Rangers-Maple Leaves in review

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I missed Beavis & Butt-head’s return and that  World Series Game 6 for this?

Are you kidding me?

I’m going to break this review into three parts. First, about the game. Second, about the new building. Third, a mea culpa.

Thoughts:

1) For years … for decades … maybe a century, teams have coveted guys like Ryan Callahan. Guys who smash opponents into the glass and go hard to the net. They still covet them. But so far this season, I’ve seen opponents gladly face the glass knowing that Ryan Callahan can’t hit them, and if he does (and he has) he gets a penalty. And last night, for going hard to the net, Ryan Callahan had two Rangers goals disallowed, even though on one of them he was clearly pushed. And I’m left to wonder, in today’s NHL, is it possible that guys like Ryan Callahan will not be able to play anymore? Is that possible?

2) If it is, well … what the hell are we going to watch?

3) I’ve said it before, I will say it again. This Rangers team will be better than it is now, and it  should and will be better than it was last year because Brad Richards and a rebound by Marian Gaborik make it better, and because you expect the young veterans to continue to improve. But … if Richards and Gaborik don’t work, and especially if Callahan, Brandon Dubinsky and whomever turns out to be the second-line center don’t work, this team is in huge trouble. Not breaking any news there, am I?

4) You hate to blame Henrik Lundqvist after the way he pretty much stole every point the Rangers had until Martin Biron got two in Winnipeg, but Lundqvist sure gave up a few regrettable goals. Otherwise, maybe the whole tone last night and today is different.

5) Dubinsky has not been good, so I won’t sugar-coat it. And he’s taken some dumb penalties,  no way around it. But last night, the slashing call was shockingly bad. He did nothing. And for him to get an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty for spraying snow on a goalie — if that is really what the penalty was for — that’s an embarrassment to the NHL.

6) I tend to defend Michael Del Zotto because of his upside, and he’s still young, and very much in need of learning. But lesson No. 1 has to be this. The puck is hopping toward you at the point. You either stop it with your foot, or you take a swing at it and then practice saying, “C’mon Hank, bail me out, buddy!” I think stopping it with your skate is a better option.

——————

7) How is it possible that the Garden widened the concourses by that much — by a lot, by an almost unimaginable amount — and now it’s more crowded and gridlocked than ever? How? Maybe they will have to relocate some of those movable concession counters or something.

8) I don’t think it was the new higher pressbox. Maybe it was. To me the place sounded a lot quieter than last year, and last year was much quieter than the place used to be in the old days. And maybe that’s what you get when you price out the leatherlungs. That and empty seats close to the glass and a full house upstairs.

9) Don’t get me wrong. Those are a few complaints about the renovation (which still has two more phases to go). I think overall the place is going to be magnificent. I think.

——————

Now …

10) That huge banner that unfurled said: “16 Avery. Send Torts to the Whale.” And then there were the “We want Avery” chants and the simple “Avery, Avery.”  I’m a flipper and a flopper on this, and I admit it. I said over the summer, when asked whether Sean Avery would be on the team, that I thought he would. I thought that he’s better on the fourth line than anybody else they have. I dismissed the idea that he could play on the No. 1 line with Gaborik and Richards, but I thought, for sure, he would be better on the fourth line that whomever would replace him.

11) That said, when camp came along and he was penciled in on lines with guys who weren’t going to make the team, I thought, OK, no big deal. We’re talking about a fourth-liner here, not a game-breaker. This isn’t Ted Sator sending Pierre Larouche to the minors. This is a fringe guy who’s not young anymore, who is expensive in terms of cap hit, who isn’t going to be around next year, and whose skills sure seemed to diminish last year. Plus he’s a pain in the neck for coaches because he doesn’t conform, and we all know he crosses a line too often. And, I wondered, how will he react to fourth-line minutes and maybe nights in the (new) pressbox?

12) And now? I still think all of those things about Avery. But I also go back to my original belief. He’s better, warts and attention-grabbing and all, than three of the wingers the Rangers had in last night’s lineup, and most nights this season. I’m not going to mention any names (but their numbers might be 86, 40 and 45). I’m not sure he’s a better player than No. 71, but he’s a better skater. And he always stood up for his teammates, even if they didn’t all love him (ps, from all I’ve gleaned, those in his corner included Lundqvist, Gaborik and, I think, Richards — three pretty important pieces; check out Lundqvist’s remark when asked in last night’s post-game audio thread).

13) What would the Rangers’ record be if he was playing instead one of those other wingers? It would be 3-3-2. I don’t think it has, or would have, made a difference if he was here playing instead one of them. But I do admit, he’s better than they are, and the Rangers are a better team if he was here instead of one of them. Especially when they play the other teams in the Patrick Division.

————-

My Three Rangers Stars (not easy again):
1) Dan Girardi.
2) Michael Sauer.
3) Geez, I don’t even know.

————-

AP photos, above.

 

 

 

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324 Comments

  1. Don’t post much but I will try to more. Look at what happens when we throw shots at the net. Then look at what happens when we don’t throw shots at the net. We aren’t a pretty team need to realize it. When will Torts stop messing with the lines? Get Step back to the first, Artie back to the second, and Feds (as much as I love the guy) back to the third. Time for bed.

  2. When are they going to learn how to pass, and when to quit giving the puck away.

    And for Pete;s sake …SHOOT AT THE NET.

  3. Prust is turning into Avery. selfish penalty, to fancy with the puck in his own zone, and blind passes. maybe he will twitter about it. I know, I know, its Prust. he can do whatever he wants.

  4. I thought AA was active last night. Stepan needs to start attacking the net. he is on the perimeter to much.

  5. enough with the line juggling. let Gabby and Richards figure it out. its not like they are 2 rookies who have not earned that right. these are 2 guys that have had success in the NHL.

  6. Really can’t be bothered touching on Avery’s relative worth to the team yet again (no doubt another 300 comments will pick up the flack there), but either way I don’t see the point of the Mancrush Square Garden crowd turning his absence into a cause célèbre every time the team is losing at home.

    Completely understand the booing, leaving early etc. after seeing a final 40 minutes as bad as that, but turning into an issue about one player, in perception at least, is missing the point.

  7. billybleedsblue on

    Carp, that game last night was so amazing. Obviously, I don’t mean the Rangers… I missed the hockey game, but when I got home, I caught game 6 from about the bottom of the 6th inning on. The Cards just won’t go away, and now the tables have turned completely on this thing. Carpenter should be ready to start, so it’s advantage Cardinals! La Russa once again looks like a genius, especially when they win tonight! Berkman and Freese saved the day, BIG TIME. Freese actually twice, with the game winning walk-off homer. You no doubt have seen/read all of this, but man was it fun to see the Cards celebrate at the plate and watch Puljols tear off Freese’s shirt! LOL. GO CARDS!!!!!!!!!!! and let’s go Rangers (of the NHL).

  8. Rhode Island Ranger on

    Carp:

    Agree with every bit of your game review.

    But, your sensible assessment of how Avery measures up against some of the dead wood in the lineup raises the implicit question about the coach’s judgment and ego: Is he unable or unwilling to admit that his spare parts are not better players than #16?

    Although still early, it looks like some of the spare parts AND second-line core players are not what we all hoped they’d be. Are the foundational players simply overrated? Can Tortorella and Sather deal with this honestly and practically? Don’t know.

  9. Stranger Nation on

    Agree that Avery, rupp, newburry is a good 4th line

    Team had a lot of trouble breaking out of zone, forwards down too low, Dmen not making the right pass or not making a good pass.

    This team has to hit to be effective and if the league is moving in a different direction, we do not have the front line talent to play that game.

    Man, watching wusskie and EZ play is nauseating. Bring up some youngsters who can skate AND have a heart.

    Dubi is just not skating well. Was knocked down a couple of times and the Jagr impersonation along the boards is a weak one.

  10. you were right Carp, I love your assessment. Its pretty simple the way you put it, Avery BRINGS MORE that these other deadbeats skating in circles. Factor in Henrik’s comments post game and its clear that Totalretard has not only made a completely personal decision in this regard, but the players know it too and there is some dissension there. and the worst part, its all for no reason.

    So, totalretard thinks Avery is a distraction and in reality, HE has created the distraction. how ironic.

    and LW, once again YOU are missing the point, its not about one player, its about the clueless egomaniacal ratface behind the bench, making poor choices, and alienating players. You are as clueless as ratface himself if you think its just about one player. Avery is the example.

    and carp, point 7, how it’s more crowded and gridlocked than ever in the wider halls? i have been telling people the same thing, way wider, and way more crowded. insane.

    and as always firetorts!!!!

  11. This is one of those times when I’m not sorry that I missed the game especially since I was playing basketball and my 15-foot jumpers were falling all night. I was in a major zone. But, I digress.

    Anyway, in regard to your first item I’m afraid that the NHL means No Hitting League. It’s turning out to be like the over-40 recreation league They’re doing the same thing to football and it’s going to kill the game. The main attraction for a lot of fans is the violence of the game – the hard hits. Now, you can’t even give the opponent a dirty look without getting sent to the penalty box. It’s sickening.

  12. billybleedsblue on

    Hey firetorts, how do you *really* feel about Torts? Geez…

    I for one am a fan of The Avery, but it’s so unlikely that things will turn back now. It’s a shame, but we gotta believe in this team ‘growing up’ especially because we all know Torts will stick to his guns and Avery’s gone. *wah* :'(

  13. If this club (and I’m talking both the players and coaching staff) needs Sean Avery in the lineup in order to play with passion for an entire game instead of at best, 1/3, then I say blow it all up, from top to bottom and the sooner the better.

    Do what should have been done in the 6 years ago – bottom out and rebuild properly.

  14. Noah, Associate Assistant Alternative Captain on

    Carp, I will echo your point about the loudness in the place. My brother and I, sitting in the 400’s, thought it sounded like a golf tournament in there. Even the goal song didn’t seem as loud as usual. I’m not sure if they got rid of some speakers that were upstairs, but that needs to be tweaked.

  15. Re: The “New” Arena – All renovations are being made with huge mistakes. MSG has more than just hockey to worry about. They also have basketball and I am sure they make most of their quick cash on concerts, your Celine Dion’s and what-have-you. Thus, the “improvements” are really to make more money and now MSG, just like Yankee Stadium will be quiet and empty, even for the important games. I, for one, cannot afford the insane ticket prices more than a few times a season.

    Re: The Game – the game was another tale of two fishes. Great first period where I was yelling “Yes! Yes! This is how you play! Atta boy!” and then tow 100% adysmal periods. Which brings me to my next point…

    Sean Avery: Ok – he’s better than 45 and 40 (not hard) and probably 86 (who was MISERABLE last night and severely hurt the team with his whiffs). Does he make the team better overall? Probably not. Skill-wise he doesn’t bring much to the table in terms of Wins Against Replacement or whatever that stat is. I will say. however, that in a game like last night, he can get out there and mix it up and maybe get the team going a little bit. Maybe a little fire in the locker room and anger towards each other could help. Because once the ship started sinking last night nobody jumped up to help bail the water.

    Del Zotto took a baby step backwards last night. Wolski killed us. Christensen is invisible. The officiating was overall HORRENDOUS. And boy did Newbury get pummeled. Like a cartoon.

  16. Tortorella’s ego is way too massive to recall Avery. We all know that Sather has a soft spot for #16 but it seems like Torts is calling the shots nowadays regarding the roster (emphasizing youth, not trading young assets).

  17. Jlone2Bubblehead (Namaste Henrik Lundqvist) on

    Carp the number 3 star was Biron. He made zero mistakes and took no penalties.

  18. The worst part about Torts is he crosses the line as well! He’s reknowned for having little control over his temper…since when is it remotely acceptable to curse out a reporter? Total hypocrite on Avery…claims he’s an embarassment…if he was leading a team in any other sport he would be the embarassment…Torts that is. Bring back Avery!

  19. NYR_FAN via Android on

    If we’re talking about players who have been invisible, Homegrown Dubi has to be a big part of the conversation. I mean, most of us expected Woof and EC to play like they have. Dubious is supposed to be a leader and he is setting a terrible example

  20. I’m also 28, not under 25, I know people of all ages that love this guy. Do you seriously live in NY and not understand how perfect for NY he is?

  21. Carp,

    1) The place sounded pretty loud on TV and I’ve heard that the atmosphere wasn’t much different than it was last year. I think everyone in the media is quick to be a populist and jump on the “atmosphere” at these new venues. How about this: if the team played good hockey, the crowd would cheer more.

    2) Torts spoke in his post-game press conference quite a bit about “energy.” You know who’s a sparkplug? Sean Avery. I honestly think he DOES make a difference in a game like last night’s.

    3) If the first period was the best period the Rangers have played all year, and if that’s the standard they’re looking for, they’re still going to be mediocre at best. Yes, “they had 16 shots on goal.” Guess what: not many of them were high-quality scoring chances. A lot of shots from the perimeter, bad angles, etc.

    This team is in trouble. 8 games into the, I don’t care how crazy I sound, I’m saying it.

  22. Carp
    you forgot to mention Girardi
    just for the fact that he took that shot
    …i thought it hit him on the left side of his helmet
    around the temple…
    but
    whatever
    i was impressed with his Monster-ness at that time
    reminded me of Adam Foote who took a high stick to the nose
    and shrugged it off

  23. yes Avery has more speed
    but
    let’s face it EC is there cause he’s cheaper
    can occasionally put in the wonder goal
    and is usually good at shootouts
    and
    the way this team is offensively that’s barely
    enough to keep him around

    not saying i like it
    but it’s the reality of the situation.

  24. Carp
    you probably didn’t hear this
    but after the Avery chant
    Sam Rosen quietly said
    something like
    “I don’t think that would make any difference.”

    and as much as i liked him
    i tend to agree
    based on last year
    he would speed down the ice
    but would his shots hit the back of the net?
    would he be getting assists on goals and/or be part of cycle to keep puck in the zone?
    then again
    based on last year
    there should be several to a handful of goals by Dubi, Cally, Boyle, Stepan and on and on

  25. Right on jpg. I am not trying to snap at the Avery supporters. I just think it has to be put in perspective. Avery might have helped pick up the energy last night. He would have been a huge pest when those goals were disallowed. But he wouldn’t have been the reason we won. It’s minor stuff we are talking about here and a team should not need a “pest” to help them get their energy up. Where is Prust? Where is Boyle? These guys need to get back to the run they had last year.

  26. what worries me than my lack of sleep right now
    is
    the teams’ overall play that flies in the face of
    someone who has made it to the NHL level.
    either mgt’s assessment is really poor
    and we’ve all been horribly fooled into thinking that
    these player have more to give
    and that last year’s efforts weren’t a fluke
    and/or
    that these players actually lack Hockey IQ
    which, again, amazes me for someone who is at the NHL level

    yes, some players are better than others. some develop quicker.
    some develop in certain situations
    but
    most everyone on the team looks as if they’ve taken a step backwards
    which is pretty amazing
    and really sad
    when you consider the 29 other teams who have players
    that are either consistent from year to year or have some degree
    of improvement

  27. Wow, Carp, so many boneheads are bailing on the team already??? Geez, kinda’ early for mutiny I would think. The team needs to get back to a routine of practice & playing on this continent. The only thing negative I can offer is Torts continues to shuffle his lines so why does anyone even waste a second thinking about line combinations? He changes guys around every period, let a lone every game. Also, to the building, I didn’t go to the game so I can’t comment on the crowded concourses or the crowd noise but from my TV, the goal song was a lot lower, almost inaudible. And you could barely hear the “Potvin Sucks” chants either. Sam had to tell us that the crowd was chanting “We Want Avery” (I was embarrassed for the crowd). All-in-all, disappointed with the lose but it was game 1 at home; everyone chill!!!

  28. oh yeah
    i think Nick Fotiu
    needs to visit the team and offer some
    boxing lesson
    or someone!!

    sheesh! watching Newbury get jackhammered last night
    was kinda scary

  29. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    Avery brings his heart and soul to the rink in a sport that is more about passion than almost anything, skill included. It’s his desire that the rangers are missing. The negative aspects of his play are far less than his positives in the overall sum. NY fans love passionate players and have always forgiven both transgression away from the sport and mistakes during games because they want a player that tries hard and cares. This team needs players like Avery.

  30. I’ve been holding off on the Avery stuff. Basically because I like the guy and any negative comment about him around here is considered sacrilegious. But, if the waiving of Sean Avery is going to be used as an excuse not only by the fans but now by guys in the locker room. That’s pathetic. He scored 3 lousy goals last year, 2 at the end of year and was a minus player. If they need Avery to make them safer, tougher, protected, motivated whatever it is… what does that say about the supposed core of this team. If guys like Cally, Dubi, Gabby and dare I say the goalie need him am I to assume they don’t have the necessary tools to lead a team if they need to hide beyond the false bravado of Avery?

  31. >>2) If it is, well … what the hell are we going to watch?

    I’m asking myself that very same question. That’s one reason why I have yet to renew Centre Ice.

    [Heads Up!]

  32. i’ll agree that i can be negative
    but
    i’m not delusional
    and
    i’m not liking a lot of the lack of
    Hockey IQ
    shown by the team

    i know they haven’t had LOTS of practices but
    some things are just so simple
    it boggles the mind.
    ummm….
    –keep shooting pucks at the net cause good things were happening
    –skate a little harder in order to get to the puck
    before your opponent
    –practice your shots on net before or after practice
    so you don’t miss the net or hit the goalie in the chest so often
    –check you opponent
    –move your feet during the pp
    –stop moving from the point to deep into the zone
    and make it easier on your opponent during pp (not to the ‘Rodent but duh!!)
    –cause a screen in front of goalie
    –don’t knock over the goalie
    –maybe even watch video of yourselves on a good night so you can recall
    what you did or watch another team that’s doing well and see what they do that you’re not!

  33. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    If my stash was as lousy as hometown dubi, I would switch to eating paste. He signs a fatty contract and goes out and plays ljke carcillo. Hmmmmmmm like that has never happened in rangers history before.

  34. One comment about the fans at the game on this… the people around me spent more time complaining about Avery not being here, Torts can’t coach (which is laughable), and Sather (which I agree is debatable) but when you call out of the homegrown kids you get a look like you committed treason. Well wait a minute, didn’t Sather draft those guys? If you love the young core so much, can’t hate the guy who brought you them. It’s hypercritical!

  35. I can’t really comment on the crowd noise because I was at home but I can say that I made my wife stop talking and turned up the TV when they were announcing the last few Rangers and I was appalled at how quiet it was for Capt. Callahan (kind of like how quiet it was when he came back to the Garden to accept his award on crutches). Make some noise peeps!

  36. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    Hw – hometown dubi is as stale as heartless ec. Manny, respectfully, I disagree with you completely on Avery. This team looks almost robotic and their play tentative. Retarderella wants a spark plug? Probably wants a penile implant too because the little woody he has now caused him to waive the best spark plug I have ever seen wear a ranger sweater.

  37. I don’t think we disagree Eddie. I was simply saying that Avery isn’t going to come here and win games singlehandedly or anything. He is only going to be able to infuse some energy into that lineup. I think we are mostly on the same page. Unless I misunderstand myself.

  38. Here’s my concerns about this team. Gee, I don’t know. Another very obvious night where the defense showed they will never compete in the NHL. Eminger -3 Erixon -3 Del Zotto (well I’d say he belongs in the AHL but I’d be insulting the natural instincts of AHL defensemen). So while everyone is waiting for Sean Avery, unless he comes back as a puck moving defensemen I’ll be more worried that it takes sometimes 8 to 10 passes just to get out of the zone.

    As great as Hank is, he does have obvious weaknesses. Gets beat high, losses concentration especially at home (not the first that’s happened). Let’s be honest here, he’s won a grand total of 2 playoffs series and has lost 5 including a blown 3-1 to Caps. I understand the team around him wasn’t great but it’s not exactly like he’s carried them either. He’s 15-20 with only a .909 save % and a 2.6 GAA in his playoff life. I worry about him in the big spots.

  39. Rhode Island Ranger on

    What is the effect on morale if the players have reason to doubt the coach’s objectivity in personnel decisions? Obviously, they’re big.

    If we can all see that this lineup lacks energy and edge on the forecheck and yet the coach chooses players that contribute less than nothing in that vital dimension of the game, then, of course, the rest of the squad sees it too. Not a healthy situation.

    Torts might find that ditching the dead wood and admitting an occasional misjudgment to his team behind closed doors would have a very positive effect on the team’s psyche. The best coaches I’ve ever played for or worked with in this sport teach a system that’s right for the players and actually encourage the players to take ownership of the team. But I get the sense that Torts has to be the dominant personality or only real personality in the room to feel confident in his leadership.

    Am I misreading him? Is the Avery banishment the exception to Torts’ otherwise clear-sighted management of personnel? I hope so, but I wouldn’t bet on it.

  40. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    And when are going to stop talking about the red herring, Avery’s 3 goals? His value is not in scoring. His main job may not even be to agitate. It is his passion that and desire which doesn’t show up on a stat sheet. Go back and watch the series against the craps. Avery was the best forward, besides fedtank on the ice fir the rangers. Why he hasn’t been given a chance to play this year is beyond the beyond.

  41. I am waiting patiently for Christensen to be waived; it has to happen. He is a total waste of space out there. Hagelin might need to get some looks as he is playing like a guy possessed in Hartford right now, even Deveaux. Newbury needs to step up more he has the potential to be as productive as Avery (minus his fan favoritism). Why wasn’t Rupp in the line-up? What was the point of signing this guy? Torts needs to stop juggling the lines like it is a god damn circus, that was a big thing I hated with Renney…

    I think maybe the issue with the noise is due to the many seats on each end of the 300’s that were removed for those fancy concourses? Probably the same issue like at Yankee Stadium where its too open now when compared to the old one.

  42. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    That is a good point there, Eddie. Avery was very good in that series.

  43. Again Eddie you are missing the point on this. If that lockerroom and hate to burst all your bubbles on this, but it’s NOT the coach who needs to rile a lockerroom but the leadership of the team that better do it because the coach is never going on the ice to do it for you it says a lot of the young core of this team. Here’s an analogy people won’t like.

    Rangers are the METS!! They have a young core who doesn’t know how to lead or win and they’ve changed managers and GM’s and all the other coaches and guess what they still come up empty. If it doesn’t come from within the core of the lockerroom that it never going to happen. Scotty Bowman or Al Arbour wouldn’t make a difference if Cally Dubi and that goalie need a no-scoring yappy 4th line winger to spark them.

  44. Carp: Your mentioning of Avery in 1/3 of your points about last night’s game sure is generating lots of traffic on here today.

    Good job!

  45. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    Manny – sometimes it is just ONE ingredient or spice that makes the meal unforgettably delicious. Avery is that spice. He could and would make the difference. This team has taken several steps backwards this year and has been vastly overplayed in all but one game so far.

  46. Here we go….come to papa.

    I told you all that Wolsk, Zook, Christensen would flop. One is in the Whale and the other two stink up the joint and add nothing. Newbury got his head handed to him in that fight last night and I am guessing Torts thought it was a selfish time to try and get in a fight then so he benched him. “At least win the fight,” probably went through Torts’ thought process.

    Rupp has a creaky knee and is so-so on hockey skills.

    Gaborik and Richards look lost out there without a wingman.

    Avery will be in NYC before Thanksgiving.

    And Carp you are right on the physicality and I thought the Rangers were just not taking the body as much as they used to. But when you mentioned it, I gotta wonder how much the “Shanahan Police” is affecting things. I was noticing that we are not the physical aggressors we once were. I don’t see the checks being finished. I wasn’t sure how much that was “hit from behind” induced or the Rangers not being quick enough or outright physical enough.

    If we can’t get a W on the board tomorrow, I will start to be concerned. Where the heck is the O?

  47. Rhode Island Ranger on

    Let’s try a little thought experiment (albeit a perverse one):

    Who wins the game (or season series) between the current dynamic Ranger lineup and the feistier Ranger side with Avery and the additional Whale of your choice? Superman Lundqvist will play both ends, though he’ll be happier on #16’s more energetic side. Last twist, no Torts or Sully; the players govern themselves.

    If we had to bet our lives on the outcome (last fiendish condition), is there a single Torts fanatic who’d bet on the EC/WW side?

  48. Doodie Machetto on

    Despite the current food problems at the Garden, Newbury managed to eat plenty of Brown’s fists.

  49. Don’t you all realize that unless Torts is gone for good this Rangers team will suck with or without Avery playing. Richards, Gaborik and Henrik will not carry all the load on their shoulders.
    Torts is a coach with degenerate ideas of changing lines, putting 2 centers and a winger on the same line, etc. His attitude towards the players is also not a great one, so wait till Rangers bump into losing streak ( I hope the earlier in the season the better), Sather will fire this clown, then you all will see what this team is made of and how competitive it will become

  50. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    Hw – stop with the pedantic musings. You are the one that us laboring under several misconceptions. For one, there is NO leadership on this team as I see it. No one is stepping up. This team us playing extremely flat right now and if you don’t see that than we arent watching The same games. For all of the core blah blah blah …. This team is playing heartless hockey. Dubi is cashing his $$$$$$ but I don’t see any effort. Step has regressed. AA invisible. Cally showed a tad more yesterday but clearly inspires no one that I see.

  51. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    The problem with physicality, as I see it, and again my hockey IQ isn’t as high as say, Del Zotto’s but…. I see the Rangers taking the Puck on their back check and taking the man on their forecheck when it should be the reverse.

  52. Doodie Machetto on

    Carp, you should thank your lucky stars that Avery was Whaled. You are going to set a yearly record on traffic.

  53. And guys, Avery is not a goal scorer. He is sandpaper. He is a great passer (21 or 23 assists last year probably ranked him top 5 on the team?) And he plays behind the net and in the corners better than anyone else on the team, IMHO. He can create space for Gabby and Richards. And when Komisarek or Phaneuf take shots at Richards or Gabby, Avery is there to temper that.

    Torts should get off his ego trip and fill the team with better players than Christensen, Wolski, and Rupp.

  54. What I find funny about this is Sean Avery is needed to come back, ignore what he actually did, because of his intensity but the coach who is also intense is a fool. Yeah, that makes sense. So we need a soft coach who tells the players he loves them all but a loud mouth who doesn’t really do anything to spark the team. I GOT IT! MAKE AVERY THE COACH!! geez!

  55. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    I am fine with Avery coming back up and taking say, 86’s place (or 40 or 45 for that matter). I just need either CT or ilb to explain the Cap Space issues with that occurring.

  56. Eddie – you just made my point. There is NO leadership. I get it now. Sean Avery should come back and be the CAPTAIN too!! HA HA HA. I’m not the one with the man crush on a guy who hasn’t done a damn thing on the ice in his career other than ran his mouth.

  57. Rhode Island Ranger on

    HW:

    Don’t overcomplicate this. Avery is simply a better hockey player than EC, WW and the hobbled Ruppster. Hitting, forechecking, agitating and firing up the crowd are vital hockey skills that Torts’ favorite spare parts have never had and will never have.

    We all want the Rangers to be better (and more fun to watch). Torts’ lineup ain’t cutting it.

  58. Stranger Nation on

    HWirth – “Eminger -3 Erixon -3 Del Zotto” spot on – Erixson for the first time this season looked overwhelmed in his own zone. The 3rd pairing with Em was a disaster. MDZ had a poor night – if Sauer was not back it could have been worse.

    This team was built for a tight checking defensive game. If the league takes away the tight checking and best D is hurt, we are hamstrung.

    Boyle and Prust have laid 3 eggs in a row. Concerned they are getting too complacent and living off last year’s performance.

    We need our Line 2 and 3 to outplay the comp or we are hurting.

    Aves is not a difference maker, but to save $$ on him is penny wise and pound foolish given the total payroll picture. And even though Newbury repeatably slammed his chin and cheek into his opponent’s fist, he is an effective 4th line center that does well on face offs, plays the body and makes good decisions in the D Zone – what you want a 4th line center to do at 7 mins a game.

    The Torts line shuffler is a joke. How to get any mojo going if you constantly playing with a new wingman every shift of a 1-1 game?

    But seriously, this is a 7 or 8 seed team that is missing one of its best Dmen – look at Philthy when their top D man got hurt…giving up more points that the eagles

  59. Meanwhile, regarding the lack of ovation for Callahan last night, I was surprised that Joe Tollesen didn’t build up the introduction like he did when Jagr was named captain (I don’t remember if he did it for Drury). Rather, he simply introduced him like any other player, except saying he was the captain.

    One comforting thing…not a single player got booed (heavily) in the introductions. That’s the first time in quite a while!

    And I thought the video tribute MSG did for the former Rangers in the Lokomotiv crash and for Boogaard was really classy. Very well done.

  60. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    even though Newbury repeatably slammed his chin and cheek into his opponent’s fist

    **************

    brilliant

  61. It’s not Torts lineup first of all. There are cap issues involved in this. There are contract issues involved in this that have nothing to do with Torts. This is the problem with Sather ignoring the media. People actually think that Torts is the whole organization because we don’t hear any other voice. Sean Avery at 1.9 was not worth it anymore. He didn’t have a good year last year, period.

    EC – is a placeholder for hopefully someone like a Hagelin to outplay himself in Hartford.
    WW – At 3.8 mil on a walk year will clearly be gone sooner rather than later if this keeps up. They could easily add two full time players at that cap hit. So that’s a mute point.
    Rupp – I think if healthy will be fine.

    So if it’s a matter of Avery over those guys at 1.9 it wasn’t going to matter. He’d be lumped right in. It’s pretty obvious that if Staal is gone long term which looks likely (he hasnt even started skating yet) they clearly need the cap space to make a move to bring in a top tier defensemen.

  62. I cancelled my cable after the playoffs last year, I thought I’d re-up it when the season starts but there’s no point, I only watch Ranger games but these games frustrate me. When the team shows something maybe I will get it back.

    Avery needs to be a 4th liner, he excites the crowd, his 4 mins of icetime can get the other team off their game, whatever he brings is more than our current 12th forward. He sticks up for teammates. The game is really really boring without him. This team is back to being vanilla.

    I’d rather have Redden in the top 6 than what we have. Too bad we are in cap hell to make that happen.

  63. Oh and blame Dubinsky all you want for those penalties. But those calls were…HORRIFIC. Absolutely horrific.

  64. Rhode Island Ranger on

    Avery and a cheap motivated youngster from Hartford makes more hockey sense and costs fewer cents than the energy sinks, EC and WW. And, yes, they are officially Torts’ boys. He didn’t have to announce they were better players than Avery. Everyone in the hockey world knows that Torts has hated Avery since his TSN commentating days. So we don’t have to pretend that he secretly wanted to keep #16.

    Torts needs to swallow his pride and shuffle the team personality. The current hand is weak and deadly boring.

  65. “I’d rather have Redden in the top 6 than what we have.”

    This Homegrown Dubi is making people hallucinate…that what happens when it’s left to dry and get moldy…

  66. “Avery will be in NYC before Thanksgiving.”

    Yeah, and I’m taking Kate Upton to the game on Monday night…

  67. Well, starting off where they left off last year. Lost every game I went to last year. I went last night. Good news! I’m not going tomorrow.

  68. Bring Back Straka on

    Agree with Manny and Rhode Island Ranger on Avery. It comes down to roles on a team. What is EC’s or WW’s role on the 4th line? Come on-give these guys some roles and identity.

    Your scorers score: Gaborik, Richards, Stepan
    Your scorers score: Dubi, AA, Cally
    Your defenders defend: Prust, Boyle, Feds
    Your checkers check: Rupp, Newbury, Avery

    4 lines all with a given role and identity.

    Mix and match (throwing EC or WW on 4th line is a waste of a forward).

  69. “sometimes it is just ONE ingredient or spice that makes the meal unforgettably delicious. ”

    Excellent point, brutha. Simplicity.

  70. 86 and 40 should be arrested when they cash their checks for grand larceny. Give their minutes to the kids who will show effort and desire.

  71. “NY fans love passionate players and have always forgiven both transgression away from the sport and mistakes during games because they want a player that tries hard and cares.”

    MZA skates with passion, as well as elite skill…even though he doesn’t make $4m per year. Sure, he’s small but he’s got the heart of a lion…at least he’s fun to watch….

  72. NYR_FAN

    On the Redden comment. If he was making the fair market value of 3.0 mil and not the insane, not his fault, 6.5 mil he was handed by this organization he’d be playing in there top 4 and probably be just fine.

  73. Sauer, McD, Staal, and Girardi all all better hockey players than Redden at this point in their respective careers. Redden is garbage. He know his days in the NHL are done.

  74. I might be in the minority here, but I was not impressed with the current state of the garden. 1/3 finished seems like an exaggeration. I was in 220, so getting the the “nice” conccourse and the party deck took about twenty minutes. And this is a pretty lame complaint, but you couldn’t buy beer and hot dogs at the same stand. Instead you had to wait in line twice.

    AND THEY RAN OUT OF MUSTARD IN THE SECOND PERIOD.

  75. Can anyone find the definition of “perception” for me? My copy of the Oxford English Dictionary for Clueless English Egomaniacal Ratfaces must be out of date.

  76. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Not having enough Mustard is simply inexcusable. No wonder this team can’t win. They might have enough Jam but they just don’t got enough Mustard!

  77. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Does anybody know what this thing on the bottom of the screen means?

    Bad Behavior *has blocked 4748 access attempts in the last 7 days.*

  78. Stranger Nation on

    I do not relish the idea of having no mustard in the new garden. They better ketchup to the needs of their fans.

  79. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    *Carp* – are you saying you dislike Tarragon or are you making a reference to the “Next Iron Chef” finale that aired two nights ago?

  80. Let’s put it this way, Manny. I rarely go to expensive places, but the Mrs. and I did so in Quebec City, and my entree was, like, $50 … and they put that crap on it. And the next chef that assaults my meal like that without warning is going to meet me behind the restaurant.

    The Bad Behavior thing has been there forever, but now it’s just bolder, I think. It basically means mostly spam.

    Sorry, I forget who said it earlier, but it’s a great point. Having the beer sold separately from the food means you have to stand in two lines. It also means more lines. And maybe that’s why the concourse is more crowded, too.

    Good morning, Sally! I saw somebody who looked like you (even had sassy boots) at the train station last night, and I thought maybe you decided to make a surprise visit to MSG. But she had no nose ring or beard, so I figured you stayed home.

  81. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    I thought maybe the bad behavio(u)r thing was how many times the site blocked a david klein or vinceA from posting. I thought maybe the shineboxed crew was trying to get back in.

  82. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    Ricardo – sometimes sometimes can be a good thing….and yes, sometimes a bad thing. But heartless and passionless is NEVER a good thing and that is what we have in this team.

    Btw, tarragon is excellent in my lobster bisque!!!

  83. i think the main reason the halls are more crowded is, you can no longer walk around inside the arena, so it doubles the outside traffic

    when all the food stands are in, it will be way worse.

  84. that’s right, firetorts. I brought up that point on Thursday. They’ve eliminated one of the main walkways from the lower bowl. So you have to go outside to go around the rink. But the lines were ridiculous, too.

  85. Hey Carp, great points about Avery. I mean I’d obviously place him ahead of more than just those three forwards but whether he should be on the 4th line or the 1st line, this team is clearly faceless without him. It’s this lack of character/identity that makes them even worse than they already are. On a team with hardly any skill players, to just have a bunch of 3rd and 4th liners come out and skate around in circles for 45-50 minutes just isn’t going to cut it at the NHL level. This team is far too willing to just vanish.

    Personally, I’ve seen evidence of skill in Avery superior to most of the players in this lineup (I still think he’s a better skater than every forward other than Gaborik). I don’t doubt he took a step backward last season, but I’m going to keep on saying Tortorella is more to blame in that capacity than Avery. I will also say players like Dubinsky are made worse by Tortorella chucking him into situations where he clearly doesn’t belong. And every year we’ll keep hearing how the team needs to learn his system, and we’ll keep hearing that until they back their way into a playoff spot with 90 points. Maybe his system just doesn’t work.

  86. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Even from a business perspective, it’s crazy to have two lines. If I was in charge of concession stands I would have “impulse” buys at all stands being Beer at the Food Stands and Food at the Beer only Stands. A consumer is going to buy impulse items when they notice another line as long as the one they just waited in. Nobody wants to do that twice. MSG is probably losing sales which means they are losing money which means Dolan is angry which means Carmelo Anthony won’t be happy which will be reflected on La La’s reality show which will hurt VH1 ratings which will hurt Time Warner Cable which will go belly up and terminate its contract with the MSG Channel which might lose a ton of money and have to sell off some Ranger Games which means I won’t be able to watch the Rangers.

    You see the pattern here?

  87. Important new feature in the new 300’s. My seats are in the new 300’s in row A not too far from new writers box. First off, sightlines are 1000% better than old 300’s. You are right on top of the play and no longer lose the corners and are blocked out by the 200’s. Second and most important, each 2 seats in row a have a TV in front of them. For the first time at the Garden, I could actually make out a replay and see what actually happened. Here’s where that helped. Saw a good replay of both non-goals and couldn’t go nuts on ref because they were right calls. However, did see the ridiculous slash of Dubi and knew I was right to get on ref. Loved that feature

  88. HockeymanRangers on

    To me the Rangers have not looked all season even with the games they have won. (that Lundqvist stole) They are not giving it their all and the passing really stinks, no flow at all. Are they for some reason not on board with Trot’s playing style??? Just a thought??

  89. I have never had strong feelings about Torts either good or bad. But they look like such a mess right now that I am starting to have doubts. They are not this bad.
    I would call up MZA and give him a top 6 spot immediately. Offense and power play continues to be a problem. Year after year after year.
    The crowd last night was very quiet for an opening night. It felt like any other late October game against a non-rival. I was really shocked. Even when they were playing well in the 1st there wasn’t much energy.

  90. Rob C., agree, the place would be louder in the second and third if the hockey were better … but on opening night, the noise level right from the introductions and the anthem and the energetic first period was stunningly low.

  91. Carp – Especially where you guys are in new press area you can already see this will have Yankee Stadium feel in that people will stand in back of seats in that walkway area looking over and I think that leads to less noise.

  92. I know the media needs to fill its pages, but I really don’t ever want to hear what the Rangers have to say after they stink up the joint. It’s always the same and it never seems to impact what happens or how they play. It’s lip service to the fans, and masturbatory at best.

  93. See, if people called him Trottierella, that would actually be amusing and show a bit of thought. But we get Totalretard and Turderella instead. Sigh.

    Has anyone noticed that complaints about the concession lines were much fewer when Avery was in the line-up? Hardly seems like a coincidence.

  94. Had a great time at MSG last night despite the pre-game soaking outside and the first period officiating and the final score. Great meeting Carp and ilb and of course Linda for inviting me. Saw Boyle with some hot chick outside MSG after the game. Took all my strength to hold Linda back (I kid. ;)

    CCCP still looking for ya!

  95. Jay Riemenschneider on

    Third star = Ryan Callahan, for going to the net and helping the team score two goals that would have counted in my inline league.

  96. LW, that would be far too offensive and degrading to Trottier, a hall of fame, multi-stanley cup winner, albeit mostly islander.

  97. Ok all getting on my box to talk about the “new” garden. My tickets were in section 219 last night. I had an end seat that was outside the rest of the section not blocking anyones line of sight so I was sitting on the arm rest and the usher came to me and asked me to sit in my seat. She then proceeds to let about 7 people down the aisle and across to their seats during play!! This happened like 5 times during the game. The new black seats in this section, are about 20 seats across so if anyone has to get up, they have to travel to get to an aisle which again, blocks the view of people behind them. That aside, went down to check out the new concourse. I have never felt more like cattle in my life. I agree, they need to remove the cart vendors out of the way. Also, a LOT of the stations were not accepting credit cards last night which was causing HUGE delays on getting anything food or drink. I mean the staff, while some of the nicest people ever, move at a snails pace as it is. I missed 5 minutes of the 2nd period because I could not get through the concourse to get back to my seat. Finally, I was sad to see empty black seats, I hope MSG does not end up looking like the Prudential Center. That is all, thanks for letting me rant! Try the veal, tip your waiter/waitress.

  98. Rupp (knee) and Del Zotto not on ice for practice according Brooks. Oh please someone tell me he’s in a car headed to Charlotte to play an ECHL game to practice not having any on ice instincts.

  99. I loved Sean Avery when he was on his game, but the last thing the Rangers needed last night was #16 on the ice. Just my opinion.

    As for the new Garden (and I’m SHOCKED there aren’t more people chatting about this on here today) here is my immediate opinion: Aesthetically, it is beautiful, but logistically it’s a nightmare. For many years my family has had seats all over the Garden. A few in the 200s, a few in the 300s and a few in the 400s. We always visit each other during intermissions. The new garden makes this virtually impossible. You cannot walk from level to level inside the arena. And because all of the escalators go up, you have to find a stairwell to walk down. You also have to find a stairwell that doesn’t say “no re-entry.” Not easy.

    In addition, the only level that had food last night was the 6th floor concourse. Everybody in the entire arena had to get to the sixth floor for food. We sat in 317 and the only thing on our level was beer, crackerjacks and popcorn. No exaggeration. By the time you got down to the sixth floor, intermission was practically over and the lines were at least 20 minutes long. The new “spacious” concourse was impassable because of the food lines.

    The most frustrating part about this was all of the focus on the new food options at MSG, and then not even being able to get a pretzel or a chicken sandwich. We arrived at 6:00pm. I’m not going to miss the game to stand on a food line. They should have said to fans, “There will be limited concession options until December” instead of talking about all of the wonderful food options. Just poor PR in my opinion. And why not open a few of the stands that are closed and sell pretzels and hot dogs there temporarily?

    I think the place will be beautiful when done. I really do. I just don’t think that they are AT ALL ready for the crowds.

  100. AMEN ROE!! IF there was a fire in that place, it would be a tragedy.
    Carp, I agree it was waaaaayyyyy to quiet an introductions. Maybe it was because no one could figure out how to get to their seats :-)

  101. 4generations 4 cups on

    the Rangers are asking way too much money for all these new renovations rather than having Jim Dolan pull money out of his pocket and put it into the Garden. People are sick of the ridiculous prices for absolutely anything and everything. We all understand what and where it is, but the prices for drinks, food, the concourse space, the empty seats, pretty sad day for the NYR brass.

  102. Did they “transform” the food & concessions at all? Or is the same junk they’ve always served in years past?

  103. The John Tortorella bashing I have to say makes me laugh. Firstly, every coach in the NHL shuffles lines on a regular basis. It’s a natural part of the sport. Find me the coach that doesn’t mix lines and I’ll show you a team on a winning streak. Find that same coach when they lose a couple of games. He’s moving lines.

    2nd – Torts doesn’t know what he’s doing. Ok, here’s a guy who has coached 8+ NHL seasons (counting taking over the NYR late 09). Has made the playoffs 6 times. Won a Stanley Cup on 04. Has had 2 bad teams, the 1st year in TB taking over a time in disarray and his last in TB where his ownership situation was a mess. He took over the Rangers in 09 12-7-2 down the stretch and made the playoffs. I’m sure everyone thought he sucked then taking over for Renney who by the way no one liked either for his line juggling.

    How about we start focusing on the core of this team and stop scapegoating coaches, AHLed big mouths, 3.8 mil soon to be off cap players, 4th liners EC

  104. Rhode Island Rangers on

    Broadway:

    The last time any of us watched #16 in real NHL action (ie. in the Caps series) he was one of the Rangers’ most energetic, physical and effective forecheckers. So, the argument that Torts relegated him to Hartford because he had proven he couldn’t contribute anymore simply doesn’t hold water. A little digging in the RR archives from the playoffs last spring would find that the Avery haters grudgingly admitted his value or simply had the good sense to muzzle their Aversion until this preseason when Torts made it clear that he was banishing Avery in favor of “better hockey players.”

    We’re all really enjoying those “better” players now.

  105. I don’t think this team is as bad as it appears but I also think this team isn’t as good as people think they could be either. The teams that finished behind the rangers last year have obviously improved which is not good for the rangers. I can see the rangers missing the playoffs in the 2011/2012 season. At best finishing in 8th place. Did anyone else notice Brad Richards falling down on the ice last night every time somebody touched him. It almost looks like Richards has bad knees. I wasn’t on board signing Richards who is already 31. That means the rangers paid a hefty long contract where if they are lucky will get 2 years of his prime. Another stupid free agent signing by Sather. I rather see the rangers suck for a few years and actually get top 3 draft picks and get real talent but we all know it ain’t happening. Another year of mediocrity in ranger land.

  106. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    You guys have got to understand that bringing Avery up does not equal wins. It might change some situations over the course of the game but it’s not going to change the overall outcome so drastically.

    I advocated for Sean to get some minutes on the 1st line and if he is up here I think he will play himself both on and off that line – overall though, he’s a 4th liner on most NHL teams. That means he is a role player.

  107. HAHAHA – You guys are funny. Sean Avery made an impact on a playoff series where they were, minus the first two periods in game 4, completely dominated while contributing one lousy assist. I know I know he ran his mouth and intimated the Caps into the quickest first round series last year. WOW! No wonder everyone around here overrates Brandon Dubinsky. Your mouth and confrontations count more than actual production.

  108. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    You know who I feel badly for? Hank. That guy is like Rapunzel – locked in the tower waiting for a cup contending team to come along and help him realize his potential.

  109. I think the possibility of a trade, hanging over the teams head because of the Staal situation isn’t helping.
    Give Boyle a shot with Dubi and Cally.
    Rupp has already scored more big goals than Avery did all last year.
    I’ve never hated Avery, but Avery fans are a cancer. Delusional & destructive and they like to fib all too often (I see he’s down to 4 minutes now)

  110. Manny –

    I don’t know what to think of Hank. It’s actually a much better debate than Sean Avery’s impact.
    Hank has had some shaky playoffs moments himself. Like I posted before, he only has a .909 save % in his playoff career. I’d like to see him trade places with Tim Thomas. They also don’t have a ton of offensive talent but have a great back end with Chara, Seidenberg, Ference, Boychuk. Wonder how’d he fare?

  111. Rhode Island Rangers on

    Manny:

    I agree with you that Avery’s return alone will not be enough to make the Rangers any kind of contender. But, I think it will signal a healthier level of realism and humility from Sather and Torts.

    They need to admit amongst themselves (and implicitly with the team) that EC and WW are mistakes. It will also demonstrate that Torts’ demand for energy and jam from his forwards is more than empty rhetoric.

    The players all understand this better than we do. They need accountability from the coach and management just as much as its needed from them.

  112. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Yea – Thomas is certainly helped out by his incredible defense in front of him. That’s a good conversation to have and it’s a really interesting thing to think about.

    I think you nailed it earlier when you said “focus” because that’s #1 for a goaltender. They can lose it so easily.

  113. Rhode Island…

    You are making way too big a deal about how the players react to management. In fact, and I’ve witnessed this with my own eyes, when the players start blaming management it’s a pretty good sign you have a soft lockerroom. I watched a team get a coach fired because they didn’t like the way he handled players even though he drove them to that organization’s best results in 8 years. That same coach left and won a Stanley Cup and took a second team to the stanley cup finals.

  114. NYR_FAN:
    As of right now, no they haven’t transformed the concessions yet.

    There are a few places where you can get a turkey wrap or a salad. I also saw a coffee and pastry place. However, all of the burger places, the sushi, etc. wasn’t open yet. I do not have a problem with this. My problem is the lack of other options while they are waiting for these places to open. My dinner choices shouldn’t be: 1) popcorn or 2) crackerjacks.

  115. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    You know HWirth – My analysis of T. Thomas is that once you get him moving side-to-side he’s very vulnerable because his save style is “spectacular.” Get him moving and you can find holes to put the puck through. I don’t know how that would play with the Rangers looser defense.

  116. Rhode Island Rangers on

    DD and HW:

    Just curious. How many times during the playoffs did you call for Avery to be scratched? I’m just guessing here, but I’m pretty sure the archives would reveal that you didn’t even once.

    By the way, calling Avery fans a “cancer” on a Rangers blog in the midst of these early season doldrums for a team with little spark, forechecking pressure or personality is silly.

    Avery and a motivated kid from Hartford should replace WW and EC immediately.

  117. Manny – I totally agree. Great example of that was the come from behind win the NYR put on him late last season.

  118. This just in:

    Rangers players have signed a petition to bring Avery back and are prepared to walk out.
    Richards to have MRI on knee, ligament tear suspected.

  119. They could replace Christensen with nobody and be better. And Ken Gernander could come out of retirement and play ahead of Wolski.

  120. Rhode Island Rangers on

    HW:

    As an old player and coach myself, I can tell you that hockey players aren’t robots. If a critical mass of players loses faith in the coach’s judgment and fairness, the most talented team in the world will sink like a stone.

    If the coach demands jam but coddles creampuffs, he’ll lose the room. Tortorella and Sather are in danger of just that if they require the team to carry EC and WW’s luggage much longer.

  121. Rhode Island –

    Truthfully, I didn’t like it and it actually changed that series, but I understood Torts benching Avery for Game 5 up 3-1 vs. Caps the first time. He took two ridiculously bad offensive zone penalties in that game while the team besides was dominating play.

    Last year, he was irrelevant to me. He was a non factor for the majority of the season so I couldn’t careless one way or the another.

    By the way DD is right about the “cancer” (don’t love the word but..) remark. Fans using scapegoats and blaming things that aren’t on the ice shows a lack of knowledge of a fan base.

    Again WW and EC are place fillers and irrelevant until they the trade market opens up. I promise you Rhode Island they won’t be here at the end of the season.

    The ONE and ONLY reason this team is off to a bad start is the core was given the money and position to take over the team and they are off to a BEYOND BRUTAL start.

  122. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Crucial Update: My Co-worker / Office Mate waited until 12:30 p.m. to get his lunch. Once again, he opted for the McRib Value meal which, if you SuperSize it you get an additional McRib for $1! Thus he has: 2 McRibs, 1 Extra Large Fries and 1 Gigantically sized Coca-Cola.

  123. Rhode Island –

    Be the New Jersey Devils post height of Brodeur-Stevens-Neidermayer era. Keep firings coaches, don’t blame the players, don’t worry about the personnel. See how that works out for ya. By the way, when the fire Torts and bring in the next guy and Dubi, Artie, Cally and co. don’t take over the team, then what?

  124. Doodie Machetto on

    Carp, I’m gonna be there early on Monday. I’d offer to buy you a club soda, but I think I’d have to get on line from now. Either way, would it be OK if I stopped by the swank new Press Box?

  125. Got bad news for the Torts haters. The odds of Torts getting fired being hired by another team and winning a CUP are much better than a team that is supposed to be led by Dubi, Cally, Anisimov, Staal-Girardi as a top D pair winning a CUP.

  126. Doodie Machetto on

    It’s easy to say fire the coach. It’s much harder to name his replacement. To all of the “Fire Torts” types: who should his replacement be? If you pick anyone from within the organization, i.e., Mike Sullivan, Ken Gernander, JJ Daigneault, you will get exactly the same style of play, except a different guy answering questions at the end of the game.

    So who should the replacement be?

  127. Doodie, Noberries fights like Voros, but he doesn’t skate and fall like Voros. It’s a shame we never had “fall down” night at the Garden, in honor of Voros. Instead of “the wave”, everyone can fall down.

  128. Doodie Machetto on

    Anisimov took over Voros’ falling down job. That’s why we need him back: It’s taken two players to replace him.

  129. Rhode Island – By the way, if the players dislike Torts that’s pretty sad since instead of calling them out publicly in Edmonton and at the Coliseum late last year, he choose to blow off media. I could think of about 15 NHL coaches I’ve been around that would have called guys out by name and taken players out. The coach last night even refused to say Hank had a bad game when he clearly did, so if they still have a problem with him they should look in the mirror.

  130. Last night’s game was boring. I don’t care if Avery wins them the game or not, I just want to see entertainment. For sure him and Komisarek and him and Phaneuf may have had some interesting exchanges to make it interesting.

  131. Rhode Island Rangers on

    HW:

    Glad we agree that Torts’ egomania (benching Avery and then himself) cost the Rangers that series with the Caps three years ago.

    As for this year, you might be right that the core is faulty. But, that can’t be replaced overnight. Torts’ gutless first-choice spare parts (EC and WW) must be.

    And claiming that personnel decisions and the players’ perceptions of coaching judgment are irrelevant and show a “lack of knowledge” in the fan base is silly. Who’s on the roster and Why matters to the players and to us.

  132. Wicky©Is staal out for the season yet?? on

    morning ILB and all!!

    Apparently there was a mic behind the rangers bench last night and in the 3rd picked up a convo from the players during a timeout…here’s the transcrpt

    brich “gabby and feds, we need to bear down a bit”

    feds” what, i’m on a different line” from four spots away on the bench

    brich looking to his left” right feds?”

    WW looking to his right at brich”umm wolski, the hot tub guy”

    brich”oh, ummm ok” looks to right”gabby did you know about this?”

    cally, realizing brich is looking at him and calling him gabby”ummm brad, it’s me cally, the “C” on my chest, you know for callahan”

    brich”where the hell is gabby?”

    gabby”down here, on a line with ummm….well…”

    brich”should we be on a line together for a while to develop some chemistry?”

    dubi interrupting”dude you don’t like me as a linemate?”

    brich”we are on a line together, I didn’t even know you were playing?”

    dubi”ummm…”

    EC “dubi, you are homegrown talent, you get to play no matter what…damn there I go again, no filter”

    dubi”oh that’s right, good to know, on my way to the bank, later fellas”

    asst coach sullivan”sure”

    mdz sitting on bench head down and fingers crossed whispering “I hate hartford I hate hartford”

    brich”so who the hell is on my line now?”

    torts yelling from down the bench”brad, shut up you will be back with vinny and marty in a couple more shifts……obrien, get out there and give me some jam on the blueline…these fans in tampa suck!!”

    brich”what coach?”

    cally”so the “C” is for callahan right?”

    torts”brandon, get back out there” as Prust hops on the ice “no not you the one who plays with heart”

    Prust”coach, he left and went to the bank”

    torts”ok, you go ahead, but if you make a single mistake you are on the bench”

    torts”marty get out there on LW with brad”

    torts”brad, get out there, this is YOUR line”

    brich”what? since when?”

    torts”I just made it up, get with the program you overpaid bum!!”

    brich hopping over the boards to a line of Prust on his RW and marty biron on his LW. “well at least I took less money to sign here and the consistency is great”

    sully”hey john, you sure that is what you want to try next?”

    torts”sure, you don’t need to know your linemates, chemistry is way overrated”

  133. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    LOL and other acronyms Wicky. Wow. A Regular Henrik Ibsen over there

  134. Yeah, Artie trying to be Voros is screwing up his game. It’s just too much for him to handle.

    It’s bad enough that NYR embarrassed themselves last night, but the worst part is they did it in front of Kate Upton. Losers!

  135. Carp,

    1) Avery clearly should be on this team that is a given.

    2) Would he make much of a difference? Not much especially under Torts because he will not get many minutes. The other thing is the way the are calling penalties he would be in the box after almost every shift. Is he better than a few people on the roster? – No doubt!!

    3) Team is not showing the grit it showed last year.

    4) Get anything you can for EC and WW.

    5) I hate to belabor this but the officiating has been dreadful. They are going to ruin this great sport if they take out contact and bumping. No stick lifting? Stick touches the hands of an offensive player is a penalty?? Snow shower is a penalty??? WTF!

    Does anybody know which of the two REFS made THAT ridiculous call?

    5) New Garden is what it is – “All about the money” Other than better sightlines and a few more few food options – i am sure I will feel that I could take or leave after my first visit.

  136. Rhode Island.

    Don’t put words in my mouth, I never called Torts an egomaniac cause I don’t think he is. I actually think he’s a very good coach and runs a tight ship. As I said, I understood at the time why he benched Avery. It’s a second guess to say it cost them the series.

    Again, the teams where they whine about personnel moves are usually ones that don’t go anywhere. Again, I watched a coach, in person, who was backstabbed by a team leave win a CUP and then go to the finals with a second team. You are overrating the impact of 4th line decisions to a lockerroom. Teams are about their core, everyone else is a bit player. Wanna watch this team really react. Bench Dubinsky Saturday, then report back to me on how they respond.

  137. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Greg – we apparently might have to trade Christensen and Wolski for a boatload of mustard. Apparently the Garden ran out last night.

  138. I don’t dislike Torts and I don’t comment too often but I think it is time the Rangers hire a Power Play coach. Most coaching staffs have more than one assistant don’t they?

    If not then maybe it is time for Sullivan to go…(I always see him drawing up the plays)

    I also am tired of not getting a full 60 minute effort out of the team every game. I have noticed this for a few years now. I watch the game and almost feel like they could care less if they win or not.

  139. “Not much especially under Torts because he will not get many minutes”

    LMAO! Okay, so if Avery had as much minutes as guys like Butt-Chin, Malkin, Kovalchuckles, Giroux, Tavares, etc, how would he play, what would he do? Please, Greg, answer this question honestly.

    Hahaha!

  140. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Don’t we have Benoit Allaire as a Goaltending Coach / Assistant Coach? Didn’t we bring in Messier last year to help with PP and Faceoffs?

    (I am asking – not criticizing Chopper)

  141. Doodie Machetto on

    “Greg – we apparently might have to trade Christensen and Wolski for a boatload of mustard. Apparently the Garden ran out last night.”

    It totally did. I got like the last packet in the entire arena. Some old woman went to a different floor to find it for me. She came back with 6 packets and said that’s all they had left, anywhere.

  142. Rhode Island Rangers on

    HW:

    Coaches who put their egos ahead of team interests (as in the Caps series three years ago you correctly analyzed) are rightfully called egomaniacs. Coaches who can’t handle vigorous questioning from the press also suggest egomania. Coaches who belittle players to the press while demoting them betray signs of egomania.

    Perhaps Torts can turn himself around with some intervention from friends like you. I hope so for the team’s sake.

  143. Wicky©Is staal out for the season yet?? on

    carp
    excellent recap about the game, and quiet honestly well said about avery!

    orr
    we have fall down night every night with huginsky

    so about the game..

    great first period compared to the rest

    the first non goal was bogus and should have been counted, the second was a good call and no goal was correct.

    the refs from the winnipeg game called a great game I thought, the ones from last night, well can you say PANSIFICATION and if the league is going to continue to be officiated like that, then pre lockout rules should be reinstated ASAP!!

    shanny is ruining the game with his fines/suspensions

    mdz is bad, sorry folks.

    although we kinda suck for home openers and I am not pushing the panic button, the coach needs to get a grip on his team and make the right decisions. All the moves he seems to make look like panic moves to me and his ability to motivate the team seems to be gone.

    On that note, huginsky. If you are a guy who goes out and contributes and tries like hell every shift, and makes an occasional mistake and gets benched yet huginsky really doesn’t contribute much on the positive side and makes a lot of mistakes, but doesn’t get benched….how would you react/perform? What if you are one of the two top offencive players and find time on the pine and contribute much more scoring than he does and you still sit and he doesn’t? Good thing they are all professionals

    I am beginning to think torts is a bit overrated (similar to some of our homegrown talent).

    but what do I know, he is the coach.

    We are 3-5 and the bruins are 3-6 so it isn’t the end of the world folks!!

  144. Manny, I am not sure about Messier but Allaire seems to be doing his job. If Messier helped with the PP then it’s a good thing he is working the GM side of the house and not the coaching….

  145. Maybe it’s time to break up Callahan and Dubinsky. People keep suggesting who should play with them. Maybe it’s time Dubi heads down, and Cally and AA play with someone else. RC and BD don’t need to be together all the time. It’s not working so far.

  146. based on the lines in today’s practices (if they hold up by opening faceoff)
    EC was centering Gabby
    w/ Richards playing with Dubi and Cally
    Artie is now on 4th line

    i’m guessing it’s an attempt at balance throughout lineup
    we’ll see

  147. Chopper – I think you make a great point. I think that’s a much more fair knock on Torts than this baby locker room nonsense. At some point, they should look to add an offensive minded Assistant Coach to help with the power play. Obviously, I think personnel is more of the issue but it certainly couldn’t hurt to add a third body to the coaching staff. Heck, we watched a team in Toronto last night that uses 3 assistant coaches let alone 1.

  148. BroadwayRoe — very well said. I’m surprised this isn’t the main point of interest on here, but I suppose most people watched from home. The game was a nightmare, whether it be the product on ice or what was happening in the stands. This is a blatant slap in the face to a very loyal fanbase; as pleasant and helpful as the MSG staff was last night, the overall level of information presented was dreadful. How about a sign on the big board apologizing for limited access? All the usual food huts were closed in the 400s and they basically funneled everyone up to the West Balcony; sure it’s a nice amenity but all in all it’s just another major inconvenience. I stood in line for a hot dog and a pretzel at the WB for 15 minutes — and that was DURING play, so one can only imagine the chaos during an intermission. I don’t mind standing around near the Shake Shack and Blue Smoke at Citi Field because, let’s be honest, it’s baseball, but there are only 60 short minutes of action in a hockey game — AND maybe only 15-20 of which are scoring chances, saves or fights (too generous?). The bathrooms have always been a disaster, so you’d think that particular aspect would be the focal point, but as usual, it’s three urinals and an out of order sh*tter for every 3,000 fans in a given section. That was my third home opener and most definitely my last, sorry for the bitterness but MSG, and the Rangers, clearly just winged it last night. More than $250 down the toilet — and I didn’t even get any beers at the game! I’ll give the renovation its two years but in the meantime I’ll take being 20 rows from ice level at the Coliseum for $20. You know your overall experience was poor when the best thing you come away with is the free T-shirt. BOO, HISS!!

  149. again
    i think Torts
    keeps EC around because it gives him options
    and he keeps hoping that enough of that
    EC “brilliance” will pop up at some point
    and/or makes its mark during a skills competition

  150. Doodie Machetto on

    “Artie is now on 4th line”

    Artie started last night on the 4th line too.

    MDZ missed practice with a hip flexor issue.

  151. Carp, you mentioned the World Series game last night, I remember the Game 7 Yanks Red Sox game where Aaron Boone hit the homer in extra innings to win it. I turned down tickets to that game and attended the Ranger opener and I believe it was a 0-0 tie. (Worst opener I ever saw)

  152. Rhode Island –
    I actually thought Avery should get a chance based on the previous playoff series against the Caps.
    IMO though his play was hardly as you’ve described in last years playoffs and I don’t understand the relevance of me wanting him scratched or not- then.
    People ignore the majority of games where Avery did absolutely nothing. Of course that’s because he only played 3 minutes a game.
    They get all excited because he’ll yap it up after a whistle or sucker punch someone like it was some tremendous positive.
    Most Avery fans care about their short term fix of Jerry Springer/pro wrestling type of entertainment. There’s a big picture here.
    Avery was not in the teams plans past this year anyway. Money is being saved on a fringe roster spot. Hopefully those other spots will be refilled sooner rather than later.
    Avery fans seemingly want the Rangers to do poorly, and will do anything to associate the lack of early success with his absence.

  153. I think that since MSG also carries the Sabres, I can watch them going forward and actually see a hockey game being played. That was a toal one-sided event. For Torts and Cally to claim the first period was anything but ok is just buying air time. They play with the puck at the blue line, dont get the puck deep, and dont take shots when they should! We made the Leafs look like the 84 Islanders (there, said it) –

    So far, this team has been a fuster cluck. Major, major changes need to be made to address this issue and the team. I sure am glad HBO is taping the team right now … I am sure this will make for great TV time come December.

  154. I don’t see how Tort’s constant line juggling has any chance of allowing any chemistry to form between lines…its just stupid.
    I’d rather see the lines set and stick with it for 10 games. Let chemistry form…geez!
    There is no chance that chemistry is going to form between Richards and Gaborik if they aren’t playing together.
    There is no way the Dubi, Cally, Arty line can get back to what they had if they don’t play together.
    Why is Stepan on the 4th line? Leave him on the 1st…what 3 games is all he gets?

  155. Doodie Machetto on

    I didn’t like breaking up Richards and Gaborik last night. I thought Gaborik had an excellent first period and was invisible once they were split.

  156. HWirth
    +1
    So much is made about 4th liner with big mouth.
    If he is the savior we in deep trouble.

  157. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Christensen has provided options for Jersey numbers recently. He also provides options for guys to blame and/or scrath and/or bench

  158. Mister Delaware on

    Someone not being a savior doesn’t mean that someone can’t make a difference. And people caring too much about recalling a 4th liner doesn’t mean they’re wrong that the 4th liner should be recalled.

  159. Wicky©Is staal out for the season yet?? on

    even torts admits line changing is bad—> umm DUH!!! Jackwagons!!

  160. Wicky©Is staal out for the season yet?? on

    huginsky needs to find a spot in the pressbox for a game!

    I always thought the “pack line” was a bit overrated IMHO (look back at old posts if you don’t believe me).

  161. Staal Wart

    EC “options”
    glad i gave you a good laugh today.

    my option for him would be CT or elsewhere
    just one of too many headcases on the team

  162. Too bad in order for us to win Hank has to be super human.
    Same problems every year. No power play , not enough shots, dumb penalties,
    And really – Newberry, Christiansen & Wolski over Rupp & Avery ?
    And Carp, you’re right on about Cally

  163. Shoot the puck, Barry on

    I’m surprised no one mentioned the “A” that Girardi now has… Doesn’t bode well for Staal’s return. And I think his absence is a major factor here. Probably one of the Top 10-15 defensemen in the league… Interesting that they gave the A to Girardi– in the preseason I would have said Dubi, but Girardi does deserve it.

    Avery talk is nonsense. More significantly, we will probably see Hagelin or some of the other young guys up if we don’t start scoring. Need someone to go with Richards and Gabby, no?

    I’m going to give this another couple of weeks before I make any grand assessments of this team.

  164. Manny! Were you wearing your Borsalino last night? And did you get to meet Carp and the other ‘heads?

  165. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    I did meet some heads before the game and they more than exceeded the expectations and hype! Hoo Rah!

    Barry – great point. I forgot to mention it. I saw it when they introduced him and I said, out loud and to myself – He deserves it. And he really does. But it does not bode well.

  166. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    hahahaha I am fine with that. His quote is so awesome! Anything beats Mannholio

  167. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    I remember his first fight in the NHL which I believe was during his first game and he threw punches crazy fast and I thought – wow this kid’s got jam/mustard. I took it all back. Wow he got pummeled.

  168. Wicky©Is staal out for the season yet?? on

    orr
    I’m in a nailbiter in his league right now!!

    In the other league I’m handing it to….eddiex3 I think

    manny is getting beat by mama…LOL!!

  169. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    the overwhelming amount of positivity here will have to finally meet the negative expectations of this underperforming team. They lack speed, creativity, and finesse. They don’t seem to want to grind it out or play tough…they did that all last year..that style of play can only be done for so long. Our main assets are deteriorating…sell them now as if they were mortgage backed securties and you were the Bear Stearn’s CEO.

    Fiscally sound,
    Bob

  170. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Oh hahahaha so flippin’ funny Wicky! So funny! You keep teasing. I will make a comeback. @Mark my words@

  171. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    manny, noberry stil threw a ton of fast punches..he just kept getting tagged mientras.

  172. That “fight” last night summed up most of the changes that took place in the off-season. It was an embarrassment and a major buzz-kill.

  173. Wicky©Is staal out for the season yet?? on

    i was a bit surprised that prust didn’t go with brown at some point after that!

    if rupp wasn’t injured he would have been in the lineup

    rupp has more goals than huginsky at this point

  174. Yeah, and Brown adds insult to injury by also scoring a goal! Oh, the misery…………

  175. Wicky©Is staal out for the season yet?? on

    also a bit surprised that prust hasn’t seen time on the first line with brich and gabby

    or rupp

    or mickey mouse

    or dylan mcilrth

    or marty biron

  176. Wicky©Is staal out for the season yet?? on

    We are not gritty enough on d to keep other teams physically intimidating players/4th liners form scoring

  177. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    nyr_fan, take my wife, please! #hennyyoungmanthebest

  178. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    wicky, you are too positive on this team…temper those expectations, brother…

    Tempestuously,
    Bob

  179. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    Marty Biron too busy grooming horses and using twitter..he has no time for the Rangers. In fact, the Rangers are a major impediment to the nurturing of his horses.

    Neighfully,
    Bob

  180. So, tomorrow the Sens come to town with Konopka- I wonder whose aasen he will kick on Saturday afternoon?

  181. Newbury was getting jackhammered so badly last night
    that i thought at some point
    his head was going to pop up
    ala rock em sock em robots

  182. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Bob – you are quickly walking your way straight into my heart (blog-style obviously)

  183. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    wicker, no worries, bro…just looking at for you!

    You have a friend in Des Moines,
    Bob

  184. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    Manny, what be that I do that endears me to you in a no-not-that-there-is-anything-wrong-with-it sorta way?

    Gleefully,
    Bob

  185. Chris F is right. Dubinsky and Callahan should be split up. Dubinsky is a third line player. Boyle’s not much better but I think he’s the more serviceable of the two, so stick him on line 2. You can’t worry about keeping guy like Brandon Prust on Ruslan Fedotenko as part of a fixed unit when the team can’t score goals. You’re not getting enough out of borderline 4th liners to justify them as the only set line on the team.

  186. Rhode Island Rangers on

    Jimbo:

    Don’t you know? If the Rangers just ignore the mean kids on Ottawa, the Sens will get bored and sad and the Rangers will overwhelm them with speed, skill, outside-the-box coaching brilliance, and goaltending from skaters without all that expensive goalie equipment.

  187. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    No, bob. Nothing wrong. It’s terrific. Keep on signing those posts. We need more characters around here.

  188. Chopper, I covered that Aaron Boone game.

    I completely disagree that Dubinsky is a third-line player. He is, should be, and will be a perfectly legit second-liner.

    As for this notion that Torts’ demotion of Avery and constant line shuffling has cost him anything in the lockerroom or among any faction of his players is ridiculous. Laughable. That’s how he coaches. A lot of coaches do.

    I’ll say it again, IMO — and I know the guy since 1999-2000, and I see a lot of what goes on behind the scenes, and he makes a lot of sense when he is in the mood to talk — the guy is a very good coach, maybe the best they’ve had since Fred Shero (the first one I covered), and an excellent teacher.

    To think he’ll be out of here any time soon is asinine.

  189. What a pathetic display in the last 40 mins. Lets be honest here they have zero offense. Dubi and cally are not consistent enough to score on a nightly basis. Richards looks lost but it’s only 8 games in. Michael del zaster is nothing more then an ahl player. The kid stinks and I am being nice.

    New season same crap players. What this team needs is to bottom out and get a top 5 pick otherwise here we go again scoreboard watching all through April.

    The garden in the 300 level is an even worse disgrace then the team.

  190. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    I also disagree. But I do love that nickname and will use it in jest the same way I use “McBust”

    I think Del Zaster had a baby step regression last night but I don’t think it was anything major. The game before he took a giant leap forward.

  191. Continuing the drum beat for our man Carp…

    Does seem like Carp has been around the joint more, which is a good thing RT @Zimm94: @stevezipay which happens first: Avery returns, or Carp returns to the beat full-time?

  192. I don’t feel that we can be talking about gains and regressions on a game by game basis. If we did that with every player on the roster…

    Oh, wait. This is RR. Nevermind!

  193. Question: Say Avery bought his own ticket @ MSG and sat in with the crowd like he used to, and the fans flocked to him like moths to a porch light and chanted his name. Could the organization just fire him? Imagine Sather pressing charges for trespassing, lead out in handcuffs even though he bought his own ticket? He has to know he’s at the end of his career but he’ll always have his restaurants and fashion to fall back on.

    Ah the things that creep into my head on a day off.

  194. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    Oh Latona – the lunch warden – my co-worker ate the exact same thing as yesterday – a McRib value meal. He super sized it so that he could get the extra sandwich for $1 more. Here it is in list form:

    1 Extra Large Container of French Fries
    1 Extra Large Coca-Cola
    1 Large Iced Tea (McDonald’s Sweet Tea)
    2 McRib sandwiches

    This is, of course, in addition to the lunch he brought from home that he ate slight before 11:00 A.M. today.

  195. Interesting. The other day I think you mentioned that your firm deals with environmental law, and you have marine life for a co-worker.

  196. Avery is still under contract – I don’t think they can “fire” him – maybe they could ban him from the building, but geez, that would be weird!

    Anyway, he’s assigned to the Whale – isn’t he supposed to be playing up there!?

  197. Manny - Only Europeans and soft guys wear visors on

    GOOD one Latona! Speaking of Marine life and the CT Whale…….

    *****************************

    George: I got about fifty-feet out and then suddenly the great beast appeared before me. I tell ya he was ten stories high if he was a foot. As if sensing my presence he gave out a big bellow. I said, “Easy big fella!” And then as I watched him struggling I realized something was obstructing his breathing. From where I was standing I could see directly into the eye of the great fish!

    Jerry: Mammal.

    George: Whatever.

  198. Flyer fans did a LOT of whining this summer, what with the Richards, Carter, and Carcillo moves.

  199. Seriously, a lot of fans lamented the leaving of Carcillo – they nicknamed him “car-bomb”….lovely fans, they are….

  200. I didn’t forget about him, and after last night’s game, I’ll bet lots of Philthy fans would like to forget him, but he’s “the future”…… ;-D

  201. I was having the same thought as Orr (which is disturbing enough in itself), except I was equating someone like Scott Hartnell to Avery, rather than Carcillo. (In truth, generous to Avery, but far too harsh to compare him to Carcillo.)

    If Flyers fans started unfurling banners and opening protest Twitter accounts due to a 3rd/4th liner being cut, however popular the player, we’d be LMFAOing (it’s a word – look it up) at them non-stop. And the outside reaction to last night seems more to be “Aren’t the Rangers fans dumb?” rather than “Aren’t the Rangers stinking this year?”

  202. >>>I was having the same thought as Orr (which is disturbing enough in itself)

    OUCH!!!!

    Hartnell, for all his faults, is a pretty effective player – he actually scores some goals and can play the game…

  203. Atta boy, Tony.

    Re: carcillo, cooke, hartnell and bryzgalov … watch the language.

    LW (Felicity), I think the “ing” goes after the L.

    And, yes, the rest of the NHL is LTFAOing over the Rangers’ fans man-love for Avery.

  204. Of course Car Bomb appears to be spending some time alongside Patrick Kane et al (on the ice rather than in some sleazy club), so that’s just more ammo in the Avery fan club’s giant cannon.

  205. Duly noted, Carp. You could be a journalist if you weren’t so biased in your devotion to the clueless egomaniacal ratface.

  206. YOUR ATTENTION PLEASE! CHANGES IN THE RANGERS LINEUP.
    NOW PLAYING RW, SEAN AVERY, LW, SEAN AVERY, CENTER SEAN AVERY, LD SEAN AVERY, RD SEAN AVERY, GOALIE, SEAN AVERY.
    WHATS THE SCORE BOYS, WHAT DID SEAN AVERY DO, WHAT WITH RANGER HOCKEY TODAY!

  207. Not to go off-topic, but that new Beavis and Butthead was hilarious. Their patter on the Twilight crap and Jersey Shore was great.

  208. Rhode Island Ranger on

    Carp:

    Pretty sure the rest of the NHL finds the current Ranger lineup much funnier than any stubborn blueseat “man-love” for #16.

    Since EC and WW can’t scrape up a full Y chromosome between them, we’ll grudgingly have to call Torts’ fascination with them a traditional heterosexual fantasy.

    Seriously, though, in your next heart-to-heart with the best Rangers coach since Lester Patrick, ask The Teacher straight up if he still thinks his two blow-up dolls are simply “better hockey players” than the banished one. If he doesn’t finish you off with a water bottle, it’s express lane to the Pulitzers for you.

    Still like your game review!

  209. Thanks, RIR.

    Question, off topic. Whom do I believe? Weather.com (weather channel’s site) says we’re in for 10-15 inches of snow and high winds tomorrow night. Accuweather, for example, says rain and snow mix, little or no accumulation.

    WTF?

  210. Rhode Island –

    What is your fixation on the 12th and 13th forward spot on this team? Guess what, even if the evil Tortorella had kept Avery at 1.9 mil (because you do understand there is a salary cap in the NHL and player value goes hand in hand with dollar value) that he would be rotating in and out of the lineup and was not going to be considered a regular until he earned it through production not annoying the other team with dumb comments. At 1.9 mil, EC is cheaper at $925K to be in the same role. It’s actually that simple because guess what with Avery in the lineup Erixon would still have to be in Hartford.

  211. If you want to simply break this down. The reality would have been had Avery stayed and with Sauer and Staal hurt, Avery would have been sent down anyway to make room for Erixon, unless of course you’d rathered Woywitka and Bell over Erixon for the West coast road trip.

  212. Rhode Island Ranger on

    HW:

    Run these numbers:

    EC and WW out. #16 and another kid from Hartford with heart go in.

    Cup contenders? No. Grittier and more fun to watch. Yes.

    Works for me and the blueseaters. Join us.

  213. Hey if want a player at $1.9 mil for “fun” that does nothing but talk and fight and act stupid I’m pretty sure we could bring Donald Brashear back too.

    I’ll take that waste of cap space and place it in my back pocket for when they need it along with the WW 3.8 in order to add a real asset. That’s how 2011 NHL works. Players are dollar values and 3 goals, some trash talking, and occasional rah rah for the team for 1.9 mil didn’t add up.

    Yes, WW is a waste at 3.8 and that will be settled when they need it but to lower his value by sending him through waivers and then AHL lowers his value. A 3.8 expiring contract could become valuable if he starts to produce and can be used to bring back another contract another team doesn’t want but we may need (ie: a package for his priced contracted defensemen)

  214. Please someone help me out.

    anyone interested in taking my pair of tix section 330 aisle seats $120 face value.

    my son got sick and it was suppose to be his first game at 8 months.

    can take paypal and email tix. let me know

  215. I’ll give an example of WW point. His 3.8 is expiring open cap space for next year. Winnipeg has 6 offensive minded defensemen and are looking for some toughness. So, they might be willing to take a flyer on WW and his 3.8 for remainder of season in order to open space for next year if NYR threw in a Sauer in order to bring back a guy Enstrom or Hainsey who have 2 years left a 3.7 and 4.5 respectively.

    This is not a trade proposal but an example of how trades can work in 2011. It’s how we got Wolski in first place. Saved 1.2 for this year and 5 mil cap space for next.

  216. 4generations 4 cups on

    Sauer for Enstrom or Hainsey? Have you paid attention to how either of these players have preformed during their time in ATL/WPG? Ron Hainsey has been on the steady decline whereas Tobias Enström has been a top-flight offensive defenseman in the LEAGUE with a 10g/41a season. Guys like that get top-flight money– look at Christian Ehrhoff for a direct example for those numbers into dollars.

    If we wanted to turn a trade with the Jets for a guy like Enstrom and drop Wolski at the same time we’d be looking at giving a roster player, a good guy in the system and a pick, hoping for Enstrom and another roster player back in return would be a best chance scenario.

  217. >>>blueseat

    Hey, are there any blue seats in MSG any more? With all the renovations, did they at least keep one vestige of the old-days fan experience by keeping those nosebleed seats blue?

    Those are mostly the ones that I inhabited back in the stone ages….

  218. 4 cups… That’s the point. You get them to take the Wolski contract. Yes you have to add talent to that like a Sauer/McIIrath/Del Zotto whoever they like plus yes a high draft to get back a player like Enstrom who had 51 points last year which by the way would have placed him 2nd on the team.

    If your saying the NYR wouldn’t trade Wolski, a top pick, and a guy liked I name for Enstrom (a proven player) your nuts or overrating your own prospects. As for WPG, they do it because they clear the contract open up more space to sign their own guys/add a free agent plus get a contract player and a top pick.

    Want another example – Nashville just traded Cal Oreilly, a center they liked, to PHX for a 4th rounder. Y? PHX needs a center since they banished Turris. Nashville needed all the extra space they can get to try to sign Suter, Weber and Renne.

    The point is trades now in cap space era go beyond just saying is player A better than Player B.

  219. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    RIR – you are a kindred spirit, mate. I stood up last season with and will continue to do so.

    HW – what is YOUR fascination with those that want Avery on the team? How can you with a straight face say that ec and ww are better than Avery and Haglen?

  220. Eddie – I’ve yet to say they were better players. Although, Wolski has much more upside than Avery since he was a 50 pt. player with Colorado. All I’ve talked about is his cap space value and 1.9 mil for Avery doesn’t make sense. EC at $925K until someone outplays their stay in Hartford (which is what i said before) made more sense to start season. Hagelin, the overhyped MZA, Bourque were clearly not ready out of camp which is why EC is a space filler (said that already too). And WW – well see previous post on why they need to keep him in NHL and not Hartford.

    The only obsessions around here are the usually under 30 yr. old NYR fans man crush on Avery

  221. Wolski was more than a 50 point player, his career high is 65 points in 2009-10.

    He just needs to be given a real opportunity to play and not Prucha’d if he has a bad game. He is useless playing with Boyle and Prust. He should be playing on the top 2 lines or not at all…

  222. Oleo – I apologize, your right. I forgot to add the numbers together when checking his stats on hockeydb.com

  223. Statistically speaking, Wolski and EC bring more to the table than Avery. The only thing Avery does that they don’t do is hit.

    On the flip side, he’s a giveaway machine, takes dumb penalties, yada, yada, yada.

    I don’t care aboot any of them. Fugg ‘em all!

    Go Oilers!

  224. I brought it up the other day, Slats should take a chance on Kyle Turris. You just never know. I’m not going to act like I know everything aboot the kid, I don’t, but from what Yotes fans say, Tippet gives him the Renney/Prucha treatment.

    Can’t blame him for wanting to get traded, and now wanting any part of that garbage organization. Hockey in Phoenix? Bwaha! C’mon!

  225. Gabby and Richards should be forced to keep playing on the same line. This is becoming Dreary and Nomez again — splitting them up didn’t work out, either. Give these two talents some freaking time to mesh.

  226. I like Turris…Tough to say what type of player he projects to be…I mean the kid was picked 3rd overall and had a decent season last year, 25pts….Would depend on the prospects/player going the other way for me….

  227. Rhode Island Ranger on

    Eddie x 3:

    I suspect you and I have the same problem. We’ve seen too much of hockey and human nature to swallow the company line on Torts’ “better hockey players”, EC and WW. Better paper dolls is closer to the truth.

    And on Saturday afternoon, they will float helplessly in the wind as the Sens cut up our holy logo with their razor-sharp skates… And Torts will rage like Lear at the ingratitude of his fancy favorites… before juggling the lines with acumen and style.

  228. HWirth, I don’t get what expiring contracts are worth in the NHL? This ain’t the NBA. Expiring does not mean value.

    Or am I missing something?

  229. You know what’s funny? Yotes fans complain aboot the same exact thing Avery lovers complain aboot, which is lack of ice time. LOL! Avery lovers complain aboot a 30-something year old useless 4th liner getting 4th liner minutes, and Yotes fans complain aboot a 22 year old kid, playing in only his second season, getting 4th line minutes. Which group makes more sense? Haha! Sad!

  230. Taking a chance on a guy like Turris is a smart move, as opposed to taking a chance in free agency on guys like Dreary and “Nomez”. The kid said it’s not aboot money, so he wont be asking for much. We have so much depth on defense, we can afford to move a guy or two. V-Tank, Kundratek, Pashnin, McIlrath, and maybe more. Throw in a draft pick, and BOOM! It can happen.

  231. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    The rangers playing a game 7 for all the marbles? Who knew?

    Hw – I have socks older than 25 years old…. Try another snotty assen remark…bring your best 6th grade retort.

  232. Carp – Expiring contract has value when the NYR (for example) has an upcoming UFA making whatever 3.3. mil. Team B, the Sharks (cause im watching them on TV) has a player with 2 years left at 4.3 each that they have A. fallen out of favor with or B. they are looking to resign other guys that are RFA and need the extra cap room. The Sharks would take the guy at 3.3 for remainder and give up contract with 2nd year left in order to open up 3.3 to resign own RFAs.

  233. Carp – Think about that Jokinen trade from Calgary. They got Jokinen who was upcoming UFA while Kotalik who didn’t fit in had contract left.

  234. But in that case, the Sharks would rather take nobody back than an expiring contract. They have to take the expiring contract because the NYR would demand they take it. It has no value to the Sharks. In the NBA, an expiring contract is an asset because it’s a soft cap. The NHL has a hard cap, and the expiring contract has no value. It just comes off the books July 1. So they’d be better off having nobody than an expiring contract for cap (and salary) purposes.

  235. I think there are people that understand Avery isn’t the quite as effective as he used to be and their are those that think he deserve to finish out his contract with the Rangers because he brings more than offense to table and the Rangers can use his grit…and then, there are the straight up man love Avery dudes….

    To the over-emotional Avery man-crushers, what did you think when Aves left the Rangers and signed with Dallas just for the money (and dissed former Ranger personel in the media)? It must have felt like being dumped…

  236. Carp – Although in the Jokinen trade he was a rental upcoming UFA and the Flames took on contract in Kotalik Higgins while the NYR knew they were not going to re-sign Jokinen which opened up like 2.8 or something like that of extra space.

  237. Like when Bob Gainey traded for Gomez’s expiring contract and gave little of value in return, Carp. Oh wait…

    Still another 5-10 years of laughter to come out of that deal, I think.

  238. Carp – Your point is true too though because you can always just Redden a bad contract or trade it for a pick and not take back another contract.

  239. Rhode Island Ranger on

    NYR:

    Avery and any young player from Hartford beat Torts’ poodles, EC and WW. We all know it.

    Torts knows it, but he isn’t able to admit his selfish mistake yet. He needs time to grieve over that little part of himself that dies every time he bleeps up. Slats will help him through this.

  240. Eddie Eddie Eddie on

    RIR – I wouldn’t say torts juggles his lines. There are no lines. Instead, whatever 5 guys happen to be in the mood to float for that given 45 seconds do so until the next 5 guys have the urge.

    Ricardo, should you come out for the rangers sharks game next year, I will take you to Phil’s Fish market for the best bisque you will ever eat.

  241. RIR:

    I don’t disagree. I would much rather see Avery on the FOURTH line than either of those guys…

    Avery and Rupp could work on the 4th line with a kid from Hartford…

    This doesn’t mean I want to fire the ego-maniacal Tartarellla…and it also doesn’t mean I think the Rangers should resign Avery in July…

  242. Rhode Island Ranger on

    NYR:

    I agree completely with your position on this. Quite reasonable. I just want Torts to take responsibility for his misjudgments and fix them.

    LGR.

  243. OK, he doesn’t dislike them as much as he does Avery, but what part of scratching Wolski and Christensen, giving them Avery-like minutes when they do play and being fairly scornful of them in public screams of them being Torts favourites?

  244. I think I’d rather have EC than Avery, but I’m not convinced of that. If I had a choice, they’d both be in the AHL.

    NYR, remember when he said “I bleed blue”, that summer? LOL! Green is more like it!

    And Slats was actually smart for not signing him to the money he asked for, because he sure as hell didn’t deserve it in the long run.

  245. AveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAveryAvery

    Rinse. Repeat.

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