, Tiki, those games in the postseason where the team “didn’t even show up” … shouldn’t that have meant they were well rested for the next game?

  55. Agreed, Matty and Matteau. More depth and more offensive skill, less reliance on shot blocking.

    You keep saying they couldnt make it thru 18 games, Carp. It was 102 games of full effort, 1st place hockey reliant on physical play and shot blocking. And they barely made it thru 89 games and then again barely made it thru 96 games.

  56. Has anybody mentioned how *Fatigued* the Coyotes were? Man. They are a bunch of old guys forced to play way too many games. They must have been really *fatigued*

  57. Gary Bettman must be really *fatigued* since he had to be commissioner over so many games. Poor guy. Give him a break.

  58. Matty"AwesomeYear!!"Boy on

    Authorben, excuse me. I know you are a guest commentator, but your comment at 2:02 is supporting the argument that Tiki and I have highlighted.

    “the top 4 on d were relied upon too much”

    Uh..huh…yep, not enough depth. Or, the coach could trust the fringe players. Or certain players were used too much. Or……As I stated, the core was exhausted. Know why? Because they played 28-30+ minutes a game. You hit the nail on the head, but are calling it something different.

    Our guys were in great shape to start the season. No matter what, play too much, deal with tight games too much, play too many tough games, and eventually you tire. If you have 12+ guys you can rely upon on offense and 6-7 on ‘d’, it helps. We didn’t. We got tired.

    Call it what you want

  59. So how many games should they not show up for next season, and what will you be saying when they don’t show up for those games next season, Tiki?

  60. Yes, Carp. And we did come out and win the next game. My memory isnt what it used to be, but i think game 5 against Ottawa was a no show, i think GAME 2 against Capitals was a no show, and game 6 against Capitals was a no show. I think we won each of the following games. Game 4 against Devils was a no show (im not sure about that) but we gave full effort trying to come back in Games 5 and 6 against Devils after starting out poorly.

  61. I’m done with this speculative, 20/20 hindsight stuff. It’s a poor excuse and it shouldn’t be used.

  62. So, again, Tiki, if they didn’t show up for those games, then they really only played 14 games before they were exhausted. Right? Or is my math off?

    OK, now I’m done with this.

  63. Carp, u know me. I loved the effort the Rangers gave all season. I wanted that 1 seed bc i thought home ice mattered, contrary to what youd said about home ice from Day 1. In hindsight, id rather have had a fresher team than a team with home ice.

    **although the Rangers Game 7 record at home is 5-0, but that is a very small sample size.

  64. Matty"AwesomeYear!!"Boy on

    THe answer, my friends, is depth, depth, depth.

    We didn’t have it, they did.

    The Devils, LA, and last years Bruins all made deals leading up to or at the deadline to add depth. There must be something to it.

    They added depth so if guys got hurt, these players could play more. They also added depth to reduce the load on their core players.

    We didn’t have depth. We were not as talented on lines 3 and 4 and our 3rd defensive pairing.

  65. I told you, Carp. We have to forfeit enough games to remain in 8th place. Then we barely make the playoffs but we are completely rested. Thus, we win immediately when all other teams show signs of *fatigue*

  66. Id say they were exhausted the entire playoffs, when all other teams are just kicking it up a notch, the Rangers didnt have another notch to kick it up to. Game 7 crowds in 1st and 2nd round really helped the team find another level to play and win at.

    If Mike Rupp and Bickel played more, we’d have lost sooner, bc they arent that good. Thats why u need more offensive skill and depth, so forwards like Mike Rupp arent on your team. And with the way our team plays giving their body, more depth at D would be good too so Bickel isnt relied on. Sauer injury hurt.

  67. Matty"AwesomeYear!!"Boy on

    We did add depth up to and at the trade deadline. We got Wellman and Scott.

    How many minutes did they play?

  68. Need more offense, Torts himself recognizes this. As for this past season Torts got the most out of what he had, wouldn’t change anything. Sather on the other hand…

  69. Also, Sullivan was probably really *fatigued* since he has no one to share the assistant coaching duties with. More depth at assistant coach!

  70. Matty"AwesomeYear!!"Boy on

    Our fourth line:

    Wellman, Mitchell, Scott.

    What is wrong with this picture?

  71. Matty"AwesomeYear!!"Boy on

    Matteau, Torts realized the teams limitations. He recognized we had to play a certain way to win. He did an amazing job with the lack of depth and talent he received from the GM.

    Amazing. Coach of the century this year.

    You give this team to most coaches and they’re done in late February. Sather is lucky he had Torts.

  72. Matty"AwesomeYear!!"Boy on

    I wish Torts, one day, could address the lack of ability that he was handed in September and told to go to bat with. Some day, it would be great if he could tell what it was really like.

  73. And so im clear, im not blaming Torts. Sure, he couldve done a couple things differently in hindsight, but he did the best with the roster that he had. The job of a coach is to get the best out of your players and make things work with what you have. Our roster simply was lacking talent offensively, and so Torts made us a primarily defensive team that blocked shots and grinded out games. I believe he did the best he possibly could, a remarkable coaching job with the roster he was given.

  74. Matty and Matteau, my last post was to Carp, bc i know hes very defensive of Torts coaching. BBut 100% agreed on Torts.

  75. Sullivan was *fatigued* because he was too busy watching his Celtics and Red Sox to draw up an effective power play :)

  76. Yep Torts did the best with what he had. And Matty I do think the comments Carp got out of Torts on break up day are a clear indication that he feels he needs more to work with.

  77. Can someone explain to me why did they get tired exactly at the beginning of CF? Why did it not coincide with games 6 and 7 of Ottawa series? Or game 7 against Washington? Or game 1 against the Devils? If they essentially played 2/3 of their forwards and defense why didn’t they get tired after the game 55 of the regular season if that is the case? I’m asking from a physiological point of view.

  78. Forward depth is one thing, but if the minutes Girardi and McDonagh had all season were so debilitating, why was McDonagh especially basically the Rangers best skater right until they were eliminated.

    And I’d laud the Devils defensive depth more if I thought any of their current top six would be higher than fourth on the Rangers’ depth chart.

  79. Doodie Machetto, Get well Tony and Miami Pimp on

    ilb, I think the argument isn’t that they were tired so much as the Devils were fresher, which is why the Devils took over as the series carried on.

    I don’t buy it, but I think that makes more sense than saying “they got tired”

  80. Ilb, as i opined earlier, i think they were exhausted thru the entire playoffs. Games 7 of Wash and Ott were led by the crowd, inspiring the team to step up their play. As was Game 1 of the Devils series. Game 6 of Ottawa came after they no showed in Game 5.

    So McDonagh was their best skater because some guy in England has declared it so?

  81. Like Kevin lowe said to wayne gretzky after the 83 finals vs the islanders, “they won and their wounded, we lost and we’re fine”.

    Maybe the rangers weren’t tired enough….

  82. We couldve beaten the Devils. We had a better all around team. A much better defensive D corps and the worlds best goalie.

    Again, my memory isnt what it used to be, but I think we gave up 12 goals in the final 3 games. Very un-2011-12-Rangers like.

  83. Yawn.

    I thought only the 1% of my posts that were innocuous jokes about admitted or strongly-suspected Yankee PED users got read?

  84. Considering youve posted probably 2000 times in the past couple months, and Ive only read 3 (all 3 in the last 2 days), Id say that 3 posts fits in the 1%.

  85. Doodie Machetto, Get well Tony and Miami Pimp on

    I’ve heard Kovalchuk has a herniated disc. Which if he did would be amazing that he’s able to play, at all, even if he has been a virtual no-show in the final.

  86. Croud wouldn’t be able to jumpstart a dead car if it didn’t have anything in the tank. I’m *tired* of discussing that topic, and stopped some time ago, not sure why I started again….

  87. Doodie Machetto, Get well Tony and Miami Pimp on

    Too many Americans on our team so they ran out of gas. We should have bought one of those energy efficient Japanese models.

  88. ilb, ill agree to disagree. i dont think youve played a professional sport, i know i havent. But when athletes of all pro sports routinely discuss their crowd as having lifted them in situations which they needed lifting or didnt have anything left, I think Ill take their word for it.

  89. So by my calculations, I’ve got 17 left to play with.

    How to strike a balance? Does 15 whining about officiating conspiracies and two trying to insult somebody who doesn’t give a flying byfug about somebody trying to insult him work?

  90. Disagree we had a better roster- for playoffs- than the devils. Other than in goal. They were the better constructed team.

    Is it possible if the Ranges had not played a full season all out followed by 2 mentally and physically intense 7 game series they may have had a little extra to overcome the Devils? I don’t think anyone knows the answer to this though some can pretend they do.

    What we do know is it would have been a heck of a lot easier with more offense and Torts acknowledged this need for next year.

  91. ilb, and im not being a jerk or a devil’s advocate. I honestly dont see the big deal in saying they ran out of energy towards the end. Future Hall of Famer Doc Rivers said the same thing about his team a couple days ago.

  92. They need to trade for some hybrids next year. Forget the scorers. *Hybrids* Except Shaq apparently has shoes bigger than some hybrids. And more stylish too….

  93. Matteau, maybe they did have the better constructed team as a whole. But we had the better top 4 defensive D corps and we had the world’s best goalie. And we gave up 11 or 12 goals in the final 3 games, very un Rangers like for this season. Youre right, more offensive skill and offensive depth would have alleviated some of the pressure on the D corps and maybe those 11 or 12 goals against are only 6 goals against

  94. I think the Rangers looked tired because they could not handle the forecheck the Devils threw at them. I think they should have tried to go out up the middle more but instead tried to force it up the boards almost 100% of the time. They obviously did it this way because the coaches did not trust the talent to handle the puck with the necessary finesse and security. They continuously retreated behind their net, whioch seemed to suit the Devils just fine. LA is using the center of the ice to break out–they obviously have greater faith in their personnel to handle the strategy. Being constantly unable to clear your zone might make you look tired when you are not. And I really don’t believe that the effort expended in games 1 through 40 reflects itself in the playoffs. Not with the training and nutrition and the generally better physical condition of today’s player. If playing hard in the first half of the season really could wear a team down, no coach would do it.

  95. Definitely they need more depth, and by that I mean Brian Boyle is an awesome fourth line cenetr and PK guy. Not sure he is higher than that on a great team. You could even put Dubie or Artie on a fourth line and roll them. Then you have 4 lines that are all a threat to score.

    Games 5 and 6 of the Devils series, the Rangers basically entered the thrid period tied and then carried the play in both games through the third period. Honestly those are the only 2 times all year I can recall that happening and them losing. It happens.

  96. Doodie Machetto, Get well Tony and Miami Pimp on

    What was the question? Doesn’t matter; answer is the same: *Wellman*

  97. I think we’re confusing being outplayed with being out of gas. They weren’t out of gas. They were out-executed. And if they’d executed a little bit better, if Richards and Hagelin and Girardi and Gaborik and McDonagh hadn’t decided to make snow angels in overtime in Newark, they might still be playing … despite their lack of gas.

  98. Doodie Machetto, Get well Tony and Miami Pimp on

    Maybe they should have eaten a lot of garlic and broccoli. Those always seem to give me plenty of gas.

  99. Doodie Machetto, Get well Tony and Miami Pimp on

    Carp, I don’t think it’s coming. Been very busy at work and at home. Noticed how I haven’t been around?

  100. Swedes are blocking shots like they are New York Rangers. Maybe they were watching Hagelin and Hank?

  101. Yea, Carp. Pay more attention to how often Doodie posts here before you criticize him.

  102. Games 1 thru 40? You make excellent points, but Games 1 thru 82 certainly do. Especially when youre the 2011-12 Rangers. A team that only knew one way to play all season long. Maximum effort. Whereas most other teams coast thru parts of the season, take their foot off the pedal thru parts of the season, this team never did, having only a season worst 3 game losing streak. At some point, our maximum effort was no longer gonna be good enough. And thats what happened.

  103. By the way “depth” is a nice way of saying we need more offense. We need top line talent, so we can push some of our guys down to where they belong. We already have good depth players.

    I’m sure even the most disagreeable of you would find this hard to disagree with.

  104. The Kings really coasted in, clinching as they did in what, Game 81 or 82?

    so next year, Torts should push for minimal effort in certain games. But how should he determine which games to push for minimal effort? Maybe we should decide that on the blog here and tell Torts to read it.

    Maybe there will be a lockout shortened season, so next year the Rangers can win the Cup because they won’t run out of gas. But, on the other hand, other teams will still be fresher because the Rangers will exert more effort in the 48 or 52 games.

    Ridiculous. All of it.

  105. Am i the only one gunning for Sverige right now? I know im a traitor (somewhat) to my Russian culture but…Sverige for the win!

  106. Doodie Machetto, Get well Tony and Miami Pimp on

    Yeah Carp, what Manny said! Pay attention!

  107. Doodie, do you want to do it later? I’ve got three months to fill here … more if there’s a lockout.

  108. Doodie Machetto, Get well Tony and Miami Pimp on

    Carp, the Kings were leading their division entering the final week of the season. Then they dropped that home and home with the Sharks and allowed Phoenix to slide in.

  109. I didnt say teams *coasted into* the playoffs. Or the Kings. I said that other teams coast thru parts of the season. Maybe Game 1 thru 10. Or Games 25 thru 32, or maybe even some teams coast games 17 thru 24 and games 65-72. Most every team does coast thru parts of a season. In baseball, basketball, hockey. It happens, its a part of being human.

    One thing you cant disagree with, this Rangers team played hard all season long, each and every game.

    Its all just a difference of opinion. No need to get upset with me. I have no problem agreeing to disagree.

  110. Bring back the HYPER-BARIC CHAMBER! Could be our most important acquisition of the off-season!!!

  111. Exactly Matteau. Torts did the best he could with what he had, he made this team the best in the East, and Id venture to say that no other coach couldve done with our team and roster what Torts did.

  112. Carp, why dont we have a contest on the upcoming US open? winner gets a road to victory DVD……whatta ya say??

  113. Thanks, Doodie.

    Hey Carp – Pay attention to me! WAAAAAAHHHHH

    Seriously though, we need to start forfeiting more games. Or maybe keep key players in reserve for the playoffs.

  114. “It is a pleasure to spend time around a successful coach such as Pete DeBoer, who doesn’t feel the need to belittle professional journalists covering the Stanley Cup playoffs or strike a pose as the man who wants to win more than anyone else in the world”

    hahahahahaha. I think someone pee peed in Brooks’ lunch box.

  115. Coasting through long stretches and playing worse players was the foundation for the Rangers’ seven straight Stanley Cups from 1998 to 2004, don’t forget.

  116. Doodie Machetto, Get well Tony and Miami Pimp on

    Yeah, I can do it later. No problem. The focus I was originally planning on was a Kovalchuk vs. Richards retrospective, but after the Kings went up 2-0 I thought “Maybe I should just wait until the Final is over,” thinking it would be less than a week. Then they got extended and I got busy.

  117. The rangers lost there shot of the cup when sather decided John Scott was his deadline move. No depth not being tired in the end

  118. True Fans Bleed RW&B on

    Yea, because LA being forced to finish the season 13-6-2 in order to scratch their way into the playoffs was LESS stressful (physically and mentally) than the Rangers who had essentially locked up a playoff spot in March.

    Aren’t the Rangers #7th youngest team?

    I can understand blaming some injuries; Gaborik, Callahan seemingly effected, Dubinsky, and mental mistakes by MDZ and Richards. But Carpy nailed it – if you can’t show up for the better of 20 crucial games, then don’t expect to keep playing. Fatigue or not, the Rangers weren’t good enough and I tend to believe it was simply the suffocating system that the Devils play which made the Rangers “offense” look impotent.

  119. True fans, Kings 2011-12 team Lost 5 games in a row 2 separate occasions. On both occasions, lost 6 out of 7. On a different occasion altogether, lost 8 out of 10 games in February. Now, Im willing to admit when Im wrong, something most people arent, it looks as if the Kings played in a total of 18 regular season games decided by 3 goals or more while the Rangers played in a total of 29 regular season games decided by 3 goals or more. Not sure it means anything, but if the 18 games were played by the Rangers, Id be pointing to that as one reason for our *fatigue*, not enough easy wins or blowout losses, not that any team wants blowout losses. (EN goals not included)

  120. Cause of losing games, as well as winning, are more complicated than just one thing. How about at least two: Rangers exit from PO was a result of a).Lack of scoring, b).Tiredness (b/c of their style of play all season). As a) is pretty obvious; b)knowing consensually, that Rangers trade mark is efforts and more efforts, and we can’t blame them for lack of it, but they were visibly outplayed(outskated, outworked in corners and boards, etc.) in this very component, derivative of physical condition, one thereof should come to the conclusion, THEY WERE TIRED more than opponent. Are we in peace now?

  121. bull dog line on

    I would like to chime in on the tired discussion. I don’t buy it. teams could not match the Rangers intensity during the regular season. over 82 games it is tough to do. but come playoff time, everybody plays with high intensity. they were able to match the Rangers over 7 game series.

  122. Wrong peak of condition…(Rangers had it in March IMO). Intensity you gather and draw out of condition. Pure adrenalin is a short run fuel.

  123. Krutov

    The big guy on that great line, ( who loved Hot Dogs), with Larionov and, sorry I just can’t recall the other one…one of the greatest scoring lines in history, and given so little credit. So young to go.

  124. fran, quiz for you
    Babich – Bobrov – Shuvalov
    Loktev – Al’metov – Aleksandrov(later Firsov)
    Mikhailov – Petrov – Kharlamov
    Makarov – Larionov – Krutov

  125. so when the Kings were losing five in a row, and when they were winning those games by three or more goals, they were doing it on purpose so they wouldn’t be as tired as the Rangers, in the event that the Rangers made it to the finals instead of, say, Pittsburgh or Boston?

    Rangers looked less tired than Washington in Game 7, BTW, and less tired than the Devils in Games 1 and 3, and less tired than the Devils when they came back from 3-0 and 2-0 in Games 5 and 6. But more tired than Washington in Game 6, more tired than the Devils in Games 2 and 4 and more tired than the Devils while they were falling behind 3-0 and 2-0 in Games 5 and 6, and a lot more tired than the Devils on the Henrique goal in OT (that’s why they were laying down and Richards took a knee).

  126. better beans on

    The stubbornness about fatigue displayed by the Hamlinettes, and the Sad Piper himself, with regard to its complexity in high-level playoff marathons, including allopaths who should know that the fatigue discussed is relative and context-determined, and not proven by a kid like McDonagh actually falling asleep while on the ice (but maybe hinted at in game five against the Devs, second period, when he and Girardi could barely haul their battered and bruised over the boards at a change late in the second period) is awesome.

    Awesome stubbornness. Led by one of the more stubborn coaches in the game.
    Short of talent, Torts COULD NOT LET his guys even think about how worn they were. THAT is why he never acknowledged their obvious state. Why writers and fans feel the need to march in uncritical lockstep with him is one of this season’s great puzzles.

    A note: it takes young bodies, and consequently young teams, a while to adjust from
    shorter, less demanding seasons – from college and minors to the NHL; from NHL patsy to Eastern Conference finals. To assume a young team would, by definition, be more energetic, is as shallow a take as can be had here.

    There are about a dozen other major flaws with the Piper-thoughts. Too much time and energy required to correct them; too little gain for time spent with folks who can only do bad Butthead imitations (or good ones, I guess, depending on the level of your affection for the cartoon lads).

  127. better beans on

    PS: I only stop in a for a handful of minutes here and there. I’m not lookin’ to be part of any back and forth. Sorry….

  128. Carp, you disagree with me, i disagree with you. I think we’re past the point of arguing w each other. This isnt a polarizing topic, just something to pass the time.

  129. So if I think the Rangers were more tired than the stubborn coach would admit to and than the Pied Piper of the blog thinks, but nowhere near enough to portray it as the main reason for the Rangers’ elimination, I’m not sure where that leaves me on the Hamlinette/allopath spectrum.

  130. And like 4ever said, i wasnt placing the blame of our playoff elimination solely on fatigue. Lack of scoring was clearly the #1 reason IMO.

  131. Better beans,
    It was highly sophisticated and almost agreeable diatribe. Sorry, you gone …forth and probably not going to be…back, but did you ever play any games yourself, except checkers and electronic (which also make someone tired)? Any motivations and high octane willpower has relative and absolute limitations in certain physical capacity of different individual and could be collectively intensively warn by constant excessive use to offset lack of talent.
    Wasn’t it a case, when Bolivar (the horse), just couldn’t go any further…?

  132. Anyone who doesn’t believe the Rangers were gassed even before the playoffs started just wasn’t paying attention. This team was basically a .500 team for the last three months of the season that includes the playoffs- check it out – they basically held their lead at the top of the division by playing win one- lose one hockey. I think its a testament to their determination that they were able to advance two rounds – but, honestly, not for one game (at least one entire game) did they approach the level they were playing at earlier in the season.Did they deserve to be tired more than anyone else did? Who knows- but they certainly LOOKED more tired to me. Its starting to seem that the Stanley Cup is no longer won by the best team- but rather is a war of attrition won simply by the last man standing (that was never truer than last season). Maybe if the Kings win tonight we can make an argument to the contrary for a team that blew through the playoffs in 20 games- but thats a discussion better suited for the post season- tomorrow.

  133. Some people are just so entrenched in the mindset of being “an angry Rangers fan” that they forget what this season was all about.

    There is nothing to complain about. This team could beat any team in the League. A few more bounces our way and we are playing against LA tonight instead of Jersey….

    There is so much parity in the League. And, if you think the Rangers are tired, then the Devils and Kings are even more tired….

    I’ll tell you who’s tired…..the true Rangers fans that have read these weak arguments all over the place…

  134. Um, looked pretty good to me in Game 7 vs. Washington and Game 1 vs. New Jersey, ABindy. not to mention that big win over Philly that clinched everything late in the season. Maybe they un-tired in those games.

  135. There NYR goes with pseudo-intellectuality…

    Speaking for myself only, Im not complaining. Im not angry. Im discussing one of the reasons we didnt win the Cup and things Sather has to do in offseason to help our chances next year.

  136. Paul in sunrise on

    Carp why bother. Fatigue is not an excuse. If you cannot find the drive and energy at this time of year them they are the players you want on this team. Injuries are understandable. Fatigue is bull carcillo

  137. Agree NYR_Fan
    at the beginning of the season I thought if the Rangers made it to the conference finals, the season would be a darn good success in my book. However I expect more/better next season. Players getting a little older and more experienced will only make the group better. I’m already pumped for next season, and I’m curious to see who the Rangers pick up this summer.

  138. Better beans- a dozen major flaws? Wow, that’d better be coming from one of the better hockey minds ever. Didn’t know Scotty Bowman read the blog. Either way, your post sounds awfully condescending, I am sure both allopaths and osteopaths would agree…..

  139. True Fans Bleed RW&B on

    Someone here called someone else an allopath!

    Give the man the Pulitzer for his work. What an essay.

    Long, well worded essays can often be persuasive… Ever read Mein Kempf?

  140. Let me try to summarize Beans: it is overly simplistic to say the Rangers were or were not fatigued and that anyone knows for sure whether it was a factor or not in whether they could have mustered up a little more to overcome the Devils. He also seems to be surprised by the certitude of so many on this issue. I’m kinda with him.

    No one is looking for excuses, don’t know why that word keeps coming up. The team fell short becuase it wasnt the better team, for whatever reason.

    Here’s what we- and Torts- do know: we need more offense.

  141. exactly, Matteau. And they need to execute better.

    Everybody’s tired by the third round of the playoffs. It’s not a legit excuse.

  142. Thanks Carp and not to pick a battle with anyone but there is certitude on both sides of this debate

  143. Make it an additional component- NJ has much more players who know what it takes. They’ve been there many times, together. It often takes many hard loses to win one. This was an invaluable experience, and not anyone’s fault. They’ll add what they need, and with more experience will move forward. This isn’t the year when you blame anyone.

  144. TSNBobMcKenzie BOS agrees to terms with Chris Kelly on four-year, $12M deal and Gregory Campbell on three-year, $4.8M deal. AAVs of $3M and $1.6M.

    Damn! They took our 4th liners!

    Dey took er fur liners!

    Derk Er Derrrr!

  145. Campbell not an outrageous comparable when considering Prust’s contract.

    Pretty similar scoring numbers and roles (though Prust fights quite a lot more) – both the same amount of PK time last year.

    Only takes a couple of teams to jack the price up, true, but I really can’t see $3m per being justified for Prust.

  146. Me neither, LW. … but if somebody tries to blow the Rangers out of the water, they might go way over value to keep him.

  147. That should read “some guy in England has declared Prust to not be worth a $3m per year deal”. My apologies.

  148. Hard to quantify Prust’s worth in terms of cap-hit. My magic number is $2.4m….I have a hard time justifying anything more than that….

  149. Paul in sunrise on

    I hope prust just wants to stay in new york.

    Typos in my previous post that was ignored anyway. *then they are not the players you want…
    Stupid iPhone.

    Let’s go rangers

  150. don’t think Prust did anything special this year to deserve a raise of any kind… if other teams want to overpay him then thanks for everything buh-bye.

  151. tonight those LA shots off the posts will start going in. Smarty’s luck will run out tonight.

  152. Meek, meager, shy. I only quote words that’ve been used to describe him by people that have met him. Not weak, or sick.

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