Rangers-Oilers in review

353

Last year, “It’s Just Pain” was the defining quote from Brandon Prust, the one that said it all about the Rangers.

You’d better hope that this year’s mantra isn’t John Tortorella’s “We sucked from head to toe.”

I thought that was hilarious, but true. And very, very calculated. Coaches and captains who have their finger on the pulse do stuff like that from time to time. Tortorella knew exactly what he was doing. He was getting a message to his team, which really was pretty lousy and soft and disinterested and distracted. And he was doing it without having to stand there and answer questions about individuals who stunk. And he was, at the same time, firing a distracting pre-emptive strike in the media (especially since there was probably a ton of Canadian media there at the time).

Thoughts:

1) Head to toe definitely includes the power play. The Rangers are still going to have trouble scoring goals, especially when the second line is as blah as it’s been so far. But there is no excuse, even a lack of skill, for the power play being the way it’s been. The Rangers stands around, and a PP can go that way … if. You can stand still and fire pucks at the net and hope for rebounds if you have guys who can shoot it and guys who can tip and screen and get those rebounds. Or you can look for the open shot and try to get it by moving and moving, making the defensive players find you while you try to find open space, making quick passes. But you can’t stand around AND try to make pretty plays. You can’t. And, IMO, the best way to do it is by moving, having forwards darting to holes and darting out. In fact, you could get a basketball coach to draw up some half-court plays, with back-doors and rotations and learn a lot of good PP ideas. It wouldn’t be any worse than the Rangers PP has been for as long as I can remember.

2) No matter what, you cannot have guys miss the net by as much as Derek Stepan did on the 5-on-3 … you can’t miss the net ever on a 5-on-3; and you just can’t miss by as much as Brad Richards then did, resulting in the Oilers breakaway.

3) When you looked at this season, one thing among the forwards that you figured was good as money in the bank, as long as they didn’t “rob Peter to pay Marian and Brad” was the Pack Line. But that line got broken up and for good reason in this game. Brandon Dubinsky and Ryan Callahan have been awful, and now Artem Anisimov has visited the doghouse, too. With others. Maybe they should bring Sean Avery back to work the bow-wow chateau door.

4) The Oilers sure have some speed and skill. How about that Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, or whatever his names are. In fact, can I say something about all these three-name kids? I am honestly not being disrespectful, and I fully understand why parents in this day and age want both surnames represented in their children, and that’s all well and good. But what happens when John Smith-Jones marries Mary Brown-Miller and they have kids? Will little Billy Smith-Jones-Brown-Miller grow up and marry Sally White-Green-Edwards-Quinn and then have a kid named Herman Smith-Jones-Brown-Miller-White-Green-Edwards-Quinn? Know what I’m sayin’?

5) Back to hockey and last night’s game. The first Oilers goal, perfectly-played (by the Oilers) 3-on-2 started by Brendan Bell’s pinch. OK, it was a poorly executed and timed pinch. But Steve Eminger and Brandon Prust really botched the 3-on-2, too, didn’t they? And I’m not even sure how they did it, or what they should have done differently. But it was too easy.

6) OK, exhale. The goaltender is OK. But you got a half an hour or so of imagining what this team would look like if he ever gets hurt.

7) So I’m in central Westchester on my way home in the first period. ESPN radio has the World Series, and only a percentage of the tri-state area gets that station clearly. The Rangers game is supposed to be on Bloomberg radio, but Bloomberg radio has Notre Dame football. I tried every single notch on the radio dial and couldn’t even get a static version of the Rangers game. I actually heard a few moments of Colorado-Chicago. Not more than 30-35 miles from Madison Square Garden, and I couldn’t hear a live radio feed of the Rangers game.

8) So I missed the first period, thus you guys have to let me know who you demanded to be traded in those 20 minutes. I know all the rest that you wanted traded over the last two periods. And also that you all think the season is over.

9) Good to see the message is getting through about the needless penalties. Oh, never mind.

———-

My Three Rangers Stars
(this wasn’t easy)
1) Marian Gaborik.
2) Henrik Lundqvist.
3) Brian Boyle.

———-

AP photo, above.

About Author

353 Comments

  1. Carp…. Don’t you just love working early in the AM…. ah the glam life of a TV Weatherman….

  2. the coach sure is taking a long time figuring out who belongs where. it took all of 7 games to break up Gabby and Richards.

  3. I felt in the summer, and I still feel now, that moving Stepan to the wing was foolish. he tried to make it work, but asking him to be the corner man on that line is silly. the Rangers still have the same issues. 1st line left wing, 2nd line center, and a top 4 Dman. Wolski should be given a look on one of the top 2 lines. Stepan ( who has had a real slow start) needs to get a long as the number 2 center. top 4 man needs to be addressed through trade.

  4. Stranger Nation on

    Classic trap game after the two victories, this team does not have the skill to take a game off effort wise especially when you are missing 2 top D

    2nd line Blues – while Cally and Dubi have been up and down, Artie completely disappears on some shifts. It’s weird. The center should be all around the puck and he is not as much as he should.

    With Hank they need to play very conservative on D. If McD or Damn girardi want to pinch, that is OK. Everyone else needs to play back as the likely risk is greater than the unlikely reward.

    It’s just one game and they need to step it up v. The Jets and end what is a very good road trip given injuries and travel itinerary.

  5. I like Prust as much as the next fan, but he needs to be on the 4th line. put a true checking line together. have AA, Boyle, and Fedotenko play together. it would take a lot of pressure off of AA to score, he has not looked good so far.

  6. If you’re not sure what Eminger and Prust could’ve done differently (nor am I) and that the Oilers played the break “perfectly”, a bit harsh to say they botched it, no?

    And when the Rangers had that odd-man rush late in the third, the Oilers broke it up by the D-man sliding on his belly to prevent the cross-ice pass…

    I think the main candidate for trade after the first period – despite the team’s terrible play – was Bill Pidto.

  7. Not defending how the 2nd line has performed so far, bull dog, but Anisimov and Boyle are no more wingers than Stepan is, so you’d be moving one of them to limited 4th line minutes, not Prust.

  8. no I would move Prust. you have to play your best 9. to me they are, AA, Dubi, Cally, Richards, Stepan, Gabby, Boyle, Wolski, and Fedotenko. to many centers, one has to move to wing. either Boyle, or AA.

  9. onecupin72yearsandcounting on

    When they win they look great and when they stink they really stink.. comes down to consistency..

  10. Edmonton has issues on defense, “work in progress”, they said yesterday. Their young forwards tend to be very aggressive and go deep in opponent’s zone. One would expect many odd man rushes against them. How many have the Rangers had last night? I understand the team has issues with the top 2 Dmen out and the forwards are asked to help defensively. But I think they are overcompensating. It’s difficult to start any offensive threat if your forwards are near your own goal line or so. By the time they have a puck, the oppsing team is back waiting. All 5 of them. Dump and chase can only work against a few teams and it tends to be very taxing in the long run. They looked very out of synch last night and disinterested. “We sucked from head to toe” is a copout. The coach has to take a blame here, he needs to look into different strategy. Sitting people down can only work for so long.

  11. Really?

    THAT’S how you start your writeup of last night’s debacle? praising the clueless coach? for having “his finger on the pulse” and “sending a message?”

    wow, talk about having an agenda.

    I bet his mother doesnt love him that much…..

  12. How have you been, firetorts? We missed you here after the last couple of game when they were winning…

  13. hi ilb, i guess i have been a somewhat fair weather anti-torts poster.

    glad you missed me

    no “I love torts” rhetoric to add this morning?

  14. iDoodie machetto on

    Season over, Trade everyone, fire sather, fire torts, tank the season, etc.

    Carp, stop trying to bait everyone with throw away Avery references. The team sucking should get you enough comments without Avery.

  15. I think you have to separate the sitting people down from the strategic failings to some extent, ilb.

    If the epidemic of dumb offensive zone penalties continues, most of the benchings will too.

  16. head to toe , Tort’s being the head = some one just said when they win they look great , no they don’t . yeah we won 2 games , but we were out played in all three games we’ve played. this game we play of dump & chase cycle behind the net is bull . other teams go behind the net & bang the puck is out to the point with a chance to score . last night our 5 on 3 was terrible . for 3 games our 5 0n 5 has been terrible . how does line changing enhance our ability to score ,it’s bull . Tort’s is not a good coach . he is a dictator = we have good talent & he doesn’t know what to do .

  17. Paul in sunrise on

    That was rough. Stayed up to watch and regret it obviously. Ice looked fast. Rangers didn’t. Not many quality scoring chances. Just bad. Brung on the jets and then home. Finally. Last change should help some too.

  18. iDoodie machetto on

    Lunqvist could have played only 1 period last night. And it still would have been one more than anyone else.

    Hell, Biron played more than any of the skaters.

  19. what a pathetic non interested performance by our beloved rangers. where the effort where the compete level. torst is right here by doing what he did.

    i willl say it again WHEN YOU NEVER HAVE THE PUCK AND CONSTANTLY DEFEND YOU CANT WIN CONSISTENTLY. its a major problem we have to figure out or again we will be sitting here on game 82 praying to make it or with the improved teams in east toronto, devils, isles, we make not make 8th.

  20. Torts skewering his team through the media this early in the season is a cheap shot. Can anyone discern an offensive system beyond dump and chase? Unlike past seasons where we’ve had a significant turnover in personnel, a high percentage of this team was here last year. Considering that we don’t possess the puck enough and we willingly give it up too easily when we do have it shows that the system we’re playing is not working. Maloney said it last night. Sure, the players have to execute but this team expends way too much time and energy chasing the puck trying to recover it.

    I also think we don’t have the right mix of players on both sides of the puck.

    Defensively, we still need that big, nasty and ferocious D-man who loves dropping opposing forwards who dare cross our blue line with the puck or camp out in front of LQ.

    Offensively, we have too many grinders and not enough players who live to shoot and score.

    For the most part, these games have been boring to watch. Gaborik and LQ are the only ones keeping me awake during these late west coast games.

  21. So when will the King approach Sather and quietly ask to be traded? Sooner or later he’s gonna get sick and tired of the same old same old (ie a team with a pop gun offense that more often than not gets its points because of the goaltender, struggles to make the POs, and then if/when they do, goes out quickly)?

    Just wondering…

  22. Bieksa just signed a big 5-year deal with a NTC. Can’t see anything involving him.

    You can sit back down now, wicky…

  23. I didn’t see the game, but from what I can read, Tortorella was right – the team sucked. But so did the coach, failing yet again to have his players play with passion and failing yet to address a pathetic PP.

    Yep the team sucked, but so did you coach. Take a look in the mirror…

  24. leetchhalloffame on

    Jim – Wondering that myself. If LQ goes we’ll start getting top 5 picks in the draft for the next 10 years, not that Slats has a clue what to do with them.

  25. True Blue Mike on

    What do you boys think it would take to get Shea Weber? —

    Del Zotto, Zuke, Sauer and Dubinsky plus a second round pick?

  26. The line changing last night was because our second line hasn’t been doing much offensively. Gaborik was switched to the second line so that it’s more difficult to shutdown the first line by using your best D-men. Torts knows what is or isn’t working. Let him sort it out, that’s why he is what he is. And I’m sure he will. He can’t go on the ice and execute, that’s for sure. Again, the best news- Hank is not seriously injured. And we didn’t give any points to EC teams. Off to Winnipeg. Win there, and it’s a decent trip considering the circumstances. Let’s not assume this is the best they can do, please. And Sauer should be coming back soon too.

  27. Long time no post,

    For starters, I have not been very thrilled by this team by any standard. Nothing has excited me in their game. I hope…(crosses fingers) that it’s because it’s west coast teams and we don’t have rivalries with them.

    Although we upgraded this summer for sure, we look worse. Much worse. I dont think anyone on this blog can say that the rangers have played well any game. Should have been beaten in Vancouver and should have been beaten in calgary.

    Idk who said it earlier but the boring factor might be coming from a lack of break outs? When was the last time you saw a 2 on 1 for the rangers? It just doesn’t happen.

    I want my old team pre-Richards back.

  28. Right on, heave ho!

    The offensivensystem is the same as last year: play it along the boards and throw it into the middle to the opposing teams defensman. Its a joke.

    The Rangers would be a better team if they played evry shift like they were short handed. It s the only time i see them playing aggresively and skating as a team.

  29. Also I don’t have much of a problem with torts. I like the way he coaches, but I’m starting to get scared. Why is it that Higgins and Weise are great players on vancouver (reigning presIdent trophy winners) but couldnt do expletive when they were here?

    Don’t want to blame torts but idk who else to blame.

  30. I’m baffled by the fact that some out there still don’t equate the lack of progress on the ice with the guy directing the team. Tortorella not addressing the media was a self-serving move. He knew he was going to get skewered, especially since he was out-coached by his predecessor. But whatever. Give the guy a pass. After all, it couldn’t be the fault of the head coach.

  31. Can anyone tell me the last time Tortarella actually took some responsibility for anything????????? I liked renney up until his last days with the Rangers when he lost control of the team but I think that had something to do with the giant head (68) in the lockeroom at the time. And what the Rangers needed from a coach was to take control and thats what torts did but his EGO is bigger than anyones now. All the praise he gets for what?????????? Whats it been 3 full seasons? not finishing over 7th place and not winning a playoff series. hell one season they didnt even make the playoffs. So if he doesnt get the Rags better than a 6th place id say its time to let him go. FIRE SATHER!

  32. The part I liked best was one time Rangers were awarded a (stop that laughing), Power Play…………………….and where most teams send a guy to the front of the crease, the Rangers guy went and stood BEHIND THE NET…………..yep
    . he just stood there. I was trying to guess how this strange new procedure must Torts have taught them…I;d never seen it before, and was paying close attention to see how it would develop. Here,s how it happened, all the Oilers just took the puck down the ice and stuck it in the Rangers net…yeah some smart alec high school kid. When I let out a yelp of surprise, tbw gave me a funny look and asked “are you all right?” I nodded…didn’t trust myself to utter a word, lest some foul comment result.

    I would have to say…this was one for the ages. Can’t you see coaches at all levels, using this game as a teaching example of how to look ridiculous for an hour or so.

  33. individual bad performances, blame the players

    entire team performance is embarrassing, dare i say the, um coach, might be partially responsible?

    when does the totalretard free pass end?

    even my man ilb admitted the coach has to take the blame, are you coming around to the other side ilb???

  34. So unless they finish at 5th this year, Torts should be fired? That’s a new one!

    He’s taken the blame before, and I’m sure he knows when it’s coach’s fault. It’s his team, he’ll sort it out.

    Do you realize that MDZ and Erixon should not play second pair minutes? What are the choices? Eminger-Woywitka/ Bell? Of course not. Let them weather the storm, no reason to panic…

  35. I’m trying to figure out for those people that want Torts fired what exactly you would like him to do? Scotty Bowman wouldn’t make this team any better. He has a limited amount of talent to work with. His best defensemen is Dan Girardi! A typical NHL dman that will probably play 1000 games in his career be very solid but that’s it, like a Hal Gill who just reached his 1000th game. Some of you guys don’t understand why they dump it in and have to forecheck, that’s what grinding teams do. You know what would happen if they tried to open it up, they’d give up 45 to 50 shots against with their minor league defense. Not to mention you have to have skill forwards to do that and the second line, which is really a third line on a good team, is being expected to carry the load. While I can’t stand when Torts blows off the media (their newspapers paid a lot of money to travel them, show them some respect) he didn’t do it to avoid taking the bullet himself, he did it so he wouldn’t have to go after his core (the Pack Line) in public.

  36. Stickler for correct attribution that I am, I’m still struggling to find anyone who’s suggested that the coach bears no responsibility for performances like last night or that he gets a free pass. I guess that means we are unanimous in wanting the guy fired yesterday.

    The “coach has had the team for three full seasons” thing seems to be the new “Avery played five minutes a game”. About as accurate as the Rangers’ shooting.

  37. Ok, so I have managed to see ONE game in its entirety this season. The Isles. WTF am I doing?!? Anyway, I fell asleep waiting for the game to start last night and woke up in the middle of the 3rd period. I saw Henke go out and I thought I was having a nightmare.

    Anyway, I got a GREAT seat for the home opener. I am psyched. Where do we go for beers before the game?

  38. When they win they look great and when they stink they really stink.. comes down to consistency

    onecup- atually, theyve looked like shat in every game this year except calgay. and they were playing pretty average in that one too. always getting outshot, outchanced, without hank we’d be 0-4-2. this team sucks. richards isnt going to make up for our whole 2nd line and a fewothers stinking it up out thre.

  39. LW- don’t waste your time. Same people all the time suggest that we all make it seem that Torts is infallible. They do it solely for self entertainment purposes.

  40. That 2nd line really sucks too.

    I am not so sure Cally was ready for the “C” either. It looks like that “C” weighs 100 lbs.

  41. Fran – totally agree. WTH are we doing in that pp? I am stumped – it does look somewhat like the NYR have decided that the PP should stink for at least ……. 10 years?

    Anyway – I dont like richards at the point – my God, does any D-man know how to shoot the puck and play D at the same time? Put McMonster on the 1st line PP with MDZ – let the forwards do what they know best – score goals?!

  42. Sean,
    I think Erixon and MDZ could do the job…

    …if there was just someone to TEACH them how to do it.

  43. cw- we could always have redden teach them!! lol j/k. paging mr leetch!!!! we ranger fans will pay your salary to teach the d!!!!

  44. the 2nd line needs a new center, and the best 9 forwards need to be on the top 3 lines. the 1st line needs a true LW.

  45. btw, i dont know whats wrong with bill pidto, cuz i dont get msg but can someone please clue me in on what is so bad about him? i read commets aout him here every gameday

  46. Grabby,

    He screams at you, makes absurd jokes and has to restrain himself from guffawing maniacally, convulses, filets small children, etc.

  47. Grabby

    Just get your kid to make strange noises and hand gestures over a couple of minutes of game highlights and you’ll achieve a similar effect.

  48. bdl- i think step should be the nw centr on the 2ndline. hes not producing on the top line an artie should be demoted. put boyle or feds up there for now. but we shouldnt trade for one because kreider is supposedly going to come right into the nhl next year and crack the top line. lol. talk about pressure this kid is gonna feel once he gets here.

  49. I’ll be honest- they look like they’re playing the same game they played last year except they’re just not getting the breaks that they did. Point being, alotta games could have very easily been lost last year just as easily as they were won. Here we are the following season and a lot of the other teams have improved and are showing it early on while there are no clear improvements other than Gaborik looking better here in NY. It’s early but the holes on thos roster are what they are. They either have to address them (by individuals stepping it up a bit) or win in spite of them.

    Ps- tsn should conduct a poll- “where do lines last longer? A) NY or B) Charlie Sheen’s house?

  50. i actually think charlie sheen is in fact, made out of 10% water, 20 % baking soda, and 70% uncut pure colombian @#$%$^%

  51. Stranger Nation on

    Growing Pains do not feel good…there still are some high priced assets not adding to bottom line.

    Good news – Young Dmen getting quality minutes, young centers learning on the job – news flash, NYR will probably not win the Cup this season, so get back off the ledge, close your eyes and envision being a top tier team in 2 or 3 seasons.

    Obviously Willie wonka was invaluable on D because he sat and we lost. Just need to ground the jets and get ready for mr Kessler and the loafs.

  52. Are the Pen()s a better team than the Rangers? Both of their superstars are not in the lineup and yet, they play a great game and keep winning. Staal, Kunitz, Neal? Are they better than Gaborik, Richards, Dubinsky?

  53. and you don’t have to be a hockey coach to see that they sucked from head to toe last night…but somehow Torts gets praised for saying what everyone already knew… having fingers on the pulse of this team? where exactly are those fingers? :)

  54. CARP!!! OMG your point # 4 is DEAD ON!!! I just read it to my wife and we were crying that was sooo funny!!!

  55. No, in NJ the goalies keep it in their pads, LW. You should know better.

    I am responsie for bringing “Fire Torts” sign to home opener. Any colo(u)r preferences, ‘heads? :-)

  56. No, and they are well coached, CCCP.

    But they also won zero playoff rounds without them, blowing a 3-1 series lead, and got upset including Crosbalkin the year before. Which would have had people calling for Bylsma’s head here.

  57. CCCP – some here simply refuse to see the warts on Tortorella. They’re the same warts that chased him out of the NHL in Tampa. I guess his so-called straight-shooter comments win him fans. The guy belongs back in the booth where he was before Sather dug him up. Put Gernander in the coach’s seat and watch this team excel.

  58. Brunch: scrambled eggs with red onion, asparagus, and feta on multigrain toast with cream cheese. And a giant thermos of coffee.

  59. Hey, I didn’t say Tortorella coached well last night … nor do I think he’s coached particularly well in most games this season. His power play stinks and that is partly on him. What I said up top is that the tactic he used last night will be, and was, misrepresented by some of the media as Tortorella taking it out on the media. What he did, instead, was A) successfully distract some of the media from talking about the prior 60 minutes on ice and B) avoid having to answer questions on specific players who stunk it up. And to say he’s not accountable is idiotic. He admitted to a mistake in the Islanders game that nobody else even saw. And when he said they sucked head to toe, I’m pretty sure he means he’s the head. Though the toes (and the captain of the toes, the Big Toe) stunk just as badly.

    But of course, he banished poor superstar and first-line winger Sean Avery, so a lot of you with man crushes and broken hearts have to want him fired.

  60. they are playing out with their biggest minute eater and best d man. yep staal offensively is not much but when then puck is in there zone so much starting offense is a big problem.

    aa, cally, and dubi, have been bad so far real bad. this team is youn and will get better.

    the PP is inexcusable, shoot the friggin puck……………

    if they are going to play EC 5 minutes just end his tenure already, play wolski, zucc, hagelin, anyone..

  61. torts is a very good coach, is he a bully and bad to the press? yep. he knows what he is doing.

    arguing over avery is like arguing over CHristensen, a waste of time these guys are fringe nothings…

    let’s argue over how to get AA, cally, DUbi, and stepan to the next level not some BS>

  62. At least my man crush isnt a craggy, cranky orange self-absorbed clueless nasty accountable-to-nobody weasel, with fake hips and knees.

  63. Gernander needs to learn how to hate Avery at the AHL level before he is ready for NHL duties…

  64. Dead on Carp… Serious question, do the editors take notice to stuff like what Torts did yesterday in deciding whether or not to travel writers, or is it strictly a budgetary (both the $$ sense and copy sense) decision?

  65. any editor with half a brain appreciates it when a coach does something newsworthy like that, as long as he doesn’t overdo it. On the other hand, have you noticed how many times Rex Ryan has been on the back pages of the New York tabs this week alone?

    Decisions to staff road games are based on one issue: $.

  66. By saying that some thought on the rangers finishing better than 6th was me trying to say if this is a working progress then there has to be some kind of progress. Meaning if they finish in 5th then yes that is a little progress but u might have to evaluate how the playoffs turn out too. Another first round loss than no . And the D is not the problem on this team even with staal and sauer out, even with DZ and Erixon playing 2nd pair min. The problem has always been offense. The first full year torts had with the exception of Gabby the scoring was pretty slim, the next we dont even have a 25 goaler lol.. Torts needs to realize this grind it out system does not work with every player. Yea the pack line can do it but Gabby richards and who ever else fills that LW spot need to have the freedom to be creative bc thats what kind of players they are. Save the grind for the 3rd and 4th line because thats what they are for. FIRE SATHER

  67. “Put Gernander in the coach’s seat and watch this team excel.”

    LOL! Please!

    CC, to answer your question from the previous thread, I’m not 2-0 yet. If Bobby Ryan is kept off the score sheet, then I’m 2-0!

    Two pretty damn good comeback the last two weeks! Weee!

  68. LOL, ilb.

    HW, we used to spend money like drunken sailors to send me to all 82, plus all six or seven preseason, plus all-star game, plus NHL draft, plus most every Cup final whether there was a NY-area team in or not, plus all Devils/Islanders playoff games if the Rangers were out.

    Now I have to beg to do one of the three playoff games in D.C. Though I do think they’ll send me to the Winter Classic.

  69. And some here simply refuse to see that some here simply *don’t* refuse to see the coach’s warts but still, miraculously, aren’t in favour of him being fired.

    Just to appease “some here” and for full disclosure, a few things on my negative ledger:

    • Though improved last year, his (public) conduct with the media, and by extension the fans, is sometimes insulting. Don’t mind the act like last night on occasions, but you can’t keep repeating it.
    • Similarly, talking on one hand about “the group” then being publicly critical or aloof about certain players is inconsistent, as is the obvious parallel between preaching discipline and getting himself suspended from a playoff game.
    • I was largely unimpressed with his work in 2009/10 – the roster was not as bad as made out and few players showed improvement. (Don’t have the same criticism about last year.)
    • Still more about personnel, but the basics of the PP just have to be improved.
    • Fair shake or not, it was somewhat disingenuous to suggest Avery was in a contest for a roster spot in camp and waiting until Stockholm to make the cut served nobody well.

    I await similar from the anti-Turderella (or are we back on Totalretard as the hilarious name of choice now?) faction.

  70. Ilb, I really, really wish I could!!! I’ve never been to a home opener at the Garden and I can only imagine how much fun that must be. I’m going to the Sabres-Lightning game on Tuesday though, which should be fun.

  71. The defense is creating the offensive problems. Under the new NHL rules, puck possession is the key to the game. When it takes 4 to 5 passes including a turnover or two to get out of the zone it’s kinda hard to create long offensive shifts and therefore shots on goal.

    Two, the lack of a threat from the point creates a situation where teams cheat down low on us and leave the points open due to no fear of their shots. That creates a 3 on 4, or 4 on 5 situation in front of the net. That’s why you rarely see this team score an easy tap in goal. They have trouble creating mismatches in front of the net when the two high forwards slip down to cover up the front of the net.

  72. Winter Classic? Like you don’t freeze your MZA enough covering all these high school football games. Or is it girl basketball?

  73. Not exactly a big trade but…

    DarrenDreger:
    Habs announce trade: Nokelainen and Stafford from Pheonix for Brock Trotter and a 7th round pick.

  74. Carp, I’m going to find a way to get to the Winter Classic too, though I’m pretty sure my bosses won’t pay my way. You better make some time to eat a cheesesteak with your favorite bonehead.

  75. if we could win tom night in winnipeg and come home with 8 of 14 pts on our whirlwind of a road trip to start the season we all have to say they weathered the storm. even a point tom night and its a 500 road trip.

    the real problem is not having the puck enough. you cant win consistently in nhl without dictating play.

    why you think red wings been so successful all these years. yes they have more superstars but they are able to control the game even from fringe players.

  76. It should be clear that Richards doesn’t solve all the issues for a team defines itself as an “in your face” fore-checking team that will out work the opposition. Richards should complement to this team, not be the catalyst. The catalysts are guys like Dubi, Artie, Cally, Prust, Boyle, Feds….they have to be as good as they were last year for the Rangers to take on their identity…

    Rangers fans need to remember that much hasn’t changed since last year except that our kids are one year older and that is a new era in NYR hockey…no Drury, no Avery, no excuses…Cally is captain and should be leading by example…

    Another thing, the Edmonton ice is described by many as the best in the league. Notice how the Rangers never had the puck and were outskated… I think the quality of the ice magnified the Rangers lack of elite skill…

  77. You can’t use the Red Wings as an example. Like you said, they have more superstars.

    Despite the losing record to start the season, I think it’s been a somewhat successful start, given all the constant traveling. This team is going to need some time to settle in before we can really know how good they can be. Unfortunately, that can take another month or so.

  78. The bright side of skipping the home opener, Sally, is that you don’t have to listen to the lame pre-game entertainment. Wonder what bottom they’ll scrape for this year’s performer.

  79. NYR, great point. These Rangers will have problems with fast, skilled teams on good ice. That shouldn’t be an issue at home.

    But they will have problems with any opponent if their second line plays as it has, and if they have two D-men who have to play 30 minutes a game, and if the power play is going to score once every six games.

    On the other hand, they didn’t go 0-7 to start the season, and if/when the second line figures it out, and if/when Sauer and (not counting on it) Staal come back, and if/when the PP can crank it up to even a woeful 15 percent or so, they’ll be fine.

  80. Haha! I’m gonna have Mama newspaper you for that comment! And yes, I’m totally ok with missing the “entertainment”.

  81. Exactly, NYR. But, lets complain aboot Butt-Chin for not scoring, even though he played a great game! Ugh! NYR fans.

    If that were last season, then it’s alright to complain, but this season he’s been pretty damn good. Four goals in six games is a good start. I don’t like how he has no assists! It reminds me of NHL08, I used to score 60 goals, but would end up with 10 assists with Jagr. It always bugged me!

  82. Carp –

    If fine means again praying on the last day of the season to make the playoffs then I guess that’s fine and hopefully in the 52 card pickup that sorts out the 6-10 seeds, we have the right card again. But they spent a ton of cash on Richards and gave raises to the core to not be in that situation.

  83. As much as I love to analyze these Rangers I think it comes down to this… they haven’t decided who they are. They don’t have a high powered offense nor do they have a shut ’em down defense (aside from Lundqvist). Not to mention they are in no way well rounded. So they’re floating somewhere in the middle. Sometimes they can score. Sometimes they can’t. Sometimes they can shut the opponent’s offense down. Sometimes they can’t. Not every team has to choose whether to be offensive or defensive but you do need your bread and butter, go to style. The Rangers don’t have one.

    I don’t blame Torts as much as I blame Sather. Torts is trying to do what he can with what he has, which really isn’t much. The Rangers have one legitimate sniper. ONE. They have a couple of guys who can pass the puck. They have a few guys who can defend alright. And they have a world class goalie in net. That’s what they are and what they have been for the past several years. Neither here nor there. That’s all Sather. I think most coaches would probably get about the same results out of this bunch. They’re inconsistent and that’s all they’ll ever be. That’s how they were built.

  84. HW, but I think it’s wrong to assume that one guy is going to change the entire team. Just because Richards is making enough money to spur an Occupy Richards protest doesn’t make him a superstar. He’s not. And giving people raises doesn’t make them better players, either.

    But what Richards should eventually do is improve the PP to whatever degree, get Gaborik to score 40+, and allow the second line to face second-tier checking and the whole trickle down to the other lines. But the East has greatly improved, and I think 3 or 4 through 11 is wide open and will come down to the last week or so.

  85. Perhaps sometimes feeling a bit of pressure to produce isn’t a bad thing. The addition of Richards, and seeing Gaborik go this year, took some pressure off the second line. I think they forgot what made them successful last year. They need to be on their toes all the time. I trust they’ll figure it out.

  86. Haha! Orr, How awesome would it be if BC Gaby finished the year with 50 goals and like 7 assists?

    At least I had a good night in fantasy! Z-Dot Bogosian and Jordan Staull were huge point getters for me last night!

  87. Tony F – That’s an accurate post. It’s what a Mad GM once called “hockey hell,” the 6-10 seeds in the standings. It means you are not good enough if you make the playoffs to do any real damage and yet not bad enough to draft can’t miss top of the line talent.

    Hence, Colorado (Duchene and Landeskog)
    Pitt (Crosby, Staal and Malkin)
    CHI (Toews and Kane)
    Wash (OV and Semin)
    TB (Hedman and Stamkos)

    The only team that hasn’t done it that way is Detroit and that’s because their European scouting is vastly better than the rest of the NHL.

  88. Carp – I agree with you. I should have used (sarcasm) and the end of that last sentence. Paying the Pack Line more wasn’t going to make them any better while over paying for Richards was an improvement but he’s no Messier circa 1991-92.

  89. “Just because Richards is making enough money to spur an Occupy Richards protest doesn’t make him a superstar.”

    Brilliant, Carp.

  90. let’s have a bit of a reality check:

    1st line players

    Brad Richard is probably a first line center and in this crop is leaps and bounds above anyone else they’ve got. He’ll be better once he gets over NY Ranger syndrome: holding the puck too long.

    Marian Gaborik is a top line wing who has shown glimpses this year of why he can be a 50-goal scorer

    2nd line players

    Ryan Callahan, Brandon Dubinsky*, Derek Stepan*

    * Both of those guys have average to above average skill sets but are not without their flaws. Dubinsky disappears and has a tendency to make mind-boggingly poor decisions. Stepan has shown no real evidence of dynamic skills and is still very young. I would expect some improvement from him over time but I seriously doubt he’s got the tools to be better than a 2nd line forward no matter where Tortorella plays him.

    3rd line players

    Artem Anisimov, Brandon Prust, Brian Boyle, Ruslan Fedotenko, Wojtek Wolski*, Mats Zuccarello*

    Wolski and Zuccarello are probably 4th line players on a Tortorella-coached team, but their lack of physical play and poor defensive sense means that they generally won’t crack the lineup. One could probably make the argument that they’re not good enough to be 3rd line players. I wouldn’t have a problem with flip-flopping Boyle for Dubinsky since I think Dubinsky would be better as a checking forward than operating under this illusion of being some kind of a scoring threat.

    4th line players

    Mike Rupp, Erik Christensen, Kris Newbury, etc., etc.

    Really just a mass of mediocrity with dubious ability on either side. If Tortorella had a brain, he’d move guys like Prust to line 4 and try to get something out of Zuccarello (or, god help us, Wolski) on line 3 with . Christensen and Rupp are wastes of locker space.

  91. Yeah, Vinny as well! Forgot aboot him!

    Even the Kings, Doughty and Kopitar. Bernier was drafted top 10, I think. He’ll be great trade bait for a team like Florida, Columbus, Tampa, New Jersey, Phoenix, Ottawa.

    Cory Schneider as well. Probably two of the best young backups in the NHL, that have potential to be good starters.

  92. Any thoughts on whether or not RNH is going to go back to Red Deer? He’s been pretty awesome, but I dunno.

  93. The bottom line is that this NYR team is made up of a bunch of no-talent a$$clowns who are bush-league through-and-through … and who should all be honing their “craft” in the Amateur-Hour League.

  94. “The Nuge” is this year’s Skinner…I know its early, but he’ll be the Calder guy…I said the same thing about Figure skating boy last year….

  95. One of the great tweets ever….

    Ron Wilson

    @coachrw63: Impressive Torts!U just set a new presser record at 16 secs.I’m going to break that record!

  96. stevezipay Marian Gaborik, best NYR forward last night, breaks stick on glass after missing shot in drill. Emotion’s there

    Good to see some emotion, even in practice.

    Ron Wilson is on Twitter?? He has to be the only coach on Twitter.

  97. Stranger Nation on

    was watching replay instead of Jets and Newbury was playing well. makes smart plays and is not afraid to hit anybody, anywhere. Too bad EZ is on that line – bring up Mitchell and lets start getting nasty out there.

    That game need the 3rd line to get in the face of the young guns and get them thinking about getting hit.

    Move on to the Peg.

  98. Carp

    I agree with you about the fast and skilled teams, that means the
    Panthers, the Lightning, Pittsburgh, Flyers Canes and now most likely, the Maple Leafs. I’ve wanted a reason to use this expression but…… “it’s still early!”

    ( But as Yogi once sagely remarked, “It gets late earlier now.”)

  99. So. Last night was ugly. I left my wedding shower (Jack & Jill style I am told) to listen to that game at my parents house out in the sticks of Connecticut. What a waste. They better regroup for Winnipeg. Flat games like that kill us.

  100. Morning/afternoon ILB and all!!!

    So due to the black ops zombie party last night for the mrs and I just got done watching the dvr’d game and apparently there were zombies on the ice…WOW!!!

    where to start…I thought prust and gabby were the 2 best ranger forwards.

    so rupp gets benched. prust got benched and on the prust benching torts says that (paraphrasing here) he benches prust because he can handle it and will come back strong, he thinks that of rupp too I guess! But what does that say about huginsky? I mean NO ONE on the roster has taken worse penalties than him (just as bad, but not worse), but he has not seen the bench once! Why I wonder???

    Love the D on the 2nd goal I believe (the first pair I think), so OPG takes himself out of position by…wait for it…sliding on the ice and mcdonut does not even attempt to clear the crease and lets the oiler player screen hank (did you guys rip him apart like you did eminger for his screen??? or did the excuses just come flying out of the woodwork?? OF COURSE YOU HYPOCRITES DID SAY ANYTHING ABOUT THAT)

    lastly the 5 on 3…wow…BAD! I thought the best chance to score was cally right in the slot open and stepan just didn’t pass him the puck for some reason…oh well!!

    We got out hit and out played physically by the edmonton day care team!!

    Is the “C” too much of a burden for cally?

    It is only game six folks please come in off the ledge!

  101. orr (and everybody)
    sorry if I repeated something someone else said last night, didn’t read the go time thread

  102. Orr – Tell me what’s so funny about Gernander as a coach.

    Carp – My issues with Tortorella have little, if anything to do with Avery. His case is just the icing on the cake. From where I’m standing, the Rangers look pretty similar to where they were when he first came aboard. That to me suggests the problem is largely with the coach. That and the still non-existent powerplay. Also anyone who scratches Wolski in favor of anyone on the fourth line is not exactly making sound decision.

    HWirth – How come you didn’t list the Bruins? I guess you could say Seguin is their top guy. But its not like they wouldn’t have won the cup without him.

  103. I still don’t understand from yesterday, why was AA benched when if memory serves, and I could be wrong, he hasn’t taken a penalty this year, and Dubi may be in double digits for penalty minutes and they are on the same line. Please explain the logic, anyone?

  104. i love the fact that the nucks and panthers made a significant trade already to not screw around with issues on their teams…I wouldn’t mind seeing a shake up move of some sort if this team needs it!!

    line shuffling just seems like a panic move to me (not that we ever panic in rangerland)!!

    Anyone see the robot that dropped the puck in the kings game and then brown shook its umm hand?? LMFAO!!

  105. My feeling on Wolski: Woof.

    and if you don’t think last year’s team was different than the one he inherited, well, I’m not even going to bother indulging that conversation.

  106. and I think the handling of Dubinsky is different than other guys, and has been for a while, because he’s a different bird and his buttons are different. He’s a guy who needs more kicks in the pants and more pats on the back than, say, his linemates.

  107. Jpg’s sister, I mentioned it last night, possibly he did it to light a fire under his ass. He’s an important guy for us, and he’s been a ghost.

    Next up is Dublowsky, and possibly even Cally, if they don’t get it together.

    Phil, to think that Ken Gernander, who looks and sounds like he’s bored to death when coaching, could do better with this team than Torts, well, to put it simply, it’s a fuggin joke!

  108. carp
    thanks for sharing

    manny
    thanks and I enjoyed my zombie party a helluva lot more than torts enjoyed his!!

  109. Carp – Tortorella had a good deal of input into the team he iced in his first full year. He admitted to bringing in Brashear and Kotalik. And also, it’s pretty clear he had a say in chasing away Zherdev. He helped create that calamity. And certainly, there’s a difference between them and last year(the big one being they made the playoffs), but this year and last year? Not seeing it. Sorry. Still weak-ass powerplay, musical lines an over-reliance on Hank to save their asses.

    Orr – I don’t care how Gernander sounds. He’s been a major reason we’ve been seeing guys like Dubinsky, Callahan, Anisimov, McDonagh and Sauer come to the bigs as polished as they are. I’d take him over Tortorella in a heartbeat.

  110. jpg’s sister- AA didn’t take a penalty. As a matter of fact, he didn’t do anything at all. Thats why he was sitting.

  111. I’m pretty sure Schoney was coaching Hartford when Cally, Dubinsky, Artie, and Sour were down there.

    I’ve heard nothing but bad things aboot Gernander from people that actually watch those boring AHL games.

    So to think that he’s going to change this team is an absolute joke. Can’t stress that enough.

  112. JPG’s sis
    see, if AA takes penalties like huginsky, then he gets plenty of ice time like huginsky!!

    All AA needs to do is take a ton of penalties and he will play more!

  113. i’m sure this has been spoken about already but i feel the need to add my 2 cents. the coach is looking or a spark? he’s in hartford!!! are we supposed to believe that the coach or the organization really think that EK or Newbury are better players or add more then avery? i’m not delusional, I know avery isn’t the savior but he plays with heart and emotion and can skate. in the limited minutes the other clowns are getting avery could be very effective. the bottom line is the coach who doesn’t feel he has to answer to anyone hated avery. are we really supposed to believe anything else? and what happened to hockey people being classy the assassination in the media from torts when they cut avery was a classless move CLASSLESS!!!!

    next point, am i the only one who gets the feeling that every team we’ve played this year has a player that used to be a ranger or part of the system and has burned us?

    the talent evaluation has been ok at best, look at our kids we’ve built from within. those kids seem to look like they are standing still against these other teams so far. the best example for the lack of talent evaluation is …………Dylan McIlrath vs Cam Fowler. walk me through the thought process with this one? oh i know we had a stable of young puck moving defense we need a beuke type player…..

    they have over evaluated the entire system and are led by a coach who thinks his $hit don’t stink, in my opinion.

  114. Nope, don’t think we’ve heard the “Torts hates Avery and never accepts responsibility for defeat” angle before…

  115. With respect to item #4, I am going into the tombstone engraving business. It’s a good thing nobody knows the name of your first pet for security these days.

    They were pretty slow out there!

  116. Avery should be with the Rangers but he won’t get called up because Tortorella plays favorites and Avery is assuredly not one of his favorites. Because of a silly grudge, he’d rather have the team suffer pointless shifts by stiffs like Christensen than admit that his judgment is and always has been skewed by ego. More than 50% of this roster looks utterly lifeless at the moment; the problem is that Tortorella thinks now that everyone on the roster is totally under his thumb. Anytime he makes nonsensical statements like he did about Newbury, all he’s saying is that he found another hump who’s willing to put his tail between his legs and do the coach’s bidding. Tortorella’s ability to lead effectively should be questioned but anyone with a working brain ceel.

  117. LW3H:

    Unfortunately, it’s an accurate assessment of what went down. This type of treatment has followed John Tortorella throughout his coaching career – it’s not like Avery’s the first guy he’s completely buried. Have a look at what went on in Tampa and why he ended up getting canned.

  118. Cam Fowler is Del Z’s clone. All of you whining aboot Del Z would do the same exact thing if we had Fowler.

    Let’s not act like Fowler is Bobby Orr. He’s an offensive d-man, who’s horrible defensively. I wasn’t exactly thrilled with the pick when it happened, but McIlrath could be good. Complaining aboot the pick now is a waste of time.

    Let’s wait until 2015 to start saying “we should have drafted so and so” as always!

  119. Orr:

    When was the last time the Rangers drafted a star forward?

    When was the last time the Rangers drafted a star offensive-dman?

  120. LW
    I said “if” the team needs it.

    But, I’ll play the game I guess while I’m waiting to watch the raiders…

    We all know torts is a line shuffler (whether we approve of it or not is up to the individual) and he has been doing it for the short six game season to this point. The team seems lacking something to this point of the short season for certain.

    Other teams are playing well in this short season so far, so why not us?

    It is either the coach or the players…it has to be. Now I understand we are missing two starting four D men. That being said it isn’t like we are being lit up (yes I understand we have a stellar goalie) on the scoreboard. Our D depth apparently isn’t as “deep” as we all thought with the way the critics are coming out of the woodwork about all the AHLers we have on D.

    The team isn’t scoring and we are arguably missing a top 3 forward and a 1/3 of a 4th line.

    So if it is the players, and the line shuffling is not working (square pegs round holes) and some players can’t be benched even when they deserve it perhaps we need a different player or two!

    If it is the coach “IF”, then the coach either does not have the right players for his “system” (square pegs round holes again) or he cannot “motivate” all of his players or some of his players are not “buying in” to the system. Maybe we need a different player or two who will be able to be motivated by the coach or buy into his system.

    Seems to me that it would make a bit of sense to sort it out rather quickly (if there is a problem which I personally do not think so at this point) instead of forest gumping our way through half a season before doing something.

    The other options are obviously keep the ling juggling and hope it eventually clicks and players come back from injury and everything settles down (it is only 6 games into the season after all) or something more drastic that I won’t even bring up!

    So if there are some out there that feel the situation is dire and a trade should be made soon, then either trade some/one of those prized young players in our organization and one of those 2nd/3rd liners we seem to have an abundance of for a top 4 D man and maybe a legit contributing NHL 4th liner so we can roll 4 lines or a first line forward.

    That is if we need to make a trade!!

  121. I’m obviously not a fan of Tortorella but every Rangers coach in recent memory has been a line-shuffler. This is down primarily to the dearth of talent on the time. When you’ve got nothing to work with, the hope is that scrambling the crap might result in some brief flash of utility.

  122. I don’t think we need to blame anybody. This team isn’t as deep as we hoped. The 4th line is an AHL line and the 3rd line is a 4th line on any other NHL team. Because of that fact, we are expecting Tortarella to OVER ACHIEVE with this team by making a deep playoff run. That’s not a fair expectation for anyone. I do not (personally) like the line shuffling. You have to ride it out I think. Let things fall into place. But it is what it is and I am not a hockey coach (and I never watch the games)

  123. Not to be the “told you so” guy but at no point did I think this team had any depth at all. Outside of Richards, the roster is exactly the same as it was last year.

  124. wicky

    Realise you weren’t necessarily advocating a trade, just seems a bit backwards to trade before you would try to fix something internally.

    Lloyd

    I won’t profess to know the intimate details of the Lightning dressing room for every moment of his tenure there, but who did he “completely bury”? John Grahame?

  125. Rather unscientific, I admit, but I just Googled “nhl line shuffling” and it seems other teams do it too! I’m stunned.

  126. Mostly a response to jpg on the previous post regarding the Bell pinch goal:

    RNH has just received the puck and shoots quickly.
    http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/843/prusteminger.jpg/

    What should Eminger have done differently?
    And while it may be a 3 on 2, Prust is chasing the play. It’s not like he starts ahead of the play where he’d able face the attackers and split his 2 on 1(who where staggered high and low) more easily – instead he get’s twisted around, he’s not a defenseman obviously

  127. Orr and LW
    while I’m not the biggest advocate of line shuffling to the extent that torts does, I don’t abhor it either. If it is what the team/organization wants to do or is content with, then it is fine with me.

    My biggest knock of torts is the not trusting players enough to let them play in respect to riding a few players waaaay too much leading to diminished player performance towards the end of the season and in the playoffs! (ie, not rolling four lines or using all three d pairings fairly consistently).

    One thing I meant to bring up about the game last night and forgot..we lost some key faceoffs!

  128. Based on how MZA has played for the Whale since he returned there, there is no reason at all that he would be a healthy scratch, so unless he was recalled, which I don’t think he was, I would have to assume that a trade of some sort, that he is a part of, is coming up.

  129. Good afternoon all! Well, at least I don’t have to worry about my not watching the games affecting the end result. Sigh.

    Sally! Cheesteaks!!!

    Just got home from carcilloey work day. Off to chill. Later all….

  130. Look – I think the issue lies with the mental states and abilities of the on-ice players. Dumb penalties, poor faceoffs and a general lack of energy kileld them last night.

    I will say it again and again and again – Asking Torts to take this team to a Cup is asking him to over achieve! By a lot!

  131. Lloyd,

    How is the team exactly the same other than Richards? Did you forget we added Rupp and lost Fankist? And that Caber and Gilroy are gone, and Erixon, Woywitka, and Bell are here in their stead?

    Probably.

  132. Thanks, Latona. Embarrassingly i could not figure out which D-guy was a Prucha’d in favor of Bell. I forgot about Woywhatever. That is how different the team is! I couldn’t name a guy.

  133. Rupp is a bum. The other changes are minor and won’t result in any noticeable differences.

  134. Woywhatever sucks. I can’t wait until Sour, at the very least, comes back. Stahl, I’m willing to be patient on. Concussions are not worth fooling around with.

    I’m pretty sure Crosby, Perron, Mueller, etc, can all play, but it’s not worth the long term risk on and off the ice.

    McDonut is fitting in nicely there, so that’s helping.

  135. McBust is great. Real example of this coaching staff developing a young player. Who I might leave as the top pairing with Girardi no matter who comes back (At least at first). Also, give that kid more PP time.

    Is it a record that I am in last place in all 3 of my fantasy hockey leagues?

  136. The skill level and potential impact of a player does not change the fact that they are now a member of the roster. You should probably clarify your statements rather than leaving them open to incorrect interpretation; I wasn’t trying to make you look like a buffoon.

  137. I don’t know, Latona. “Rupp is a Bum” is a pretty airtight statement. It’s hard to poke holes in that reasoning.

  138. “Outside of Richards, the roster is exactly the same as it was last year.”

    That’s what I was referring to, Ayn Rand.

  139. Orr – I’ve seen the Whale plenty of times, more than the Rangers in the past two years, and I still don’t know what the hell you’re talking about. Are you saying because Gernander isn’t an exciting person, he’s a bad coach? And Gernander coached all the players that I listed. This is his fifth year as coach and fourth as head coach. He’s the epitome of a guy who bleeds blue and a quintessential example of a team player. I would proffer that he played a big role in creating the so-called renaissance we saw last year.

    But if you want a joke, then look no further than behind the Rangers bench now. That, my friend, is a joke.

  140. Yeah, Phil, then when Gernander doesn’t change a thing, next year he’ll be the joke, right?

    Typical New York fan BS. It never changes.

    Like I’ve said, I’ve heard nothing but bad things aboot Gernander. You’re the only person here that has said something positive aboot him.

  141. I don’t really know much about Gernander, ORR, but from the call-ups we’ve made over the last few seasons, he seems to be doing an alright job.

  142. and Gernander did such a great job developing all those players (and he really, truly did) but of course those players all suck. I don’t get the convenience of some of these contradicting opinions.

    And I do think Gernander is/will/would be a good coach.

    Why don’t these guys just say, I have something personal against Tortorella, so I’m going to try and pick apart every little thing I don’t like about him?

  143. you can numerous with 2 stars and alot of 2nd liners if the 2nd liners play like it.

    also not having staal kills, he gets the puck out of the zone and has a nice outlet pass. if staal is in all the lesser d men play a lot less minutes.

    they will be fine… sauer should be back next game or the home opener then they are only short 1 d man…

  144. Latona, that doesn’t mean he’s going to single handedly turn this team into a Cup contender. Not, that I’m saying that’s what *you’re* saying, but apparently, in Phil’s eyes, this guy is the man for the job.

  145. i meant you can win with 2nd liners if you forecheck and dump the puck …

    the problem so far this year is lack of puck possesion and shots on goal. last year they got plenty of shots on goal, they cannot shoot accurately but got plenty of shots……

  146. I don’t think a coach ever single handedly turns a team into a Cup contender, that’s ludicrous. I don’t think Gernander could do any better than Torts has/is. And Gernander shouldn’t even get that opportunity; Tortorella’s been a good coach overall. The tomfoolery needs to end.

  147. Who is this Tortorella guy? I thought the coach was Rammer and his assistant was Marty Biron!?

  148. “Tortorella thinks now that everyone on the roster is totally under his thumb”

    Yeah he’s strutting around the locker like Mick Jagger, lips thing and all. WTB?

    “he found another hump who’s willing to put his tail between his legs and do the coach’s bidding”

    Because what every team really needs is mavericks and renegades? Oh, you mean …

  149. so wicky –
    The second Oiler goal was on the PP. On this particular goal can you point out exactly when the triple crosscheck to the back should have occurred in order to change the result.
    How did Girardi dropping to his knees to block an anticipated shot effect the play? Do you think by staying on his feet he would have gotten back to the crease and cleared it without screening Hank?

  150. Basically what I’m reading suggests that Richards, Fedotenko and Prospal need to have serious counseling for masochistic tendencies. Because all three came back to play for Tortorella. And all three admitted that he was one of the main reasons they wanted to play for NY.

  151. At the end of the day, I don’t think Gernander has really done anything spectacular, from what I’ve read about him from people who cover the team in Hartford. In fact, I think he was at times more focused on giving his go-to AHL guys ice time than develop Ranger prospects. I find it questionable how certain guys were developed and treated there…specifically Grachev, who was a power wing in juniors and mostly played a 3rd line/checking center role for the Pack/Whale in his time there…I think he should have been developed more as a power forward on the top line…now his role is on the fourth line in the NHL and his career is in limbo…although, he did have an assist last night for the Blues…

  152. On that topic, did anybody see Daneyko on HNL explaining what he learned from Larry Robinson (HOF) on staying on your skates and never, unless it’s the most desperate of situations, leaving your feet to go to one knee, or do the belly slide on the ice? And how you use your stick to break up plays?

    That’s what made the Devils defense so good all those years, as much as the trap or the goalie.

  153. Carp
    on #5

    i mentioned it last night
    and bring it up again

    everyone keeps knocking Bell for pinching
    (ok, bad move)
    BUT
    Eminger did NOTHING on that first goal
    when the oiler was getting ready to shoot
    he could he have moved up and taken him out
    or did a stick check
    NO
    he literally turned around to watch the shot go in
    past Hank
    and probably deserved an assist for screening him.
    at least Prust
    was busy trying to take on 2 guys
    while Eminger did zilch

  154. On a different topic, I’d like someone to explain to me what would Avery ( with the way he’s played lately ) bring to the 4th line that would be different from what Newbury does. I’ll tell you what I think Newbury brings. He is a better scrapper and costs almost $1.5m less.

  155. Imagine how amazing the Rangers’ defense would look like if they had Cam Fowler’s 0 goals, 1 assist, and -4 in 6 games patrolling the blueline. Oh, what a wonderful life it would be…

  156. Newbury is a great addition and he’s a quality faceoff guy which you NEED on PPs and icings.

  157. jpg
    how do you feel about the D on the second goal??

    carp
    couldn’t agree with you more!!

    dde
    first of all, OPG takes himself out of any position at all to help by not staying on his feet and my point is hank could not see the puck at all because of the screen, so a D man should be making the guy in front of hank miserable to some extent instead of just watching the goal go in the net.

    Now, if there were two other D men on the ice besides the “golden pair” would you be asking this question?

  158. what’s more irritating and shocking is the same ol same ol
    approach.

    shooting down the board 99% of the time, chase, not get the puck,
    chase opponents back into our zone.
    repeat

    also
    it’s migraine-inducing to still be talking about the power play
    especially when we’re seeing some of the same ol same ol
    bad habits of the past
    such as NOT MOVING AROUND!!!

  159. Orr – again, tell me what it is that makes Gernander such a bad coach, not that you’ve heard he’s boring. I’m saying(and I’ve said) it’s three years now with Tortorella and I’ve seen nothing to suggest he’s doing a good job at coaching. Even if I was to buy the notion that he was responsible for the gritty play we saw last year, I’d have to ask where the hell did it go? Cause it’s gone right now. I see him dress a guy like Christensen season in and season out, and then complain about there not being enough edge or jam in his lineup. I see him say things like ‘we’re going to keep the lineup the same’ even though that same lineup barely eked out a win against one of the worst teams in the NHL and its backup goaltenders. You want to stick your head in the sand and call it ‘typical fan BS’ then fine. I’m simply calling a spade a spade. And Tortorella, he’s a goddamn spade.

    Carp – I’ve never said that any of those players suck. In fact, I think its quite the opposite. They’re the heart of this team. I think they’ve been instilled with the fire they showed last season. Also, why would I have something personal against Tortorella? All I know about the guy is that he’s taken my team and done nothing with it, despite a constant influx of talent. I know some are ticked about the Avery thing, but as far as I’m concerned it’s just another in a long line of poor decisions made and being made by Tortorella. If that’s something personal against the guy, then I guess you’re right.

  160. Yes. -Two- Three tips for this team from my limited knowledge:

    1) Move your feet;
    2) Screen a goalie once in a while; and
    3) Hands to the Chest!

  161. ^H0bbit Wizard^ traded to Canucks for Luongo Straight up. Luongo to stay in Hartford and play for the -Woflpack- Whale

  162. Phil, what has he done to suggest he *is* a good coach?? If anything, he’s very average.

    Gernander will be a successful coach because he coached a few decent prospects. Ha! C’mon! Delusional Torts haters!

    I mean, how do you come to the conclusion that he’s going to do a better job than Torts? That’s just so moronic. What the hell are you basing this on? He hasn’t won anything in the AHL, in fact, unless I’m mistaken, the teams have been average, and probably have not made it to the Conference Final, at least. So, he’ll take over NYR’s bench, and he’ll just turn everything around? Nope! Not happening. Be realistic, and unbiased.

  163. This might be off topic or not the point or something but “here goes”:

    It takes more than just a good coach to win. It takes more than just average players to win. Hockey is a mix of skill, chemistry and luck. I am sure “bad” coaches have won cups with great players and I am sure “great” coaches have never won cups because they never had the talent. We need balance and I think we need to worry about the level of talent on this team before we start worrying about the coaching staff.

  164. Wicky,

    I know you don’t mean that. I just think that if the Rangers had drafted Fowler instead of McIlrath, the people who don’t think that MDZ will ever amount to much would be doubly disappointed in having two very similar players on the team.

  165. Hey, maybe we can hire Melrose instead if Torts. I know he can’t think straight, but can he write neatly?

  166. iWicky (Leeloo Dallas mul-ti-pass) on

    Manny
    Don’t be logical or use common sense here.

    Vinny
    I agree with you completely

  167. iWicky (Leeloo Dallas mul-ti-pass) on

    Melrose is a great developer of talent and handles young players brilliantly. Look how well stamkos plays now!

  168. I’d like to see people who are in Fowler’s camp in a few years when the Rangers dress two Macs as their second pair. McDonugh and McIlrath.

  169. maybe Zuc for cooke.
    he’s lighting it up in pittsburgh!
    (and the refs seem to let him get away with stuff too.
    he’s the anti-Avery!!)

  170. I mean…knowing what happened with D. Weise the ^hobbit wizard^ will probably be waived at some point and then claimed for nothing.

  171. CCCP October 23rd, 2011 at 11:46 am

    Are the Pen()s a better team than the Rangers? Both of their superstars are not in the lineup and yet, they play a great game and keep winning. Staal, Kunitz, Neal? Are they better than Gaborik, Richards, Dubinsky?

    ———————————————————

    LW3H October 23rd, 2011 at 11:55 am

    No, and they are well coached, CCCP.

    But they also won zero playoff rounds without them, blowing a 3-1 series lead, and got upset including Crosbalkin the year before. Which would have had people calling for Bylsma’s head here.

    —————————————-

    sorry i was away and couldn’t answer earlier.

    So you’re saying that Jordan Staal, Kunitz and Neal are NOT better than Gaborik, Richards and Dubinsky and that the Pen()s win with less talented players because they are well coached? Then that means that the Rangers are not well coached? Thank you for admitting it.

  172. So the argument that the Rangers just don’t have enough talent to win consistently sort of goes out of the window. is that right? i’m just sayin’…

  173. Er, nicely manipulated there, CCCP.

    I’d take those three players, but that’s not an admission that the rest of the Pens roster is less talented than the rest of the Rangers roster. The Pens certainly have much more depth on defense right now, for a start.

    Is Bylsma a better coach? Quite possibly. Not the same as saying one team is “well coached” and the other isn’t.

    Point remains, the “failures” of Bylsma and Claude Julien that I’ve referred to would’ve had plenty of people screaming for their heads on here if we’re applying the same standards and levels of patience as we’re apparently applying to Rangers coaches.

  174. I thought the bad rap on Gernander was based on a misconstrued Brooks article, no.

    Definite thumbs up on Newbz so far

    jpg -see my 4:11 post

    wicky-
    First remember it was a PP. The Oilers were spread pretty good and IMO Cally and Dubi didn’t look like they were up to the task.
    Oiler on the left dot has the puck, Girardi come across the block a shot and yes, he slides by him slightly but the puck goes immediately to the point for a one timer.
    Even if Girardi stayed on his feet I don’t think he get’s back in time to clear the crease. Plus, he’d have to push him in front of Hank or bear hug him and pull him back.
    Maybe McD can get a quick shove as Girardi goes out to the circle but he’s guarding the lateral pass to the other circle.

    The last question is silly. I was one of the first people to support Eminger last year after a shaky start when everyone was killing him.

  175. Bylsma’s not a particularly good coach. I think his performance in the playoffs proved that. On the whole, though, I think he’s got a whole lot more to work with than Tortorella and also seems to be better with his players than Tortorella. Apart from the goalies (and maybe 2 D-men) I’m not sure there’s a member of the Penguins roster I wouldn’t take over his counterpart on the Rangers. It’s actually quite painful to have to admit to that.

  176. iWicky (Leeloo Dallas mul-ti-pass) on

    Dde
    My whole premise of my post was twofold….

    OPG who has IMHO played well to this point with less of a penguin routine put himself “slightly” out of position by leaving his feet and then his partner did not “cover” his move by coming to the crease area and attempting to engage the opposing screening forward.

    I was unaware of being short handed meaning if you get out of position a bit you don’t worry about it and try get back. I was also unaware that attempting to clear the crease is also a no no when your d partner has “slightly” taken himself out of position by being “slightly” faked out when short handed.

  177. ddebened
    i’m not blaming Prust on that play
    in fact he covered the guy on his right and
    then tried to make a play on nuge in the center

    i’m just pointing out that people keeping focusing on Bell
    in that situation rather than Eminger

    i was so byfuglien angry when i saw Eminger just turn around
    to watch the shot go in.
    what could he have done.
    he could have stay with nuge and broke up the pass
    he could stickchecked or bodychecked nuge
    once he got the pass
    yes, hockey is a fast sport but the oiler was right there in front of me,
    not a stride or two away.

    btw,
    i’m not a huge Bell fan that i’m trying to defend him
    nor do i hate Eminger. he plays well enough as 3rd pair dman
    and usually makes decent enough plays and some grit
    but
    in that situation i was beyond angry with what he did
    and
    it seemed indicative of the team’s play last night.
    casual and lack of effort

  178. Yay Long Live the ^Hobbit Wizard^ for he is Lord of the Rink.

    @CCCP@ You scared me off!

    Wicky – you’re welcome for the knowledge!

  179. denis pothead sux on

    how about the ridiculous french names? 3 names is a minimium with them. pierre marc so and so. jean luc so and so. marc andre so and so. it already is bad and they are more the problem than hopkins.

  180. I find it ironically humourous that a guy with a 3 name screen name is complaining about people with 3 names!

  181. Speaking of names. Has Todd White been signed by any teams yet? If not, what a waste of talent!

  182. denis pothead sux on

    exactly. Pierre-Luc Letourneau-Leblond marries marie fleury-bergeron and you get pierre andre letorneau-leblond fleury- bergeron

  183. i personally just found it very annoying when giannone and joe kept saying ryan nugent-hopkins this and ryan nugent-hopkins that. like carp said, no disrespect but….. ryan hopkins is good enough. mats zuccarello-aasen.

  184. I love Laduree!!! SO STBU with bad mouthing the French! oh, and bob, the builder, is really working on my last Tambellini!

  185. ilb2001-three-screen-name-heartless-monster on

    I will have to carry the new handle for a while. As my own punishment.

  186. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    Season going exactly as planned..potential high draft pick possibility, so we can get speedy skilled players like the Urlers.

    FIRE SATHER!

  187. Can’t wait to see what they look like tomorrow. This team is like a box of chocolates. You never know what you’re going to get.

  188. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    nosepicker, we wait for dubi to have some good games..then we trade him…sell high, buy low

  189. LW3H

    Not manipulating! You said it yourself…those three Pen()s are not better than our guys but the Pen()s are better coached.

    And I think if Torts had this team improving and playing consistently people wouldnt ask for his head. So far it’s same old same old…

  190. bob The Builder (Not the Bob You are thinking of) on

    nosepicking, problem is that may never happen… just keeping my negative nancy cap on

  191. billybleedsblue on

    What I learned today (by just skimming the blog):

    Doodie needs to stop trying to bait everyone by complaining to Carp that he’s “…trying to bait everyone with throw away Avery references.” Seriously dude-e, you’re not fooling anyone here. Just stop it, k?

    I want brunch with Sally.

    Even when Rex Ryan keeps his mouth relatively shut, Carp will find a way to reference how big his mouth is, and make me chuckle.

    “I like Tortles!” LOL.

  192. wicky – If you’ve got to resort to making things up I guess that says it all. I’ve said nothing close to any of that crap. Thanks for reminding me not to attempt a reasonable discussion with Mr. Objectivity. Now go bang your head against the wall you blog goon RAAARRRRRR!
    lol

  193. dde
    on your last post yes. I didn’t fabricate anything and I was looking at it objectively. If a guy makes a mistake, he makes a mistake. I don’t care who it is or isn’t. OPG didn’t stay on his feet when he got faked out (not the first or last defenceman in the NHL to have that happen) and mcdonut didn’t go cover the man in front, PK or not you don’t leave the guy in front to screen unmolested. That is all I am saying. If it would have been rozy and kaspar (not that one) I would have said the same thing, so I don’t get what you seem to be so bothered by!

  194. “Listen, this is gonna be really quick. I’m not taking any questions. We sucked from head to toe, and we need to move by it. So I’m not going to dissect with you guys. I know you have to do your job, but I’m not answering any questions. OK?”

    Torts rules.

  195. My goalie situation is pathetic as it is without help from other teams ruining my chances at an offensive domination!

  196. Yea, ORR. Ask Latona about our Yahoo! league that we are both in. CAREY PRICE is ruining my life. RUINING.

  197. Torts rules and Avery stinks from head to toe.
    But seriously, we need to start getting the lead in some games so Dubinsky can pad his stats with some empty net goals. That will get him going

  198. wicky –

    Sorry, I probably shouldn’t have made the head comment, I think you said you’ve had some concussion issues.
    I meant like it a football player getting psyched up to hit someone.

    “I was unaware of being short handed meaning if you get out of position a bit you don’t worry about it and try get back.”

    Who said it was OK to not try and get back? And I disagree that he didn’t try, by the time Girardi gets up the puck is in the net. :)
    But the puck is in the net within 2 seconds of Girardis knees hitting the ice. RNH to Potter at the point for a one timer – goal. Look at the clock.
    My contention is that Girardi must move to RNH in the circle and even if he stays on his feet he is not getting back to the crease in time to clear it.
    So it’s immaterial. Of course that’s my opinion, just like it’s your opinion that he could clear the crease and contest RNH with the puck in the circle at the same time.:)

    “I was also unaware that attempting to clear the crease is also a no no when your d partner has “slightly” taken himself out of position by being “slightly” faked out when short handed.”

    Who ever said clearing the crease was a no no? My biggest beef is that you’re claiming this is all a chain reaction as a result of Girardi sliding out of position – I disagree.
    Bottom line, if you allow the passes the Oilers were able to make teams are going to make you look silly. I thought Dubi looked pathetic on the PK slow and loopy.

  199. DDE
    what we have here is a failure to communicate…Or maybe our signals are crossed a bit..

    My original post at 2:54pm was more directed at posters who seem to pick apart certain players positioning or screening of the goalie while other players can do the exact same thing and posters go out of the way to make every excuse in the book for them.

    I do think OPG took himself out of position by doing that, but he does it quite a bit (hence my “wait for it” comment in the post). Then mcdonut did nothing but just watched the puck go in the net because he wasn’t really that close to the guy in front of hank.

    I was being a bit sarcastic with the whole situation because it was OPG and mcdonut, not eminger and bickel or someone else who would have been demoted to the ECHL for such lackluster D by the majority of the posters here 5 seconds after it happened.

    Did OPG take himself out of position…yes, even if it was only slightly. If he would have went immediately and physically engaged the guy (read hit him not go to one knee or slide to block) perhaps he would have been able to disrupt the play, or maybe he would have really been deked out by the oiler and the guy would have walked right in on hank. Bottom line is he was a bit out of position but gets a pass and “not a fault” by most because he is OPG. Same with mcdonut allowing the guy to screen hank.

    It is absolutely a bang bang play and even if the d men had done something different, it is quite possible that the outcome is absolutely the same..PP goal for the oil.

    Like I said, if it were two other d men that made those same decisions and were a bit out of position, they would be riding the short bus in the ECHL by now!!

  200. Orr- Let me answer you point by point:

    “I mean, how do you come to the conclusion that he’s going to do a better job than Torts?”

    Easy. I don’t. But I also know that the Rangers will never win anything more than they’ve already won with the coach they have, because he’s simply not a good coach for this team. Tortorella is a coach that’s good for a team of highly talented primadonnas because he does have that edge. For this team? No. He has no concept of matching lines, can’t work a powerplay with guys that don’t have elite talent and really lacks any sort of discernible system.

    “What the hell are you basing this on? He hasn’t won anything in the AHL, in fact, unless I’m mistaken, the teams have been average, and probably have not made it to the Conference Final, at least.”

    Glad you made that point. Have you seen some of the teams Gernander has inherited? Look at the rosters and what he’s achieved has been phenomenal. Mind you, he doesn’t have much of a say into who does and who doesn’t come onto his roster. Those decisions are based largely on what the big club is doing. And for years, the big club was basically devoid of talent. Even now, the Whale aren’t exactly what you’d call a talent-laced organization.

    “So, he’ll take over NYR’s bench, and he’ll just turn everything around? Nope! Not happening. Be realistic, and unbiased.”

    Never said that. I’m saying I’d rather give Gernander a shot behind the bench because he has the pedigree of the type of coach I’d like running my roster. As a player, he was a consummate team-first guy, about as unselfish as they get. He was always a class-act through and through. And he’s continued on this was as a coach. He’s also young and not far removed from his playing career. That’s something young players identify with, rather than a barking foul-mouthed jackass, who tends to play favorites.

    In summation, I’m not saying Gernander is some sort of messiah who will magically lift the Rangers to the cup. I’m saying he’s a better fit for this team than Tortorella, whose best days coaching are well behind him. So go ahead and bag on me if you want. I simply don’t see what it is about Tortorella that you think is so great. We’re on year four, the third full one, and yet the team is suffering the same problems it was suffering when he got here. But hell, far be it from me to stop you from making excuses for the guy. Go ahead. Fool yourself into believing he’s some great motivator. I hope you’re right, but I know you’re wrong.

  201. Phil, what happens if Gernander coaches this team, and nothing changes? Same results, same stats from the players. Then what?

    Lemme guess, Fire Gernander, Hire Graves??

    Agree to disagree, I suppose.

    Dd, that’s hilarious. I love crap like that!

  202. Can we change the ‘C’ to stand for Chip and maybe Cally will play with one on his shoulder?

  203. manny
    sadly, yes. The best part is, had to see a neurologist a year or so back and was speaking to him and kept saying 12 and then mrs wicky was like umm 13 babe. Doc says, clearly you are still having problems

  204. Hmm, you have a suggestion wicky?

    If it was a ‘P’ I’d say parrot.

    Attitude, but it’s not shoulder related. hmm

  205. We can rotate the ‘C’ a quarter turn to look like a U and he can have our Underdog back.

    Oh where, oh where has my Underdog gone, Oh where, oh where can he beeee?

  206. Maybe Cally’s heads caught between Torts call for an end to the stupid penalties and the bad boarding penalty called on him against the Ducks. Probably silly to suggest that because Cally has never had a problem with penalties considering the gritty style he used to play.

  207. I thought I was on my way to an Ovechtrick until Carp broke it up, sliding of course, but I won’t go there

  208. billybleedsblue on

    All the talk around here about toe-sucking has me surprised that Rex Ryan hasn’t started posting…

  209. Teams will be prepared to match the effort the Rangers played with last year.
    I think the Rangers are playing with next years effort.

Leave A Reply