Hockey Monday

182

Well, today there’s the Ilya Kovalchuk decision, we think. Or everybody thinks. It will be very, very interesting going forward if the arbitrator rules that the NHL was just to nullify the Devils’ clever, but apparently legal, contract.

If so, then what happens? Does L.A. suddenly get involved again? The KHL? Does Lou Lamoriello have a Plan B (I’d be willing to bet my house that he does, because that’s what makes him the best GM in sports).

———————————

Also, getting a kick out of the way all the dot.coms picked up Larry Brooks’ story yesterday and ran with it, like it’s news that the Rangers might Wolf Pack Wade Redden (new verb there, did you catch it?).

I thought his column yesterday was very good, and well thought out, and brought up a really interesting “what if?” The gist, for those who didn’t read it, was “what do the Rangers do if Redden took the warnings seriously, worked out all summer, and turns out to be their best defenseman in training camp? Do they still Wolf Pack him?”

My feeling is that, yes, they still do, because shedding that salary is a necessity now, and it will be a necessity in the near future; and because I am pretty certain that when John Tortorella, on break-up day, went on and on about the need to change the room he was clearly talking about expunging Redden and Olli Jokinen. Redden would have to be Bobby Orr or Brian Leetch at camp in order to justify his salary and to change Tortorella’s thick mind.

And to add to Brooks’ thoughts, I think Todd White is not penciled in to be the No. 1 or No. 2 center, and that there’s just as much chance that he will be Wolf Packed as well. Though I believe White will get a shot to stay. He’s a low-risk guy.

——————————————-

There. We did it. We talked hockey on Aug. 9. Now get back to your gibberish.

About Author

182 Comments

  1. The day the rangers get rid of Drury, redden and rosivals contracts off the cap is the day the rangers can start seeing the light of building a contending team.

  2. Things sure got contentious yesterday. You could tell it’s the month before training camp. You know I always told my youngest daughter ignore them when their giving you a hard time but she never listened either. I have thought long and hard about the Kovalchuk decision and my only thought is that they may trim a few years off that contract and make the cap hit higher. I think the Devils blatently tried to circumvent the cap. The NHL didn’t flinch at any of the other stretched out contracts. I just don’t know what the arbitrator will base his decision on.

  3. I said it before and I’ll say it again …
    NHL Arbitrators are a joke !!

    They always just “split the difference” between what both parties are asking for, and this Kovalchuk case will be No Different

    I will bet any amount of money that they just make the contract 6 million bucks a year for the full-term of the contract …

    NJ gets they’re low cap hit and Kovy still gets his 100 million dollars but it will call Kovy’s bluff that he fully intends on playing out the full contract and not retire early

  4. tomg have to agree wholeheartedly. I will never understand how he(sather) handcuffed the team so badly with big contracts that none of those players deserved even on their best day. They were all on the downside when they were signed.

  5. I think that the arbitrator today can only rule: Yes, it’s a good contract, or No, it isn’t. Then Kovalchuk becomes a UFA again. I don’t think there’s any compromising to be done today. I could be wrong about that.

    Good morning, Sally!

  6. onecupin70yearsand counting on

    Brooks article just confirms that the rangers are in the septic tank.
    The follies that dolan has created with both the knicks and rangers should have the fans refusing to buy tickets.

    borderline good doesn’t cut it.
    It will be a long long wait for a championship banner to be hung in MSG.

  7. tomg – what we have to hope for is that between now and the post-Redden/Roszival/Drury era he doesnt sign someone else to an all-mighty-balls-up of a contract like those guys.

    What would be nice is for all the young guys to blossom (McD, Grachev, Stepan, Kreider etc) and naturally use the cap space to retain them and acquire one or two stars to complement Gabby and Hank.

    Any time on the Kovalchuk announcement yet?

  8. Carp,
    I think Redden is just as low a risk as White. As bad as he’s been, he’s still performed as a capable 5th or 6th defenseman for the Rangers. If they’re going to try to contend for a playoff spot this year, they might not be so quick to dismiss.

    While they could stay under the cap with several combinations of moves, I believe either Redden or White will be in the AHL as long as White is not placed on Long Term Injured Reserve.

  9. Tockey Halk!

    What do I know, but I think Kovy’s contract passes. The league has made it’s point going in to a new CBA, but the contract is legal. Yeah, maybe not by the spirit of the law but by the letter of the law- yes.The NHL will bite the bullet on this one IMHO.

  10. First of all, I’m not sure Redden gets wolfpacked, and not because he may miraculously impress in camp. I’ll believe that Dolan will eat that contract only when I see it. I think there’s still a good chance he’s on the big team and others will have to be expended to get under the cap, if necessary (White, Gilroy?). They can always reassess Redden to Hartford mid-season if they need the cap space at the trade deadline.

    That said, Brook’s far-fetched scenario of Redden showing up having worked his butt off and holding a bottle of go-go juice from the fountain of youth may actually work to Dolan’s advantage. Think about it. Redden was pissed when he got scratched for a few games last year (2 was it?). How’s he going to feel if after having worked so hard, impersonating a top pair defenseman in camp, and he gets cut anyway?

    He’s got $23 mil coming to him, so he’s not walking away from most of it. But the prospect of riding the bus in minors for the next four years if he believes he’s got more left in the tank, and a great camp to prove it at least in his own mind, may lead him to take a lesser buy-out now so he can run to Europe or the KHL. He may see that as a better option than sticking around for the duration to collect every penny from the Rangers and never seeing the pro-level again. Dolan may wind up saving him a few bucks if it plays out that way.

  11. Wicky,

    you asked about the post where somebody mention not getting along with a team mate…here is th quick explanation.

    Poster Rod Gilbert came to the blog stating that he had insid sources and inside info and wonders why nobody here talked hockey. We all called bs on him and told him to spill the goods or go away. So this morning his big reveal was that the rangers wanted Willie Mitchel but there was a reason that Mitchel didn’t want to be a ranger and rod asked if we knew why. Basically nobody cared until someone ventured the guess that Mitchel had a problem with a former wild player which would be eithe gabby or the boogeyman. It was just a guess at rods comment.

    Make sense?

    My question is…how the hell can we as a blog be discussing something that only somebody with inside info would no about??? But that’s just me and my logical mind getting in the way of rods fantasy world.

  12. Hey, we like jiberrish. And gibberish too to some extent.

    Carp is right. The NHL didn’t question the length of the contract or the money paid per se, or any other technical details. The contract was rejected based on their suggestion that it was written out to circumvent the CBA. Hence, the arbitrator can only rule whether the contract is legal or it is an attempt to circumvent the CBA. If you want more explanation (and migraine), go to Rodent’s website.

  13. As much as I hope the arbitrator rules that the contract is invalid, I think it’ll go the other way.

    Redden’s a goner even if he plays like Orr AND Leetch combined. White’s a nice insurance policy if someone else can’t cut it on the Top 3 lines.

  14. Argh, damn iPhone and it’s sensitive touch pad…looks like I missed about 500 letters there.

    Anyway, rods situation reminds of when tr808 first came on the scene and nobody believed his connections until he came through with the knowledge a few times.

    See rod? All you have to do is post your news and we will accept you and discuss your info.

  15. OK, capologists here’s a question for you. Let’s say Redden has a very good camp and another team notices. The Rangers trade Redden with the agreement to pay half of his salary. Does that half count against the cap?

  16. Cross Check Charlie,

    I’m not 100% sure, but I believe trading salary is forbidden by the collective bargaining agreement. It would be a way for a team to circumvent the salary cap.

  17. Cross Check- You can’t split a contract like that anymore. Unless the player in question is on re-entry waivers like Avery was. It’s one of those new-fangled CBA rules.

  18. Re:Redden. It all comes down to cap numbers, folks.

    The Rangers now are at $59.347M. That number includes $1.312M bonus cushion (MDZ and Prospal). They can still add $5.94M during the summer. Staal’s contract will eat up $4.5-5M. Even if they use the cushion by deferring the bonuses until next year, they will still have to shed off close to $4M. That will take 2-3 players/contracts. That’s why Redden is gone.

  19. Carp- Please tell me once again that the Rangers are high on Gilroy.

    Not that I doubt – but what is TR’s connection?

  20. So, why couldn’t the Rangers waive Redden, send him to Hartford, make the trade agreement (wink, wink), then subject him to re-entry waivers knowing that the other team will pick him up?

  21. CCC- MickeyM is right. But if he is picked up on reentry, the Rangers are on the hook for half of his cap hit. That’s why once he is in CT, he never comes back.

  22. ilb,
    White+Gilroy = $4.125m

    White may be washed up and I don’t think Torts like Gilroy much. So there’s your expendables. Not saying it would be the right thing to do, just saying that’s where they find the cap room, and still keep Redden.

  23. Cross Check Charlie,
    Because:
    a) any team could claim Redden at half price which is not astronomically off from his actual value. That one team probably wouldn’t be the only team putting in a claim.
    b) instead of the Rangers having the option of clearing Redden’s salary completely from the NHL books, they would be on the hook for half his salary for the remainder of the contract regardless of where he’s playing.
    c) any agreement of that sort could raise eyebrows for CBA circumvention
    d) they would have to acquire something for something in a separate trade. they can’t acquire a resource from the target team without sending something in return. the nhl would not take kindly to one team “gifting” something to another

  24. ilb,

    Well once Redden is in Hartford, he can come back. But he can only come back during the next off season.

  25. Question for someone who knows more than me. Could Redden, seeing his Wolf Packing (new verb tense) as a fait accompli, approach the Rangers and offer to renegotiate his contract at a lower salary level?

    Obviously this would require Wade to forgo significant $$ but he would greatly increase the likelihood that he’d be able to play in the NHL over the next few years rather than ride the bus.

    Is this even an option under the CBA?

  26. Why not Darren? The Stars “gifted” Avery to us.

    CCC brings up another interesting wrinkle. If some tean thought Redden could play at a decent level for four years (stop laughing for a minute), and was willing to pay $3.2m because they thought he was worth it or because they needed to reach a floor, or both, then Dolan may like that scenario the best. Saves him $10-12 million in real cash. He could use that money to pay Isiah!!

  27. Ddebened,

    that I know of, tr has never outed his source on the blog. But he definitely knows somebody because he’s had some good scoops right as they happened. If I’m not mistaken, he did email the name of source to a few senior boneheads.

  28. CGBlue- yes, and I do believe that White is going to AHL along with Redden unless he widely outplays EC. And there is no way he is playing as 3rd line center for $2.3M cap hit. Gilroy will be given a chance, I hope. Either way, if they clear the way you proposed, the team will have no wiggle room and will have to defer bonuses until the next year.

    Darren- very true, his hit will count against our cap during next summer. Until he is sent down again.

  29. You cannot re-work contracts. Best case scenario is redden pulls a naslund and retires. Ain’t happening.

  30. Cap question for those who know………

    If redden is demoted during the season, and is never recalled, what’s the cap effect?

  31. So a possible scenario is he starts the season up here, $4m or so gets sent down (ie white, others) and they demote Redden during the season, only if they need to make a move.

    Hate to bang the same drum but looking more to me that he’s not going anywhere, at least to start the season. Of course, it all revolves around the Staal number.

  32. Staal will re-sign. It’s just a matter of when, I believe. Though LB makes a good point about Staal not being so eager to get into camp as Dubinsky was last year.

  33. Carp, what does Torts mean when he says he wants to change the locker room? We all know Redden is an awful player at this stage of his career and the Rangers need to wolf pack him. Does he have attitude problems and/or personality clashes with other teammates too?

  34. ilb,

    If demoted mid-season, Redden’s cap hit isn’t exactly pro-rated by games played, but it’s close. It would be pro-rated by service days.

  35. TheREALMikeyNJ on

    Redden will have to have Jesus Christ himslef with him in training camp to make the team

    There’s way too many reasons to send him to HArtford, no matter how well he plays

    and honestly, is anyone on thsi blog stupid enough to beleive “idiot LArry’s ideas of him coming to camp “In shape”, Showing he’s a top D Man”. PLease we’ve now seen two seasons of his play. and HE SUCKS!! Period and at 33 or 34 he aitn getting no better

    At best he’s a 5th 6th or 7th Dman on any other team
    Has a HUGE salary
    Doesnt get alot of points
    Doesnt hit alot,
    doesnt protect Hank

    Bye Bye Redden, take your $$ and go away casue you aint on the team this year

    And who says Torts doesnt like Gilroy? Every quote I read has him saying he had a rough Freshman year, knows what he needs to do in the offseason to improve

    Sounds liek he’s giving him every opportunity

  36. GCBlue,

    The Stars didn’t “gift” Avery to us in the proposed “trade” way. We didn’t send anything to the Stars, we just took half of Avery’s salary burden off their hands. And right now we can easily see why they were glad to accept that real money savings as they’re in the midst of bankruptcy. We sure could put Redden through re-entry waivers. But he will probably be claimed by a team and we’d have that half cap hit locked in for the remainder of his contract.

  37. GCBlue,

    Oh and even though the team would only be on the hook for a pro-rated portion of Redden’s contract if he started the season with the team, no team is allowed to ever be over the cap. And at any point that Redden’s on the team, the full value of his contract sits on the cap. So at the beginning of the season he still counts $6+ million against the cap and we’d have to clear the Staal cap hit by sending other players down to Hartford – White and Gilroy being the prime suspects as you’ve mentioned.

  38. Pavel,

    We could say the same thing about Del Zotto at this point. But they’re both still inexperienced at the NHL level.

  39. GCBlue – I’m in your boat for a number of reasons. I simply can’t see any right-minded business simply throwing away $6.5 million for nothing. Redden would become by far, the highest paid AHLer ever…

    Here’s something to kick around…if(and this is a big ‘if’)Redden does get demoted, who’s to say he reports? I know there’s 23 million reasons WHY he would. But there’s also a big reason why he wouldn’t: Getting demoted would ensure he remains in Hartford until at least the post season, since he’d need to come through re-entry waivers to get back to the NHL. And as lame as Redden is, he would get snapped up in a heartbeat if his cap his was $3.25 million(which it would be if he were claimed)…So basically, at 33, Redden would be faced with playing a year in a grinding league. No more limos to the game, no more special treatment. True, if he walks on the contract, he’s basically walking on money that is his.

    And then there’s the nuclear option: Play him in Hartford for a year and buy him out.

  40. Izzy Mandlebaum on

    Carp, what does Torts mean when he says he wants to change the locker room?

    He wants to get the logo off the floor so no one will step on it anymore… It’s been on his mind since he became coach.

  41. We could also see if Redden would accept a loan to a European team. But that European team would have to present an offer compelling enough for him to accept.

  42. Darren
    I think we’re saying the same thing. My point was that Dolan may love it IF some team thinks Redden can still play. He’ll save a lot of real money if the re-entry route works vs. a straight buy-out. And he may not give a damn about the four year 50% cap hit.

  43. TheREALMikeyNJ – Just to play devil’s advocate…Redden WAS among the league’s top defenders not too long ago. This guy put up 50 points just four years ago. Now I know hockey ages one’s body pretty quickly after 30. But this is a guy who has never had much of an issue with injury…personally, I think either something’s haywire in his head, he just doesn’t care, or he’s got a substance abuse problem…maybe all three. You just don’t drop off that badly that quickly.

  44. I may be naive here, but I think Torts likes Gilroy … just that Gilroy wasn’t ready when forced into the lineup last year and especially not ready for what was — remember? — a very intense final two weeks.

    Tortorella was involved in Gilroy signing here, having had him at World Juniors or something. I think he gets every chance to play this year.

    And, yes, I believe if Redden plays his ass off in camp it makes possible the opportunity to put him through waivers, then recall him, have him claimed for another team at half price, and have half his salary come off the books.

    Hockey talk. Yawn.

  45. GCBlue,

    Hmm that’s a great point. But I don’t see Dolan being frugal. He’s never shown it with the uncapped Knicks and as far as I’ve heard, MSG is not that cash-strapped.

  46. Carp

    You really think some team would be stupid enough to take on his of his remaining salary/cap hit just because he plays his ass off in camp?

    If I’m another team, I at least need to see some effort in regular season games before I make that leap.

  47. Phil,

    He put up 50 points with tons of power play time. His even strength performance hasn’t slipped much. But he receives nil on the power play now. If he were to receive 1st or 2nd unit power play time, we may see a boost in Redden’s total points. But is he likely to get time at the point?

  48. Dolan is not frugal when it comes to the NYK and NYR.

    He is, however, set in his way, regardless of winning or losing. I think it’s fairly obvious if the Yankees ran a team like the Rangers, Sather would be out. I could definitely see the Yankees, however, giving Isiah Thomas – a good, misunderstood man – a second chance. The Yankees were known for second chances. And I don’t believe for one minute the reports from Frank Asshola that Isiah will be the next President, GM, or coach of the Knicks. Isiah is with the organization in a minimal role, and he does have a knack for scouting young talent, and garners great respect from the younger players in the NBA.

  49. CR9,

    I think some team would take him at half price right now if they could. Based solely on his last few seasons, he’s not good but he’s also not awful. And there’s a place in the NHL for that. $3.25 million might be a little too much, but some needy team would say that the few hundred thousand dollar difference in his actual value and $3.25M is not too bad.

  50. CR9,

    Isiah Thomas is a “good, misunderstood man?” No he is not. He was found to have sexually harassed an employee. He’s a dirtbag through and through.

  51. And in regards to Thomas’ being a good evaluator of young talent: he’s run a whole league and an NBA franchise into the ground as a GM.

  52. Darren, you are right, my bad. It is pro-rated by service days. 186 days being a full regular season.

    Carp- do you really think the Rangers would be willing to be on the hook for $3.25M of Redden’s cap hit through 2013-2014?

  53. ilb, no, I don’t. I’m just saying it opens that possibility. I think they’d just as soon eat the whole salary and get it off the books by wolfpacking him.

  54. Darren

    Perhaps on Redden.

    Isiah was not cut out to be a GM. He still, however, remains a good evaluator of young talent. As for the sexual harassment, do you think I’m going to believe someone attacking a New York Knick employee? No, and I’ll leave it at that. Perhaps his “sexual harassment” was just a simple misunderstood gesture.

  55. ilb asked an even better question re: Redden than mine. I hope we aren’t stupid enough to keep $3+ million on our cap for a few years just to save money. That would show a total lack of caring about the franchise by Dolan.

  56. CR9,

    There was a mountain of evidence against him and more than a gesture, a documented pattern of behavior. It was all over the news. Are you implying that all NY Knicks employees are inherently good people? I want some of that juice.

  57. Darren

    lol! I’ll try to get you some of that juice. The juice is called loyalty.

    I refuse to listen to negative news about my teams. So if what you say is true, he made some mistakes. Who hasn’t? He deserves a second chance, just like Darryl Strawberry, Dwight Gooden, and Lawrence Taylor.

  58. CR9,

    I’m loyal to teams. Not criminals and miscreants. And I feel for Gooden and Strawberry who struggled through addictions. That is separate from my Mets fandom and I don’t blindly believe they are or were innocent.

    But all of this is irrelevant to this forum. We should keep the discussion to the Rangers.

  59. Darren – that’s a good point re: Redden. Now here’s the part I don’t understand: Wasn’t he brought in here to run the PP? That was my assumption. Tyutin, who had the monster shot from the point, was traded…Redden is brought in. At the time, wasn’t the Rangers’ PP struggling something fierce?

    Carp – Agree on Gilroy. A lot of people forget he only switched to defense in college. I’d be surprised if he isn’t in the top-6…now on Redden, you say a demotion, then waivers could be a possibility. In that case, wouldn’t it be better to just buy the guy out? Or can they even do that at this point?

    BTW…was reading the whole ‘Rod Gilbert’ thread with passing fancy…He asked a question: Why isn’t Willie Mitchell a Ranger? I’ve got two answers: First, he’s not that great of a defenseman to begin with and is coming off a concussion. Second, the Rangers have EIGHT defensemen under contract, plus a couple more banging on the door in Hartford. Why the hell would they sign the guy?!?

    I’ve long speculated the man the Rangers were trying to get was Shoanne Morissonn…lo and behold, Brooks confirmed my thoughts yesterday. And to think, that was without insider info…

  60. Cracking up over ‘wolf pack’ being a new verb. Carp, you should be an English teacher, giving all the young’uns lessons in how to invent new words and new meanings.

  61. In regards to Gilroy and to an extent Del Zotto… I think the length of the season and how hard it is caught up to both of them. And Torts knew it, but he had to make a decision on who to play and at that point, Del Zotto was a better option than Gilroy so he played.

  62. Phil,

    That’s what they said at the time. And Redden does have a decent low slap shot, probably second to Rozsival in that department on the team. But Redden received almost no PP time last year. The year before, he received the lions share at the point and struggled. But that year the Rangers power play as a whole was the worst in the league (lowest goals per power play minute of any team).

  63. As far as Gilroy goes, I think he gets a decent chance since Sather admitted in the Gross interview that he thought Gilly had been mishandled and they made some mistakes with him.

  64. Wow the carcillo was flying all over the blog yesterday… We so need the season to start!!!

  65. CR, I can only imagine how you’d react if the GM of the Celtics did the exact same things Thomas did …

    No, he doesn’t deserve a second chance.

    Phil, thanks for answering Rod’s question. I didn’t want to engage him any more. If he knows something, he should cough it up. If he doesn’t …

    But, no, buying out Redden would cost plenty in terms of dollars and cap hit. Over twice the length of the contract. Better to wolfpack him and have it come off the books completely.

    Linda, don’t know if it’s safe. Seems to be — for the moment.

    Glad I make somebody laugh, Mickey.

  66. i still dont understand how the arbitrator can side with the Devils here. This has nothing to do with not liking the devils, i just dont see how they can argue that its not circumventing the cap.

  67. Blueshirt in Paris on

    Blogmama, don’t think we had that discussion but does that mean I should post them?

    i will try but every time I post a link it goes to ‘awaiting moderation’

  68. Carp August 9th, 2010 at 2:11 pm

    CR, I can only imagine how you’d react if the GM of the Celtics did the exact same things Thomas did …
    ————————————————

    Carp

    You don’t have to imagine how I would react, because I will tell you how I would react. I would call the Celtics GM a s-bag. The reason why is because I freely acknowledge my the double standard I hold between the Boston teams and my New York teams.

    However, the real question you should be asking, Carp, is what the reaction of the media would be if the Celtics GM was accused of the same things Thomas was accused of.

    Because you clearly will acknowledge the double standard I hold even though my opinion doesn’t matter in the slightest but you completely ignore the double standard the entire media holds between Boston teams and New York teams.

    With the utmost respect, you Carp, appear completely willing to bash A-rod for his use of PED’s (with Texas from 01-03) but don’t have the same zeal for bashing Big Roidy for his non-answers and evasiveness regarding his PED usage.

    __

    I dropped the conversation after Darren rightly asked to no longer continue it. I shouldn’t have said anything in the first place. My mistake.

  69. Izzy Mandlebaum on

    CR9- “You don’t have to imagine how I would react, because I will tell you how I would react. I would call the Celtics GM a s-bag. The reason why is because I freely acknowledge my the double standard I hold between the Boston teams and my New York teams.”

    Credibility, meet toilet.

  70. Izzy Mandlebaum on

    Sorry, Picker. I shook up my Crystal Ball and the reply was “Ask again Later”. I think you can handle that…

  71. And I get an absolutely ridiculous response. Actually, those lines you quoted are an example of Honesty, Credibility, Integrity. Those 3 terms are something the Boston-loving national media has none of.

  72. Good to see Cote retired for the Flyers. That guy took too many poundings from Orr to return to fighting. Pretty young age to retire, but it’s not like he has any uses anyway. There are “goons” and then there’s *goons*. All he could do is fight, and nothing more, and he looks insanely ugly.

    His face is probably what Carcillo’s ass looks like. Hopefully we never know the truth!

  73. I thought you were past immature insults, Izzy. I guess I was wrong. Have a good day Izzy. Have a good day all!

  74. Orr,
    Are you implying that goons should retire if their only skill is fighting? That would mean Boogaard should retire. I thought you were pro enforcers.

  75. Interesting debate going on over at Andrew Gross’ blog about if the letters are going to be changed at all this year. With all 3 of last year’s guys back, I don’t see that changing one bit, but what do you guys think?

  76. side show sean on

    i think torts was talking about redden, jokinen and avery. one down two to go

  77. mickey the more important issue is when is dubinsky going to be traded. the team will not be good until he’s gone.

  78. My thoughts are that letters hardly matter. A leader leads whether or not he has a C or an A on his chest.

    The only significance of the letters is determining minutiae like what food gets delivered to the locker room.

  79. picker, did Dubinsky turn you down for a date or something? Every day you ask that question makes me think it’s a personal vendetta you have against him. And I think he’ll be here for at least this year, if not longer. They wouldn’t trade him for Heatley last year, what makes you think they’ll trade him now.

  80. Agreed, Darren. I think Avery and Hank and Rozy are all leaders, even if they didn’t wear letters last year (well, for 99.9 percent of the year for Rozy. I think he wore an A at least for a few games last year, but my memory may be hazy.). I brought it up as another thing we could talk about during the dog days of August.

  81. Blueshirt in Paris on

    Thanks all…was hoping we could get a picture with it but they didnt set it up that way.

    Still kinda funny that after all these years I wind up seeing the Cup in Paris. Never would have guessed that.

    Wife (who is pushing the stroller, not Marcel Marceau) asked if we should wait around for an autograph..I laughed out loud while explaining his is most likely a minor leaguer next year and if I were him I would go into hiding on Mont Blanc with the cup and never go back.

  82. just want the team to get better. just like wicky wants a crease clearing defenseman the nose picker insists on dubinsky being traded. its not personal its business

  83. Blueshirt in Paris,

    What are the options like for following NY sports in Europe? Can you connect for live streams for most events? Are some events picked up for local tv?

    I’m considering a trans-continental move.

  84. “Are you implying that goons should retire if their only skill is fighting? That would mean Boogaard should retire. I thought you were pro enforcers”

    Yeah, goons should retire more earlier. I am *not* pro enforcer. They’re not needed, and are a waste of money, unless they’re getting the league minimum.

  85. MickeyM,

    Well-put. I can’t imagine any of those three guys being anything but leader-types in their own ways.

  86. Blueshirt in Paris – great pix , I think I see a future hard hitting, crease clearing defense man

    BANJ – LOL I love silly stuff like that, no offense BIP

    Darren- exactly

  87. it is not about whether the contract is legal. it is about whether the contract is VALID according to NHL bylaws. and the league ruled that the contract is an attempt to circumvent the cba rules, thus it is INVALID.

    I agree that the contract is legal but it is also INVALID because it clearly tries to circumvent the cba rules by pretending that Kovalsuck will be playing for minimum salary at age 44 in the nhl. we all know that ain’t gonna happen.

    thus, it is up to Lou to rework the contract to satisfy the rules, or let him sign with someone who will

  88. Speaking of Rozy, I’m going to go out on a limb here and say that I think he’s a better d-man that we as fans give him credit for. Yes, he has his moments when we all scream for him to shoot the puck or take the body, but overall, he’s actually a better than decent defensemen. With the D as young as it is, I like him as the steady, veteran leader of this core and I do think that he is appreciated and liked him that locker room, especially amongst the younger D. IF Torts was to make a change with letters, I would have no problem with him getting an ‘A’. I prefer that one ‘A’ goes to a forward and another to a defensemen anyway. Gives both groups someone acknowledged to look to for some leadership.

  89. Yet having said that, if a young player, or any player really, has leadership qualities, I have no issue with them stepping forward and showing it when they are comfortable with it. It takes a heck of a lot of confidence to be a leader in a locker room full of other players, some of whom are veterans and others who are essentially their peers, and I very much admire players who are willing to step up and do that, no matter how few years they have in the league.

  90. totally disagree about Rosival. don’t forget, he was a 3rd pair dman for several years in Pitt. thus, he is not well regarded except in Satherland, where they think he is a first pair guy. that is nuts.

  91. MickeyM,

    I agree with you about Rozsival. Let’s see how quickly his detractors come out swinging.

  92. If given the choice, who would you pick then- Rozy or Redden? I’d take Rozy by a long shot. I’d even take Rozy over Campbell from Chicago.

  93. Blueshirt in Paris on

    Darren,

    Not many choices at all…at least for Hockey. You might have a better chance for Yankees but even that would be tough.

    I use Hockeystreams.com. Not bad for the price but doesn’t seem like it keeps up with the live stream very well..But due to the time difference I watch it the next day on archive, then have no streaming issues.

    ddebened, thanks but I doubt it. always wanted my boy to play hockey but not much of that here in Paris. :(

  94. Well if the argument is that Rozsival once played on a third pairing and is thus precluded from advancing, then what hope do we have for Del Zotto and Gilroy who shared third pairing time last year?

  95. rosival being the choice over redden is like being the choice over crap. big deal. he is a second pair dman and a very soft one to boot.

  96. dde – doing ok. watching the red sox game (said for tims benefit). saw the fun on the blog yesterday was away celebrating some family birthdays including my own(26). glad i stayed out of it though. you doing ok?

  97. Not pushing Roszi for the Norris Trophy but I think he’s gotten some what of a raw deal

  98. MDZ and Gilroy will be relegated to 5th pairing this year. Didn’t anyone hear that? ;)

  99. Most stats peg Rozsival as a good 2nd pairing guy (~70th among defenders). If he had more power play time, he would probably move up to 40-60 among defensemen. That would make him a first pairing guy. The difference between him and a first pairing guy is basically PP contribution right now.

  100. I don’t think Rozsival is gonna win us a cup, but I think he was much better last season. He had fewer panic stricken moments – I think he was afraid of getting hit the year before. He played a lot of minutes last season and did ok. I think he is an adequate defenseman, just overpaid. He’s one of only a few who seemed to get better under Torts.

  101. And this whole ‘soft’ thing irks me to no end. Not every d-man is a banger- see Leetch, Brian or Keith, Duncan for examples. I dare anyone to tell me they wouldn’t want either of those players on the team, despite the fact that neither of them are bangers and could be considered ‘soft’ by a lot of people’s standards.

  102. Gift of GAB-orik (Welcome back Carp!) on

    What is taking so long? are they trying to work out an 11th hour deal with ESPN for “The Ruling” ?

    Proceeds to go to charity of course.

  103. Rozi is nowhere near as bad as some fans make him out to be (myself included sometimes) and nowhere near as good as Sather thinks he is (or thought he was when he decided to pay him $5m per). Not his fault Sather put another dent in the cap when he threw all that money his way. That’s just a bad move by the GM, not the player. You’d take the fool’s money too.

  104. Gift of GAB-orik (Welcome back Carp!) on

    The arbitrater has to have made up his mind already. WTB is going on?

  105. bill check ebay. you will be surprised at some of the good bargains out there 1/2 price

    if you are still looking in a month or so – i might be able to combine forces with you. i know guys who have 4 tickets and they usually want to sell all 4 together at cost, and oftentimes i only need 2. i have not touched base with them this year so far.

  106. you are comparing apples and oranges again. Leetch and Keith are great with the puck as well as good defenders. they don’t have to do Beuk-type hitting. blowsival, on the other hand, is NOT great with the puck or mobile like they are, so what does he bring, crease clearing? hah.

  107. GCBlue, exactly! Rozy’s overpaid, IMO, but he’s a darn good defenseman who has his faults. Kinda like a certain forward on this team who is vastly overpaid, but is a better player than people are giving him credit for. But that’s another arguement for another day. Hate the contract, not the player.

  108. it is ridiculous for anyone to bring up names of all star, Norris type players like Leetch and Keith in the same sentence with a nobody like Rosival

    and also he ACCEPTED the money. thus, he better live up to it or we will boo his arse just like we boo the jerk who gave it to him

  109. I was comparing ‘types’ of defensemen, not saying that Rozy is anywhere’s near Leetch or Keith in terms of ‘type’ of player or talent. I’ll be the first to admit that Rozy is nowhere’s near them in terms of talent and that he is not even that ‘type’ of defenseman.

    I just think that he’s better than people give him credit for.

  110. Also, if someone offered you his contract, you’d take it in a heartbeat. And then do your very best to live up to that contract, which I believe that he has at the very least tried to do. Granted, the results have not been there and I cannot argue that fact. There is no way that he could live up to the expectations foisted upon him by that contract, but again, that is Sather’s fault and not Rozy’s.

  111. Yup, hate the contract, not the player = Hate the GM.

    And I’m not going to compare him to Redden, but isn’t comparing him to a Hall of Famer like Leetch swinging the pendulum completely the other way? A bit unfair, no?

    Rozi’s a decent D-man who logs tons of minutes, plays hurt, and seems like a decent pro. Again, can’t blame him because Sather decided to overpay. Although, if I recall, the market price for D-men was pretty inflated two yrs ago, wasn’t it?

  112. ZzZz NYR ZzZz " Frolov is getting Prucha's #25 !! " … says Greg L. on

    Cr9 ,” . I think it’s fairly obvious if the Yankees ran a team like the Rangers, Sather would be out. I could definitely see the Yankees, however, giving Isiah Thomas – a good, misunderstood man – a second chance. The Yankees were known for second chances.”

    YO Cr9 , your treading some serious deep water here. You drool over the Yankees and I’ll drool over the Rangers , You keep your Yankee love away from my Ranger love and we’ll get along quite well my friend.

  113. Ok, so bringing Leetch and Keith’s name into this wasn’t my brightest idea ever. But I still stand that Rozy is way better than fans are giving him credit for.

    GCBlue, yep it was. Same year as Campbell’s contract. And very much like the starting pitching market of a few year’s ago where guys like Carlos Zambrano were getting upwards of 20 million per. Ridiculous numbers if you ask me.

  114. On that note, I’m out. Got things to do for a few hours, but will be back to see how hammered I get on this.

    Ciao!

  115. If the Rangers were run like the Yankees, where would all the beards go? How would we know if a player was gritty? Would mullets be grandfathered in?

  116. Gift of GAB-orik (Welcome back Carp!) on

    The difference between the Yanks and Rangers management… if ANYONE on the Yankees staff embarassed them like Thomas did, and cost them a sexual harassment lawsuit, they’d be GONE… and STAYED GONE.

    Dolan is beyond incompetent, and his choice of staaf shows it. It’s profitable owning MSG… so he doesn’t care. And if he does… it sure as hell doesn’t show. He doesn’t talk to the media… find me another owner who does that.

  117. Mickey- I know where you are coming from but the tolerance for softness is proportional to the players skill level. Obviously.

    LOL Morg

  118. ZzZz NYR ZzZz " Frolov is getting Prucha's #25 !! " … says Greg L. on

    ” The difference between the Yanks and Rangers management… ”

    …is the Yankees management sits around and eats peanutz ,while the Rangers ,sits up high and smoke cigars.

    Orr , I missed it , dam , dam!!! I dunno how to twitter , geeeze!!! Boogaard is worth every penny. If yer paying Hank over 7 million , Gabby over 7 million ,Drury and Redden almost over 7 million…then BOOGAARD deserves his cut. What? yer not gonna pay a guy for beating the snot outta people and make the fans jump outta thier seat.. I bet Boogaard ( not a real bet) makes fans jump outta thier seat more then half the players on the team this year.

    Rod Gilbert is a fool whos crying for attention, I tried to befriend him and he just kept spouting his garbage. He is a selfish blogger trying to stir all of us up.

  119. ZzZz NYR ZzZz " Frolov is getting Prucha's #25 !! " … says Greg L. on

    ” ” The difference between the Yanks and Rangers management…”

    Is the Yankees owners actually supply’s the players with the steriods.

  120. ZzZz NYR ZzZz " Frolov is getting Prucha's #25 !! " … says Greg L. on

    ” The difference between the Yanks and Rangers management… ”

    Yankees Managers don’t have to deal with a salary cap .

  121. Carp

    You do have a humorous manner in which you inflict pain..gibberish in deed. I tried not to smile as I read it.

    Sort of like rubbing the cat’s fur the wrong way.

    Point of recollection: shot blocking.

    First guy I recall seeing making serious attempts at shot blocking ( and who became quite proficient at it also) a stay at home defense man on the Wings named Bob Goldham
    who’d drop to his knees close in to the shooter. ( and you know the way padding was designed in those days, sort of a cross between sponge rubber and poster paper.

    Now recall the way Brian Leetch often blocked shots, he’d face the shooter( much the same as old Goldham), but he’d only drop to one knee, and that left him the option of quickly rising to his feet and resuming his close in goaltender assisting. Aye, there was so much of his game that was effortless and subtle, but remarkable none the less.

  122. Gift of GAB-orik (Welcome back Carp!) on

    The Yankees win, and win OFTEN.

    The Yankees owner wouldn’t stand for years of sub par performance. Ask Joe Torre after his last 3 seasons in NY how he felt.

    If George Steinbrenner owned the Yanks… Sather would have been our 5 or 6 years ago.

  123. ilb2001

    Keep your eye posted on your mail box toward the end of the week, for you should be seeing that disc arriving.

  124. ZzZz NYR ZzZz " Frolov is getting Prucha's #25 !! " … says Greg L. on

    ” The difference between the Yanks and Rangers management… ”

    During a baseball game ( 6 hours of boredom) the Yankees Managers have all the time in the world to think . 160 or so games and ever team they play ,it’s some sort of series. How hard is that? Rangers managers have zero time to do anything. Fast pace game this hockey is and to run it , even faster.

  125. ZzZz NYR ZzZz " Frolov is getting Prucha's #25 !! " … says Greg L. on

    Boogaard deserves his salary deb , Broadway is a show and no goons should come at a discount unless they are Brashear ,ORR or Laraque. Im banking on Boogy to hit ’round 6 goals . 2 in the first 10 games.

  126. ZzZz NYR ZzZz " Frolov is getting Prucha's #25 !! " … says Greg L. on

    ” The difference between the Yanks and Rangers management… ”

    They have been pampered by a winning tradition and all the money in the world . The Yankees have tradition , winning tradition. Rangers do not.

  127. According to my buddy Gulitti’s twitter, the arbitrator has ruled in favor of the league in the Kovalchuk case.

    in other words, he’s a UFA again.

  128. ZzZz NYR ZzZz " Frolov is getting Prucha's #25 !! " … says Greg L. on

    ” The difference between the Yanks and Rangers management… ”

    The field of players is larger and more acurate to judge ,thus being easier to run. How many hugh Jessmans are in the Yankees draft bust lists? Do ya really need to draft when ya can buy a A -Rod ?

  129. ZzZz NYR ZzZz " Frolov is getting Prucha's #25 !! " … says Greg L. on

    ala Voros …exactly!!! Yes . You see it here don’t you !!!
    Boogyman is da man!!!! My 3rd fav Ranger!!!!

Leave A Reply