Fallout: Stars 10, Rangers 2


New York to Dallas and back is a long, long way to go to get it handed to you.

Some thoughts after a just God-awful performance. I have an assignment, so this will probably be the only post today. Sorry about that. I imagine once you vent, though, you wouldn’t mind a break from your favorite team, right? So this should be more than enough.

1.       This game reminded me of two I covered – the one in Buffalo in 1992-93 that got Roger Neilson fired; and the second of back-to-back losses to Detroit in 2000 that got John Muckler and Neil Smith fired (and Glen Sather hired, ultimately). Both had that level of incompetence followed by a level of QUIT. Sather lurking on the trip might mean a change is coming … or at least that the Renney Watch has begun. And the fact that the Rangers reacted this way to the punishment skate the other day is even more disturbing for Renney and his staff.

2.       Isn’t it remarkable in a salary-capped league that one team can have so much more skill and talent than another? I mean, Dallas has so many more players who can play. AND the Stars are without long-term injured Brenden Morrow and Sergei Zubov. AND the Stars are still dealing with the Sean Avery contract against the cap. AND the Stars still had enough space to trade for Darryl Sydor. So how is it that the Rangers have so little skill and talent, and are almost maxed out and have no room to add a player ? Easy. Sign B-list stars to mega-star contracts. Right?

3.       Scott Gomez? What the heck are you thinking? Seriously. What do you think would have happened if he played that way in Jersey? By the way, how is the scorecard of Devils signed by the Rangers looking right about now?

4.       Steve Ott is the reason the Rangers are even considering taking back Avery. They have nobody who plays even remotely like Ott. Voros tries, but he can’t skate well enough to deliver those hits, and certainly can’t mix the grit with the skill and the smarts of Ott. Avery plays the game that way. I wouldn’t want him on my team under any circumstances if I was  a player or a coach. But the Rangers do need somebody like that, and Avery is the only one available.

5.       Oh, and the coach behind the Stars bench? Dave Tippett … he applied and was interviewed by Sather for the Rangers job once upon a time. Another one who didn’t get it. Thought I might throw in this first paragraph from his team bio, just for effect:

“Dave Tippett was hired as the 19th coach in Stars franchise history on May 21, 2002, and has since posted a 235-127-48 record, the best record of any active NHL coach. He has led the club to two Pacific Division titles (2002-03 and 2005-06), five consecutive playoff appearances and the Western Conference Finals last season. Tippett was rewarded with a contract extension through the 2010-11 season on July 14, 2008 .”

6.       Poor Steve Valiquette. He should go around the room and kick everybody’s butt, starting with Gomez.

7.       Oh, the offense? Didn’t score from in front of the net again. But even with the two from behind the goal line by Zherdev, that’s what? Three in the last three games. Wonder if Petr Prucha is available Monday?

8.       I don’t imagine “Rangers in 60” got a very high rating last night.

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  1. Excellent post Carpy….You are doing an incredible job here and its much appreciated.

    Only if the Rangers played like you blog!

  2. Nice job, Rick. You didn’t sugar coat this debacle like Sam the Sham and Joe the Shill: “They just have to put this one behind them”.

    Bullcrap, this is one that will last a lifetime.

    Please try to find out when the axe comes down for Mr. Silk Scarf.

  3. Great post carp. thank you

    I said it last night, if Sather wanted to make an impact on this team for once and gain some respect back from the fans he could have went straight into that locker room fired renny on the spot and lashed that team for a piss poor effort.

    I have to believe that they will get their asses handed to them on monday, which is why im not even entertaining looking for tickets to that game anymore, and if they do that has to be the end of renny.

    After rennys gone we need to find someone to take redden or gomez and or both off our hands and soon

  4. Good comments, Carp.

    Avery is ok, and will hopefully relieve the blandness that surrounds this team, but at best, he’s a good 3rd line winger. It’s skills and scoring this team needs. Zherdev is trying, but he has no one to work with, and he can’t make the players around him better. Now do Sather and Renney understand what Jagr did for them?

  5. a casual observer on

    Repost:The players have given up on this coaching staff. Either players have to be changed or coaching staff has to go. It’s that simple(I think a combo of the two has to happen). Renney and Pearn always talk about going to the next, forececk with passion, ect,ect… I NEVER NEVER EVER see this happen in the actual game. These players are NEVER held accountable for their actions (except Prucha). If Sather cared about this team and it’s fans (if) he would be in interviews for a new coaching staff. There are some talented guys out there who will talk about going to the next, forececk with passion, ect,ect and DEMAND IT every night from his players! That is the coach we need. With a strong coach Redden would have splinters at this point!

  6. 0necupin67years on

    I’d like to hear from the Dolan’s.

    I don’t think these signings were well thought out which would give the club an out from these contracts.
    These signings weren’t about future hall of famer’s in their primes. drury and Gomez are small pieces of a larger puzzle, not the building blocks. And you killed any incentive to win with the $$$

  7. Terrible, terrible show of hockey from the Rangers last night. You hit the nails on the head Carpy. I’m jumping on the “Fire Slats and Renney” bandwagon now after last night’s (lack of)performance.

  8. All the Renney and Sather bitching has to stop.

    These guys aren’t going anywhere. Sorry people, There a REASON people boo Jim Dolan at RETIREMENT CEREMONIES (Leetch for example) when his name is mentioned.

    Enough bitching about the staff. This team is over. People have said we’ve been inconsistent and lackluster all season, just lucky. Guess what?! It was true. Lundqvist couldnt come up with big stops on a night that honored one of the Rangers greatest players.

    Stop the bleeding, stop the signings, start the R-E-B-U-I-L-D


  9. Let’s see, the players are stating what kind of game they should play…..not what they are playing…..they get blown out just after the coach punished them…..HEY SATHER YOU FRIGGIN IDIOT THEY QUIT!!!!!! FIRE RENNEY AND LET’S SEE WHAT WE CAN SALVAGE OUT OF THIS SEASON. of course your pompous ass is next. I wonder if he knows that and is purposly messing the Rangers up because of his tie’s to Canadian teams.

  10. Why do the Rangers constantly need a lengthy rebuild? The Flyers went from worst to ECF in one year? The Bruins were horrible 2 seasons ago. It’s obviously a management problem, who coincidentally is the same guy for 11 years.

  11. With all due respect, you guys in the media have dropped the ball.

    Wasn’t there a blog just a few days ago defending Renney, claiming criticisms of him weren’t fair?

    Wasn’t it this blog that said over and over again that the solution was yet another trade?

    I’m glad you finally came to your senses, but Renney should’ve never lasted this long, and the only reason he did is because you guys in the press didn’t do your job.

  12. Scott your going to marginalize Lundqvist for a shootout loss when his teammates couldn’t score 2 goals against the second worst team in the east and came up with their only when there was 10sec left?

    Nevermind that Devils lit them up last night with a “less talented” roster than ours.

    Keep drinking the rennyade

  13. First order of buisness, is bring Jagr back he has personality which this team doesn’t. He can score, and he loved playing here and would do anything for this team. Even if it’s only for a short time he is a superstar and is exactly what the Rangers need while they work on rebuilding. If everyone remembers Jagr was here to help restore pride in the Rangers. Well we need him again. Maybe with Jagr we won’t need to totally rebuild. Just a thought.

  14. Pil, I believe what I said … and you can go back and check it out … is that this team simply isn’t good enough. I think last night kind of proves that to be true. Doesn’t matter what system or by what coach, they’re not good enough. And that’s not defending the coach.

  15. Players like Jagr are few and far between, and his love for NY was admirable. When he played here he played with his heart because he loved it so much. Just bring him back because of the heart he had. He is no Messier but who is.

  16. When I saw Gomez give up the first goal by CUTTING IN FRONT OF THE NET, I knew it was going to be a long night. I mean c’mon, Pee Wee hockey players know not to cut in front of the net.

    Renney needs to go, the defensive style isn’t working anymore. And personally I would like to see Sather go, but I don’t think that will happen until he’s ready.


  17. I turned the game off at the end of the first period and said, “They are going to lose.” I knew it was coming. The thing is, I expected it to end up maybe 4-2 or 5-2 Dallas. 10-2? Come on. This team is GARBAGE.

    Renney will be gone inside of a month’s time. The team’s problems are largely a function of the players Sather stuck Renney with, but it’s easier to oust a losing coach than to replace an entire team of overpaid underproducing third liners.

    Peace, Tom.

  18. Drastic times call for drastic measures. In my demented world if I were Renney here are my lines and I’ll give logic.

    Dubi-Gomez-Naslund; Dubi can keep up with those guys and he has the power game and chemistry with Naslund

    Zherdev-Anisimov-Drury; yeah yeah Artie may not be fully ready but if you put his play making and size with Drury’s game and Zherdev’s skill it’ll help him. If you’re worried about faceoffs, Drury can take them and AA can then switch back during plays. This line can play defense.

    Cally-Korpi-Prucha-Need I saw more? Dawes get benched again after last night.

    Betts-Sjo;Orr gets benched for being a jabroni last night and Zherdev double shifts.

    On D you dress 7 DMen with Sags as the 7th; he will be there only to work the PP and shoot the puck.

    On my PP I want Dubi-AA-Zherdev and then Drury with Naslund and whoever is playing the best out of the third liners.

    Gomez doesn’t get his PP time back as punishment for this game until he shows he has his fundies down, and Redden go nowhere near the PP until he takes a slapshot in 5 on 5.

    As I said last night, I’d rather watch AA and Bobby S learn the NHL game and struggle a bit then these over payed idiots. Eric Staal struggled mightily his first season in the NHL and he’s doing just fine and dandy.


  19. The shame of it all is that it took this long to notice whats wrong with this team. There are plenty of people who knew the Rangers record was not what they were. Carp doesn’t anyone talk or ask the coaches hard questions? I’m not saying it’s the media’s fault, but you guys should have been all over these idiots. I’m not gloating because I can say I told you, I’m actually not happy that I knew this was going to happen.

  20. First of all, I watched the Stars broadcast last night since it was in HD. Let me tell you, it was really refreshing not having to listen to the Sam and Joe spin machine. The Dallas guys were mystified by how much room the Rangers were giving the stars in front of their own net. They also called out Redden several times when he got burned.

    I’m sorry, but I don’t think Slats could be given a bigger example of a team who has tuned out its coach. Carp, when you try to blame it on the talent level, that just doesn’t fly or accurately describe what happened last night. The Rangers played like a team that has no faith in their coach and his system. I knew it was going to be a long night when Giannone asked Gomez about the hard practice in pregame and Gomez laughed at him. The players no longer believe in Tom, and there is only one solution for that.

  21. Just watched highlights of Devils/Thrashers. Why didn’t Sather bring back Shanahan? What’s the real reason? The cap problems were an excuse.

  22. There is plenty of blame for Sather who sucks and has for a long time, and Renney who sucks as well. The team is poorly constructed and the coach can’t figure out how to use players to their strengths. It becomes a chicken and egg argument but the easiest solution to try is to fire the coach and see if someone else can get more out of this group. There are plenty of good coaches out there to pick from (Laviolette, Tortorella, Paddock and Shoeny) so make it happen Glen…and if things don’t turn around you should hit the bricks too. Promote Shoeny to GM or bring in Hedberg.

    Look at Boston…good coaching, shrewd GM’ing and best in the East.

  23. little green men on

    Bring in Tortelini! He should have been our coach for the past 7 seasons. What a different world we would have been living in as Ranger fans.

  24. Tortelini, although delicious, is not a very good hockey coach. Tortarella might do a good job though.

  25. twin-Boston is doing great but Claude Julien has a horrible track record in the playoffs; let’s see him change that this year before anointing them Eastern Conference Champs.

    I’ve wanted Hedberg as GM here for quite some time. Very underrated work he did with OTT.

    As for coaches, let’s go through them:

    Torts-He’s a hot head like Lou Pinella or Billy Martin. He’s end up embarrassing himself and punching a reporter and imagine if Henrik has a bad game…….

    Schoeny-He’s a very good coach but I don’t think he wants to do it. He took the Devils and Caps to the Conference finals back in the day.

    Paddock-He’s not a winning coach at the NHL level.

    Laviolette-I’d take him. All he did was turn the Islanders around and turn Carolina from an 8th seed in a horrible division to Stanley Cup Champs. Rutherford is the one who messed up that team by trading Jack Johnson which they will regret and also letting Cullen (originally) go and trading the underrated Andrew Ladd.

  26. Cynar–

    Totally agree with you about Jagr. BUT i cant even think about it because he isn’t coming back… as much as i wish he would. This management made a HUGE mistake this past summer, and now we can all watch it unfold. I always appreciated Jags and what he did for this team, but i think right now, i have never appreciated it more. PERIOD.

  27. shanny would not suddenly make this team any better. he is getting 4th line minutes on the devils and then pp time. the devils have a a good enough team/coach that they can limit his icetime.

    last time i checked he wasnt that great on the pp for us (prob the result of our lack of a pp plan but still) so i dont think he would have been any better this time around given the same coaching staff is here. i guess he could have played instead of orr, but knowing renney he would have been bumped up to the first line during a game like last nite and he is no longer that player

  28. JNL98 I know people are tired of hearing about him, but from what I understand their is some hope of him returning to the NHL. I’m just hoping it’s with the Rangers and not the Pens.

  29. How about Ted Nolan to wake these guys up and if he doesnt he is gone at end of the season/playoffs. Another option is Sergei Nemchinov who has some coaching experience in Russia I believe. I think the Hartleys,Laviolettes, Andy Murrays, and Hartsburgs are major retreads. Most likely we will get Pearn or even Sather himself as an Interim coach with Tom being reasigned to the front office.

  30. I say throw caution to the wind, and bring in Messier, Leetch and Richter. Nothing like learning on the go.

  31. The more I see Gomez over the last two years, the more I realize he was a product of the NJD “system” and lacks any kind of true ‘greatness’ to command the contract he got. Gomez is a 2nd line center (at best) in the NHL

  32. alex b (the poster formely known as czechthemout!!!!) on

    Carp-great post! I’ve said this for two years now,Renney needs to go.It does not matter that the players are just not good enough because they are not going anywhere,Sather has seen to that with his rediculous contracts.They were a better team last year and still had to claw their way to the playoffs.The team played the same style,a traping style with a great goalie and a past his prime superstar who bailed out an incompetant coach and a player who got underneath the opponents skin while at the same time sparking some passion from his passionless teamates.That was the formula last year.This year,the passionless trap style is still here as is the incompatent coach and the great goalie,sprinkled in with some good young players who’s play has deteriorated under this “coach”.The goalie is clearly somewhat worn down because the great defensive genius and his style allows between 15-20 fantastic scoring chances against each and every game.If I were the owner,Sather and Renney would be sent packing in favor of a real G.M. who would than be allowed to choose his own coach.That of course will not happen neither will we be able to get rid of such terrible contracts so the only solution that’s left is to fire the hyena who incompetant coaching is only matched by his inability to hold the so called stars accountable.The next move is going to be intersting to watch!

  33. Rick,
    You say, “this team simply isn’t good enough. I think last night kind of proves that to be true. Doesn’t matter what system or by what coach”

    But it does matter, and here’s why:

    This team is at or near the bottom of a bell curve in terms of “rottenness.”

    It’s like the wood in my garage at the bottom that is rotten with termites and the bad wood has to be cut out.

    Renney was “good” wood once, very good wood. But the termites have even gotten into that wood and rotted it. Part of that “rot” is also due to the system of maintenance and refresh. Under Renney that maintenance/refresh program is broken, too.

    You can’t have a rudder and main supports made of rotted wood. Renney is the rudder, Gomez, Redden, Drury and Roszival are the main supports — and IMO two of those, Gomez and Redden are done in NY, and if they don’t get some intervention soon from above, so are Drury and Rosi.

    You’re right, putting a new coach in there overnight won’t fix things right away.

    But the dead wood has to be cut out, fresh wood has to be put in, even if some of it is not properly cured yet. And the rudder — Renney — is a key piece that has to be replaced too.

    But the whole thing needs a change of direction, fresh air to breathe, a less stifling philosophy. It don’t think it grow or go in any kind of a fresh direction in the Renney regime.

  34. HockeymanRangers on

    I will be very surprised if anything regarding coaching will happen this year. I think this is not all Renney’s fault, it is just as much Sather’s baby. Sather took a shot to see if these old washed up players could be revived in NY but it is not happening. But where he made a crucial mistake is he has over paid all of them, so now we are stuck with them. I don’t know what to think, I am afraid to say that it will be awhile before we are any kind of contenders for years to come if we have to actually keep these old men.

  35. Carp,
    “this team simply isn’t good enough. I think last night kind of proves that to be true. Doesn’t matter what system or by what coach”
    What are you really saying?
    There are 3 options at this stage:
    1 – Do nothing and hope for the best.
    2 – Trade Gomez, Redden and Drury
    3 – Change the system, hence, Renney must go. Oh I forgot, Renney has a PhD and that kinda intimidates the reporters, so let’s be polite and say kick Renney upstairs.

    1 is not an option in my book, we all know 2 is close to impossible. What’s left is 3.
    Do you have another option? Please share.
    Nice article by the way.

  36. No defensive minded team loses 8-5 and 10-2 in a season. Ever see the Wild get blown out? Nope. Renney’s system doesn’t work and his team has given up on him.
    Team responds to its toughest punishment practice with a 10-2 loss. Yup, proof right there. This is the first time i’ve ever saw the Rangers’ community rooting for the team to lose.
    1. Renney must go.
    2. Avery must be bought back to instill some character into this team.
    3. Please free up the dead weight and cap space issues. I’m sure Kalinin, Voros and Dawes can all find homes elsewhere ( nhl or ahl).

  37. alex b (the poster formely known as czechthemout!!!!) on

    When I look around at the various blogs out there,I can’t believe there are actually some fans still left defending Renney,a coach who’s only claim to fame is a silver medal at the world juniors and being run out of Vancouver by Mess who recognized early that Renney was a coach who’s “system” stinks to high heaven.

  38. Rick Carpiniello
    February 7th, 2009 at 10:10 am
    “Pil, I believe what I said … and you can go back and check it out … is that this team simply isn’t good enough. I think last night kind of proves that to be true. Doesn’t matter what system or by what coach, they’re not good enough. And that’s not defending the coach.”


    I think that IS defending the coach. A team that “isn’t good enough” —- fine, that team strives and claws and doesn’t have the horses to contend. We can all live with that.

    But what you and I saw last night was something else. We saw disorganization, we saw quit, we saw physical passivity, we saw complete chaos in every facet of the approach. And that is 1000% on the coach.

  39. There is no way Sather will get fired. Dolan said he has the job as long as he wants it. So he has no incentive to succeed.

  40. They’re are plenty of teams in the NHL that aren’t “good enough,” and they don’t lose 10-2 in a decade, especially while espousing a “defense first” game plan.

  41. Maybe another coach will hold these guys accountable! Gomez, Drury and Naslund don’t get benched for a shift or two when they’re terrible. However Prucha is exiled and can’t play more than for games in a row because he “wears down.”

    Don’t understand it. If you don’t perform or produce, you don’t play… doesn’t matter how much you make. Hell, as much as I hate the Eagles, they sat McNabb for the second half and he got the message.

  42. Oh and apparently A-Rod tested positive for steroids in 2003, so if they do fire anyone, we still wont get the back page

  43. #8 was HILARIOUS. Honestly, Renney’s time here is over, its time for a change. I’d love to say the same about Slats but hell he’ll end up here untill he’s the walking dead. Bring those four jerseys and old men outa retirement, please.

  44. The team isn’t good enough AND the coach isn’t good enough. Can’t we just admit that? We have some solid young guys (Duby, Staal, Girardi, Dawes, and Callahan) but Dawes, Callahan and Prucha are basically the same player. There is no room for the three of them. Zherdev is a legit goal scorer if he has someone to balance the line he’s on. And he doesn’t. This team is not a threat in any capacity.

  45. I’m down…Fire Renney! We need a shake-up.
    But just be prepared for another Sather suck up.

  46. partial repost from last thread:

    My thoughts moving forward (as my thoughts about last night I’m sure have been echoed by most of the posts from last night and this morning):

    1) Can there be any doubt that the team’s #1 priority this offseason should be to resign Zherdev?

    2) Poor Valliquette. Next time LQ has to miss a game, he shouldn’t ride the pine; they should recall MiiWii in case Valli gets destroyed like this again. By the end of the game he was so defeated that he couldn’t stop anything. I would’ve preferred a shooter tutor instead of Valli for the last 10 minutes of the game. And that’s not an insult to his goaltending, but just his battle level at that point was so low that he didn’t try. And why should he have? The team in front of him gave up long before him.

    3) We dominated the Thrashers by losing 2-1 in a SO? How would you describe what the Devils did to them last night?

    4) Gomez was benched in the third and it was obvious enough that it made it into the story recapping the game. That’s a good first step. Let’s see if Renney will grow some balls and make him watch from the stands. Ditto for Voros, who was absolutely wretched.

    5) How can Prucha NOT play at this point?? Honestly, could it get any worse than 10-2?

    6) 10 goals in Renney’s defensive system. Just saying. Couldn’t resist.

    7) If Florida keeps playing well and they don’t move Bouwmeester at the deadline, we’re missing the playoffs.

    8) God help us if we take Avery off of reentry waivers like he’s going to be the solution to why this team lost 10-2. He’s just going to be 2 million in cap space were going to lose for the next 3 years. 2 million in cap space which could have been used on Zherdev or our other RFAs like Dubinsky and Staal in 2010.

    9) I really like Dubinsky on the wing. Enough so that I don’t miss his great faceoff skills.

  47. Interesting quote from Spector “Rangers scout Rick Kehoe has been following the Calgary Flames, whose GM Darryl Sutter is said to have liked Rangers forward Nigel Dawes in the past…”

  48. Frankly, as a fan, all I can ask from my team is to show effort at all times and to never give up, regardless of the score. If the effort is there, I may not be happy with the results but I would have little to complain about. Unfortunately, that is not the case with the New York Rangers, especially with a coach that has no idea how to utilize accountability as a motivational tactic. In other words, “effort + accountability = No complaints” while
    “No effort + No accountability = No chance”

  49. “Carp,

    I think that IS defending the coach. A team that “isn’t good enough”——fine, that team strives and claws and doesn’t have the horses to contend. We can all live with that.

    “But what you and I saw last night was something else. We saw disorganization, we saw quit, we saw physical passivity, we saw complete chaos in every facet of the approach. And that is 1000% on the coach.”

    Great post, ford.

  50. In all my years watching the Rangers I have NEVER turned off a game and never went back to it last night. After the 2nd pd I turned it off, never turned it back on and I never knew what the final score was until now. I absolutely cannot believe what happened.

    I have no words and all I can say is I think the players are playing this way to get rid of Renney. After this game Sather NEEDS to fire him!!!!!!

  51. I’m on a fixed income, and can no longer afford Ranger tickets. The best way for everyone to show total displeasure with the current situtation is to show some fans heart. As fans we have total control no one should go to the game. Boycott the games and the Dolan’s will be forced to do something. Carp you reporters have to get Dolan and tell him we want Sather and Renney replaced, and until that happens we as diehard NY Rangers Fans will not come see this garbage they call a team.

  52. This team is painful to watch. They don’t want to win, they are having to mucj fun together – hanging out… I am not even going to watch the next 2 games since they will get destroyed by Devs and Caps. The only bright spots were Z and Cally. Dubi is trying but he lost his touch and confidence. I think even Staal got tired of working his ass off every night while the rest of the team takes a nap on the ice.

  53. leatherneckinlv on

    This was an embarassing preformance as we can all attest to…Gomez was definetely the player to point the finger to in this loss..what a stupid play he made on the first goal Dallas scored on..and this from a graduate of the Devils organization that dosnt make mistakes like that…so…now…does the finger point to Renney to allow this absurd play that has occured by many of the high priced over rated players we have on our team?…no..its the players..not the coach…the the coaching also has some accountability in this as well..point is..this team will be held hostage to a few years of poor seasons due to the contracts to sub par players…only one of the fab five signings i will back..is Drury…he isnt as bad as people make him out to be…if Sather had patience and foresight/..he would not have signed Redden and awaited what the Rangers need desperately…Kommiserek as a free agent for next year…and instead of signing Roszi..he would have signed Streit..prsonally i thought he was exactly what we needed…we dont need to be a team that signs the top free agent names every year…sign our own… and now this hog wash over Shanny…HE WOULD HAVE HELPED..not hinder us…Gomez hinders us…Redden hinders us…Roszi hinders us..Pearn hinders us…only untouchables in my opinion right now are the goalies…Mara, Staal Reitz and Girardi..Dubi, Zherdev, Callahan, Korpikoski, the 4th line and prospects Del Zotto, Sanguenetti, Sauer and Potter, forwards AA, Garchev, Wilse…and now the dilemma…those who are expendable will not be moved by the contracts they have signed…we are better off finishing last to get high draft choices than this nonsense…and finally the one player we could not have lost and did to a tragic death in Cherepanov…really has our team crippled as the thought of an all Russian line off Garchev/AA/Cherpanov would have been fun to watch in the future…Folks…we are trouble as a team


    Defense first = 10-2 loss HAHAHAHAHHAHAH WHAT A SCHMUCK!!!

    FIRE RENNEY NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  55. True fans bleed rw&b on

    I read these posts and it feels like you all just read the posts salty, wd40 and I have made all season. PS: thanks for joining the party, I’m glad you’re 40 games late but you made it (beer me and others saying this team had no problems)

    Secondly, I’d like to point out that the difference between Vali and HL. Someone made the point that valiquette’s been better (Haha).

    So how long will it take to drop the axe on renney?

  56. A bad team can still be a good organization. A good organization would dump the older, non-productive players and bring in the Anisimov’s, the Potters, the Sanguinetti’s, and the Sauer’s ASAP. A bad organization would trade some of the above young talent, plus Prucha and Dawes and maybe even Korpikoski for the stop-gap Sykora’s of the world. Gee, I wonder which it will be with this GM? If they trade for short-term gain / long-term loss, “to make the playoffs” that will brand the Dolan – Sather – Renney era as a commitment to making money, and to long-term losing, to go with this present ineptitude we are witnessing.

    Losing 10-2 is bad, but the crossroads this organization is at, with major implications for the next five years, are even more significant. This loss is a wake up call, but I fear the band-aid response will be much worse.

  57. Renney after the Thrasher game: “Atlanta is a good team.”

    Renney after last night: “Dallas? Perhaps, quite honestly, at the end of the day, the most dynamic collection of highly-motivated, cohesive, strong-willed athletes to ever set foot on a sheet of ice to identify what it means to be a player in this league and wear a sweater with honor.

    “The Montreal dynasties? The Oilers? Hah! Not even close — I give you the 2008-09 Dallas Stars, the greatest team in the history of the NHL.”

  58. Oh yes, a great place to start the makeover would be to stip that G.D. passionless captain of his “C” and give it to Avery, or give it to Dubinsky, or give it to Staal. The future is here and it is now. Give that “C” to someone with ability AND heart!


  59. I feel sick to my stomach. I watch the game on my couch with my buddies for a bit, and leave my house when it was 4-2 during the second intermission. I later to come back to find that our boys in blues got raped on the ice in the 3rd period and given up 6 goals. 10-2…that’s like a freaking baseball score. Something has to change, where to start idk where to begin, but i think one name to throw out there…SATHER

  60. im embarassed to be a ranger fan. our whole organization is pathetic. just look at the devils. always in the playoffs.. number one in most of the power rankings… i envy devil fans.. jagr is not coming back.. since he signed another professional contract through next year if he signs with an NHL team he would have to clear waivers.. no way he clears.. just look at wade dubielwitz (spelling).. what the f is sean avery going to do accept add to our misery cap situation? he cant even be the player he once was or bettman will throw the book at him.. everybody raise their drinks to misery until we can get redden.. gomez… drury..rozival.. and what is turning out to be the “king”.. off the books.. the devils third string goalie. scott “five hole” clemmenson has a better Goals against average.. save percentage and nearly as many wins. WE ARE PATHETIC

  61. A change desperately needs to happen with this team. Whether it is a coaching change or a player personnel change, something needs to happen!Carp addressed great points in his bog, I also addressed some good points on my blog, just click my username to go to it.

  62. Bottom line, Renney needs to go. You can talk about how the Rangers don’t have the talent to be a serious contender come playoff time, but the fact of the matter is that it all stems from the coaching strategy and game plan.

    And Renney plain and simple, has no current strategy. But nobody in this organization knows what they are doing, hence the signing of B list players to all star contracts.

    We need a staff that knows how to deal with cap issues and that can make smart decisions for the organization, including the signing of players to workable contracts.

  63. I absolutely love the people who want to fire Renney or Sather because of a 4 game losing streak.. You must be the clowns who are yelling SHOOOOOOOTTT every six seconds at home games. Just so you know, if you hear two fans yelling SHOOOOOTTT during breaks or when the puck is in our zone, that’s me and my brother mocking you people…

    Now, I’m not saying Renney is doing a GREAT job, what I am saying is that him not playing Prucha and instead playing Voros is about the only thing you can get angry with him for.


    Because if you’re owner gives you a slow horse, can you really expect your jockey to lead him to victory?

    Hell no!!!

    This is all on GLEN SATHER. He replaced Jaromir F***IN JAGR with a young version of Kovalev and an old Markus Naslund. He signed Wade Redden to a ridiculous contract (to be fair, market value killed that one), and last off-season, handcuffed the team to huge contracts with two 2nd line centers..

    This team is full of character guys who can skate and possess the puck (two reasons they didn’t and SHOULDN’T HAVE signed Shanahan), but can’t score. They’re basically the same team in 2005-2006, except they don’t have Jagr to take them on his shoulder and score big goals if needed.

    Renney can’t do anything with this team. He can mix and match all he wants, but is it his fault that EVERY combination he uses sucks??


    This is all on the GM.. The true test to Sather’s brilliance or incompetence will be if he can swing a deal to get a Kovalchuk or similar sniper. I know, I know, pipe dreams. But let’s face it. This team is one All-Star sniper away from actually being good. That would take the pressure off of Zherdev, that would allow Renney to sit Voros indefinitely, and that would take pressure off the ‘D’. I don’t care what anyone says, but this team IS a sound defensive team. Lately, they’ve had absolutely no offense, so the ‘D’ has buckled.

    So, instead of yelling fire Renney, yell “DO SOMETHING SATHER!!!”. Then we can make judgments. And also, from a season ticket holder who actually DOES play ice hockey, STOP YELLING SHOOT EVERY FIVE FU&*%$%$#%ING SECONDS!. Their power play does indeed blow, but it’s all about setting the play up and getting a decent shot. Even if you don’t score, at least get a good shot.

  64. What a freaking disgrace! They should bring up the entire Hartford team. At least they’d show some effort. FIRE SATHER AND RENNEY!!

  65. Baumer your right, but let’s be honest, Renney is the one to go a heck of a lot sooner than Sather does.

    Don’t get me wrong, I would LOVE to see Sather gone, but it’s not going to happen anytime soon. So, the only logical thing is to scream fire Renney right now. We need some type of change and Renney is making too many mistakes with this team and of course his horrible statements in his interviews aren’t helping his cause.

  66. Bench Drury and Redden against the devs.
    Trade Gomez to the Blackhawks (They are looking for a second line center) for Troy Brouwer, we will even pay half his salary.
    Trade Dawes,Sjostrom and Voros to the flames for David Moss (add a pick if need be).
    Trade Kalinin for anything.
    Call up Grachev, AA and Sanguinetti


  67. Carp
    First off sorry for the profanity last night, it was warranted though I think and we all appreciate you lettingus vent here.

    So we all agree Renney is in Hot water and 50/50 he may get fired? we shall see

    All I know is this is who I want TO BE ALLOWED to be in the lineup on Monday
    (These arent set lines of combo’s, jsut who should be allowed to dress)
    Goal – Hank
    Cally-Korpi-Dawes (even though he shoudl sit too, but there’s no one else.)
    Sanguinetti – 7th Dman used only on the PP

    Gomer – benched for the game
    REdden – Benched for the game
    Voros -benched for the game
    Kalinen – still injured or healthy scratch
    Valli – sent to a psychiatrist for therapy

    Sather – Start working the phones to move Dawes & Voros and picks for a decent scoring winger. Start calling available coaches to take over.

    Other than this whatever happens by Monday will not help

  68. Will discuss Renney in a moment. But first, I have to disagree with the somewhat automatic “never blame the goalie” hockey tradition. In truth, as bad as most Ranger skaters were (and they surely were), Valiquette was fighting the puck from the beginning of the game, and seemed to completely lose either his focus or his will in the third period. The difference between an awful performance, and a historically bad one as manifested by the final score, is, at least to a major degree on him.
    Now on Renney: Had I or my son been able to play at the NHL level I would have been honored to have Tom as the coach. He is intelligent, and almost never has a bad word to say publicly about an individual player. A classy guy. And my respect for him has only been cemented by his recent comments vis-a-vis the USA, in a time when it is oh-so-fashionable among the fashionable ones to denigrate this country.
    Having said that, and meant it: He has had a strong tendency to overlook flaws in some players’ games while focusing on them in others. (See: Prucha in the stands watching Roszival pass up shots from the power play point.) His calm demeanor means he doesn’t get maximum effort from some of his players who would respond to more emotion; and referees, being human, who will tend subconsciously at least to take the path that results in the least opprobrium, tend to lean a little away from making calls in the Rangers’ favor because of it. And even if these negatives were overwhelmed by his many positives, there comes a time when you have said all you can say to motivate a group, and done all you could have done, and the players just won’t respond, even if they tell themselves they want to. So, yes, since it takes a long time to change the core players on your team (much as I’d like to see that done ASAP), it is time for a change in coaching staffs. Tom, it has been an honor, and I wish only the best to you and yours. You deserved better than this GM and players gave you.

  69. Reitz looked fine his own goal was not his fault and he uses the bosy all over the place..

    again for the 1000th time why is voros, orr, kalinan(when healthy)and sjustrom playing period????

    Dawes had a terrible game last night!!Bullcrap, yeah he did not score a goal, and!!!!!!!!!!!Gomez and redden had a bad game….

    this team just cannot score.. they have not scored 3 or more goals on the road since the 8 to 5 debacle in NJ….

    they need to dump players period…They are not dumping mr redden and gomer but why not dump voros, sjustrom and others?

    Call up the AA’s of the world and look to make some moves…

  70. “Now, I’m not saying Renney is doing a GREAT job, what I am saying is that him not playing Prucha and instead playing Voros is about the only thing you can get angry with him for.”

    Baumer, you don’t get it. You have a coach who traps at home against the Atlanta Thrashers, the worst defensive team in hockey —– which is the equivalent of putting sugar cane into your gas tank —– and yet sit there and say there is only one thing Renney can be faulted for.


  71. “I don’t care what anyone says, but this team IS a sound defensive team.”

    HUNH???? Sound defensive team??? That gives up countless odd man rushes against?? That isn’t physical?? That is horrible without the puck in their own end because they’re mesmerized by the puck and not where they ought to be positionally??

  72. Bad chemistry and players playing out of position is dooming this team. Why Dubinsky at left wing? Why Korpikoski at center? Why Voros at right wing in stead of Naslund who can play right wing?
    Why Prucha is not playing when the team cannot score?
    Why are they not attacking more?
    This is just bad decision making by the coaching staff.
    They are the same team they where in the beginning of the year.

  73. Well it is on hockeybuzz.com. a site I never take seriously, but it says Avery on Waivers and not Avery on Waivers? So I am seeing if Carp can confirm. I can’t find info on it anywhere else.

  74. “Baumer, you don’t get it. You have a coach who traps at home against the Atlanta Thrashers, the worst defensive team in hockey——- which is the equivalent of putting sugar cane into your gas tank——- and yet sit there and say there is only one thing Renney can be faulted for.


    actually, I was at that game, and I DO GET IT. This team is a puck possession team, not an attacking team. There is a huge difference. With the exception of Zherdev, there is not one player on this team that can enter the zone and get a decent shot. Hence, the trapping team. Gomez maybe, but he never shoots. Drury sure, but he couldn’t hit the ocean if he fell off the Verrazano. You’re gonna sit here and tell me that Callahan, Dawes, Prucha, Dubinsky, et al would be 30 goal scorers with an attack minded coach? Good god man!

    This isn’t the NBA, where scrubs can play under Mike D’Antoni and put up 20 pts.


    This system is boring and has holes, but unfortunately, it’s the best one for this team. Again, not the coach’s fault. You work with what you’ve got.. And again, I’m not saying Renney is untouchable or worthy of Coach of the Year, but placing all the blame on him and not holding the GM or players accountable first is joke.

    If they fire Renney and bring in Tortorella or whoever, and that guy does well and Dawes scores more than 5 goals, I will eat my hat. Just don’t hold your breath with this team.

  75. Despite what happened last night, the Rangers are 29-19-5 & their 63 points places them fifth in the East, six points ahead of last seasons Stanley Cup finalists. On balance, we’ve over-achieved on the ice, as is demonstrated by the -10 goal differential on the season. A head coach is like a chef & like him or not, Coach Renney has taken quite a few objectionable ingredients & made a pretty good tasting soup so far…& we’re hitting the final two months of the season.

    Some people say the Rangers rely too much on goaltending & play a boring, unimaginative style. Hey, the #1 goalie is, by far, the best player on the team. Would a better strategy be to try & outscore every opponent?

    I would agree if the team doesn’t bounce back solidly in the next four critical games, all vs close conference foes (at NJ, Was, at FLA & Phi) something significant must be done. But what if we go 2-2? We’ll still be fifth or sixth in the East– with this team– & the sky won’t be falling then, either.

  76. Baumer582:
    “Puck possession team” “sound defensively” “Tom Renney is nothing to blame for except Prucha”

    M’kay … now you see kids… drugs are bad for you…

  77. Obviously some can’t understand that saying the team isn’t good enough is NOT a defense of the coach. Read the post. I don’t defend him.

    Also, those who claim that we, the media, haven’t been tough enough, I don’t disagree. But I’ve only been doing this a week, so cut me a break. 0-3, three goals, during my time on the beat, by the way. Or 0-2-1 in the new NHL.

    And saying the Rangers need Avery for character is just wrong. He might bring many things, but character is not one of them.

  78. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! .....says Greg L. on

    EMBARASSING and sick , you said this aint playstation / xbox hockey!!!?? come on , our Rangers got romped and i could n’t post till now cuz I couldn’t stop puking!!!!

    Shutout lately now this!!?? Fire Renney because his system is just is not working!! The guys on the Dallas telecast said Vally looked minor league …they are right , im sorry vally , this is 2 stinkers and both times you look like you can’t stop a beach ball!!! Get rid of this guy and get a cappable so Hank can have more night off from this sick defensive game. Vally lost us the game because he sucks , sorry to say.

    If Gomez did this in NJ he would be cooked is right…Good game to tell Gomez hes doing more harm than good and sit his ass , im serious , sit him a few games.

    Get a fUking heartbeat in this dressing room cuz last night was the worse game ive ever seen besides Z scoring!!!

  79. My friend invited me to their place for dinner last night and I said I’ll only come if ranger game was put on. I was embarrassed to have that on.

  80. Call it what ever you will Rick the Rangers are a better,moer exciting team with Avery here.
    Bring him on.

  81. Who cares about Avery and his baggage? The only report i want to read today …Tom Renney is fired and Glen Sather retired… is that asking for much?

  82. Thank you, Rick…

    This team is NOT GOOD ENOUGH. And while I don’t have the Renney-hate that the rest of these “experts” have, I know that sometimes it’s not the coach’s fault if he’s given giant turds to work with.

    Make a deal, Glen for the love of God!!!

  83. Calling up players and switching lines is just not doing it anymore. This team needs a real shake up. If that means that Renney goes, so be it. I am getting tired of the taste of puke in my mouth from this team making me so sick.

  84. This team has obviously quit on their coach.

    All the rest is just scenery. When that happens the only thing you CAN do is fire him. Right or wrong, better or worse… once the coach has lost his team, he has to go.

  85. steve trac (sec 303) on

    Baumer582, you can’t score if you don’t put the puck on net and when they stand there and pass, pass, pass lose the puck…it makes me SICK.

  86. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! .....says Greg L. on

    so Carp your saying were nt as good as Dallas? Yeah duh , 10 – 2 yeah takes a brain wizard to make that statement after that loss!!! We had a bad goalie in there and yes the team quit…Old man Modano and ott and alll those slumping stars finnaly got some goals…to say the talent is way better is stuiped! The team quit and Vally sucked and Gomez plays retarded is why we lost…talent wise with a new coach we would beat those idiots in Dallas with Avery on our side!!!

  87. Baumer582:

    And it’s also not the player’s fault if the GM, the coach and the system are giant turds.

    You’ve got it all backwards, buddy.

  88. when these bums CARE about winning and show some hear and actually try and care about putting the city on their back thats when we’ll see their game change…….i just dont think they care…

  89. BLUESHIRT BULLETIN HAS IT RIGHT AND i MUST SAY the yhave convinced me the rangers need to waive redden.. he will clear waivers and they need to send him down..

    he has been given every oppty. and he just sucks.. if he could not score but played lock down D that is one thing but he cannot play D either. It is partly Renny’s fault who should not give him the respect he has not earned and he should not be on the PP getting 20 + minutes a game..

    Why do the rangers for 10 + years give Vets a free pass.

    Again it will not happen but if Dawes got sat for his mistake against Boston what does Gomez get against NJ????

    My complaints with renny are who he suits up and how he allocates minutes(seniority not peformance)..


    they need to shake things up and that does not mean bringing in more over the hill overpriced VETS…

  90. Gomez sitting out the next game isnt going to happen. It absolutely should though. That 1st goal against with his skating in front of Valley was the absolute WORST thing I have seen recently. That is something you just DONT DO, its basic hockey 101 – never skate in front of your net with the puck with an opposing player oncoming and NEVER make a pass up the middle of the ice. Two of the most BASIC fundamentals you are taught when your 5yrs old. If Renney wants to “reclaim” his team, players need to be held accountable NOW!!! Gomez benched against his former team. Bench Redden 3 games to get his ass thinking about his play and take the “C” away from Drury and give it to Mara or Betts. Sorry for all of you who dislike him. He is a dedicated player who hustles 100% every night. You cant blame the 4th line for being on the ice, who controls which players are aligned with the opposition – yes blame Renney.

    But like I said, if he wants to save his job, a statement needs to be made now. Because they certainly didnt respond to his “bag skate” and I dont care what anyone says. He did that because of the way they played against ATL – it was said in the pre-game. Lots of good that did.

    But you know what guys – its not going to happen. You are going to see the same players on the same lines – and no one held accountable for anything that transpired on the ice last night.


  91. I don’t know, according to NHL Numbers, Avery’s name is greyed out, which would mean that his contract is not currently counting against the cap, even though I think it should be.

  92. put aside Avery for a moment Carp and everyone else and answer me this?

    Why isnt SAther and management trying to fix THE REAL PROBLEMS?
    Scoring winger, solid Dman?

    Sather has to be able to work a trade for Dawes Voros and picks for a decent scoring winger? throw Prucah in too casue hes getting the shaft as it is anyway?

    SO Avery comes here, is his old self, it doesnt really fix any of the problems which are:

    TOp players not scoring
    PP in the toilet
    D too soft
    No leadership
    Coaching staff losin ghte teams beleif in them

    I mean how many freaking times do we all have to repat the same lsit of problems to each other?
    Do they not see it, or is ther jsut ZERO chance of fixing it thsi season?

    And seriously after three years HOW THE HELL Does PErry Pearn keep his job? seriously, how?

  93. Heard talk on sports radio that Jagr & Shanahan were dumped because they were ‘malcontents’ and not willing to lead the team??? I think everyone knows that Renney had them removed over there grumblings of his “defense” first system that stymied their offensive skills.
    To the present team…i’ve never seen a team get beat to every lose puck and just coast. They don’t move their legs. I’ve seen things with this team I haven’t seen in 30 years of watching hockey. Who camps out on the doorstep during a power play and then isn’t ready for a pass..catching them offguard??? Who, on a 2 on 1 passes behind his teamate??? Who plays defense and checks with their sticks more than this group???? Who winds up at the point and fans on shots more than this team??? Who misses the net more and by the margins this team does??? Who has less passion…is this soft as this team is??? We are just a f***** mess!!!! RENNEY AND SATHER…GET OUT!!!

  94. Looks like the chickens have come home to roost. Or something like that.

    Amazing how only now people begin to see what some of us have seen for 2+ years.

    We told you so. And you know it.

    Sadly, I still don’t think Renney gets canned yet.

    And throwing Avery into this mess is NOT the answer.

  95. The purpose of this post is not to defend Tom Renney, so please dont take it that way. Rather it is to indict Glenn Sather.

    I believe that the coaching staff has implemented this defensive system because it believes that with the extremely flawed cast of characters it has been presented with, that it is the only way to have a chance at making the playoffs. I tend to agree with that. This team flat out does not have enough scorers. This team has no powerplay quarterback. Playing an aggressive forechecking game can lead to lots of odd man rushes against if there is a breakdown. This team does not have the offensive firepower to overcome such breakdowns if they result in a score.

    Sather is the real villain here. He has left his coach out there naked in the cold with little choice but to play a defense first system.

    Who on this team could you realistically project coming into the year to score 30 goals? Zherdev maybe? Drury and Gomez have scored 30 goals before but are not perennial 30 goal scorers. Naslund is on the downside of his career and his numbers have been trending down for a couple of seasons now. Thats it.

    Who can quarterback the powerplay on this team? Roszival has the skills but not the head. Mara has a big shot but no clue where it is going, Redden sucks, Staal in time may develop into a reliable powerplay player but I see him as a second defenseman on the pp, a partner for a Leetch.

    given this set of circumstances is it really an advantage to play a more wide open game? This team is ill equipped to score enough goals to win that type of game. It is much more likely to win by keeping the game low scoring and letting its best player, Lundqvist, try to steal some games.

    There are many on this blog who complain about the line combos, and propose their own line combinations. Almost none of them agree with each other. This tells me that even as knowledgeable hockey fans, we cannot come up with a logical lineup for the rangers to employ. THIS is an indictment of the General Manager, not the coach.

    This team never had enough wings. Sather approached this by signing players like Voros, Fritche, et al. They were signed to contracts that were too big and as a result the Rangers are in salary cap hell.

    Speaking of salary cap hell, they are so far against the cap that until the recent trade, the team (sather) would not carry a sixth defenseman, severely limiting what moves the coaching staff could make. It is kinda hard to sit a defenseman when there is no other player on the roster to take his spot. People who call for Redden and Kalinin to be benched seem to overlook this little fact.

    This team does not have the cap room to trade for a big name player, and other than Anisimov, what other prospects project as a scorer? Sanguinetti and DelZotto are defensemen and cannot be expected to score enough goals to really cure what ails this team.

    Back to free agents, Sather committed one of the single worst mistake that a general manager can make in a capped system a couple of years back. He needed centers. There were no true number one centers on the free agent market. So he signed Drury and Gomez to HUGE contracts. He needs to look at the Giants. They use free agency judiciously. They dont pay players beyond what they perceive their value to be. Then again they are well managed and dont leave gaping holes in the roster to be filled by free agents.

    The other huge mistake Sather made, was signing Redden and to a lesser extent Naslund, since he can still play, to HUGE LONG TERM contracts. I would have had no issue with giving these guys a chance on a one year incentive laden contract. But we are stuck with a guy who cant play in Redden for how many more years?

    You can blame none of this directly on Renney, as Sather has the final call on personnel moves. Even if the coach wants a player, it is the responsibility of the General Manager to recognize when it is a bad idea to acquire that player.

    by the way, avery is a idiotic idea. sort of like using spackle to fix a crumbling wall. It might make things look better in the short term, and all but it does nothing to fix the underlying problems, and not fixing the underlying problems expediently, can lead to larger long term problems.

    By the way, why does anyone think that giving Sather the power to pick a new coach is a good thing? Renney for all his flaws, is by far the best coach Sather has hired. Ron Low, Denis Potvin (Still Sucks), et al, were one disastrous hire after another. It is likely that Sather’s pick for the next coach will suck just like Potvin.

  96. Looking logically at the progression of the season…the Rangers started off great with hardly any practice or “system” implementation. They are now playing nothing like they were during the first 15 games. Therefore, one can conclude that the more they have been coached, the worse they have become. It’s clear as day.

  97. Best post ever Rick. Why is it than other than Shanahan, ex-Devils never do well as Rangers. ie. Holik. (Still have the stupid bobble-head.) Maybe Devil Management gets more respect and accountability from their players. It appears that the Rangers players all thumbed their noses at both management & Renney over the workout & the Avery rumor. Discipline, fear and leadership are lacking in the locker room. The inmates have taken over the Asylum/Country Club. Redden, Gomez & Naslund. Renney may be forced out.

  98. quick question… Renney in post game interview was asked by Giannone something about looking toward next game on Monday to which Renney replied something like “they should look toward Sunday…” which followed by very uncomfortable silence… any idea what that means?

  99. Right now the only players I would keep: Henrik, Staal, Dubie,Z, Korpie(he needs to play more), Cally(he tries), Betts & maybe Druary. Trade the rest and start anew.

  100. actually, I was at that game, and I DO GET IT. This team is a puck possession team, not an attacking team. There is a huge difference. With the exception of Zherdev, there is not one player on this team that can enter the zone and get a decent shot. Hence, the trapping team.

    Baumer is Ace. Because he too thinks a puck possession team equals a team that traps.

    Memo: If you like Ace don’t know that a puck possession team is the OPPOSITE of a team that traps, you are lost and no one can help you.

  101. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! .....says Greg L. on

    Avery Jagr and Shanny all made the Rangers have heart , wouldn ‘t hurt to have all of them back.

  102. Voice of Reason on

    Thank you Carp for the ‘Ghosts of firings past’ reminders. Last night sure looked like a Team that has had it with a Coach.

    When the Coach punishes a Team and the Team stops trying, their message is loud and clear: “It’s not us, it’s him.”

    While Renney has put numerous different lineups together, he hasn’t figured it out. He’s given Aaron Voros way too many chances to be physical, but you aptly described that you can’t hit someone if you can’t catch them.

    Rather than trying to find a Left Wing that can skate with Dubinsky and Zherdev, he plays Dubinsky on the Wing. Has Freddy Sjostrom played one full game with those two? NO… He’s not going to light it up, but he will work hard on the forecheck, go hard to the net when Zherdev dangles, and be responsible defensively.

    Renney however, does not want to hurt his 4th line (10 minutes of ice time per game) to improve his 3rd (18 minutes per game). Lauri Korpikoski could do what Sjostrom does on the 4th line.

    Has Renney tried putting Prucha with Gomez and Naslund? A few shifts here or there, but never for an entire game. Why not? He is tenacious on the forecheck, has a nose for the puck, and has scored more than 20 twice in this league.

    Late last year Dawes, Drury, and Callahan were the most consistent line game in and game out. Why has he not allowed their chemistry to grow?

    The idea of this Team was to be more balanced. Yes, the Team is not big, but we all knew that going into the season. So when your team is small, make sure you work hard on your Power Play EVERY DAY so that Teams pay if they take liberties against you.

    This Coach has blinders on…

    Try this forward lineup, and I’d wager they’d do a lot more than what we’ve seen lately:

    Naslund Gomez Prucha
    Sjostrom Dubinsky Zherdev
    Dawes Drury Callahan
    Korpikoski Betts Orr

    I never played past the College level. Why is this transparent to me, and not to the Coach?

    As far as Avery is concerned: He is a talented forechecker, a good skater, and sees the ice well. He is a mediocre finisher at best. The question becomes, who do you play him with?

    Is it with Naslund (a signing he called a mistake in July) and Gomez? Or is it with Dubinsky (a guy he exchanged pleasantries with in pre-game warm ups at the Garden earlier this year)and Zherdev? Or do you have him room with Valiquette (a guy he called a career minor leaguer)?

    Bringing him in doesn’t make the Team bigger, doesn’t improve the Power Play, doesn’t assist the Coach in putting the right lines together. All it does is give the team more distractions.

    For those fans that want what’s truly best for the Organization, bringing in Avery may indeed accelerate the exile of both Sather and Renney. That is the only reason I do want him back!!!!!!

  103. some FACTS.

    Naslund huge long term contract, really 2 years the first yr. almost done for $4 mill.

    Naslunds contract is not in Reddens stratosphere.

    Now all the naysayers say the yare right, the friggin rangers made the playoffs 3 straight years and if Hollwegg had a brain could have beaten Pittsburgh and you remember the sabre series a few years ago..

    The Redden signing is beyond bad under any measurment.

    trade or put on waivers voros, redden, and sjustrom.. if the yget picked up great obviously redden will not and then send him down(save cap money).

    I think reitz can be a decent stay at home d man who hits…

    the d without redden would be; staal, girardi, roszival, mara, reitz and figure it out.. is this a top offensive D? absolutely not but they are not getting Phaneuf and look at the Devils offensive skills on there D(they stink but they figure it out).

    without voros and sju add prucha and Avery in a few weeks what do you get a marginally better team, more speed and marginally better scoring…

    look to make a trade that does not mortgage the future and if you can for a scoring forward ..There are no stud D men that will be moved.. If Tzachuk can be rented for a very cheap price(very cheap) do it…

    that is the best that can be expected.

    Grachev who is in Jr’s. is not playing for the Rangers this year so get a life….

    Laugh all you want a team without redden, voros, and sju, and playing Orr once in a blue moon with the addition of Prucha(really play him) and Avery will not win the playoffs but will make the playoffs..

    Last but not least Renny needs to decide if this is a meritocracy or not.. WHen gomez screws up if he does not pay the price then why does Dawes have to pay the price??????

  104. just get a finisher someone who can FINISH, kotalik makes 2.33m why cant we trade for a guy like that??? we need a finisher

  105. Hey, all they need is a “little bit o’ luck”, that big headed little freak from the NY lottery. He’ll fix everything.

  106. I don’t care who is going to feel uncomfortable by Avery’s presence. These are grown ass men, not fourth graders on the playground.

  107. forget last year’s players. last year they only won 42 games. they only need 13 wins in the final 29 games to equal that.

    they were playing more of a forecheck game in the early season, and Renney for some stupid reason has pulled them away from that, and benched a guy who does drive to the net, Prucha.

    for many good reasons , the team has lost confidence in salesman Renney, and they quit on him the last game.

    Renney needs to go. that will restore the team to some normalcy. then add thru trade a guy who can go to the net, add a physical Dman, put Prucha back in, and quit using guys on top lines they can’t keep up with.

    today’s game is a speed game, so playing a neutral zone trap wastes that skating ability.

    I noticed that Dallas played a forecheck trap, a 2-1-2 most of the time. they pressured in the offensive zone, as Gomez found out early.

    that is what the Rangers need to go back to. put pressure in the offensive zone like they did early in the season. Renney got so overly cautious and paranoid, that he spoiled the early chemistry of the team.

    but again, they have more wins in early Feb than they had either of the last 2 years, and a coaching change is vital, because renney has lost the team recently, and a trade or 2 will put them in decent shape. not cup winning shape, but at least decent shape.

  108. No heart…..no passion….no right to be called NY Rangers.

    At least Avery, Jagr, and Shannahan had what we miss.

  109. This just in… In an odd and probably insane move, NYR GM Glen Sather signed Terrel Owens, Pac-Man Jones and Michael Vick to 2-year contracts each worth 2M per.

    When asked if he thought it was odd that he signed football players to his hockey team Sather responded “We needed some flavour other than vanilla in our locker-room… plus they can’t be any worse than 10-2.”

    To clear enough cap space for this outlandish experiment the eccentric GM sent G Henrik Lundqvist to the Tampa Bay Lightning for future considerations.

  110. NEWS FLASH!!!!!

    Sather quits and says he messed up the Rangers so he could go back to Edmonton and the Rangers wouldn’t be able to sign anyone for years!!!

  111. I wonder if bringing Avery back is a way to get rid of Drury and Redden. telling them that if you guys don’t like him, well then we’ll have to trade you, or demote you to hartford if no one wants your contract.

  112. Max-Well said about the Giants. They are the best run team in NY because they’re consistent and don’t throw around money to solve their problems like the Yankees who are #2 best run team (not recently).

    I’d do some pretty crazy stuff to have a coach like Tom Coughlin and especially a GM like Jerry Reese who is a scout at heart and unlike Sather is always scouting.

  113. Carp. Thanks for saying it like it is. Two things. 1) On NHL on the Fly last night the reporters seemed to think the Rangers team (other than Hank and Mara) had been hit by the flu and used that as an excuse for the way the team played. Are other guys on the team ailing as well and we just don’t know? 2) I actually think the biggest reason for the Rangers falling apart the way they did is that no one stood up to Ott. When Zherdev had his nose broken, no one stood up for him. There were no Adam Graves’ in the lineup, and that hit went unpunished. I blame Renney for this 100%. Sure, he put Orr out there on the next faceoff. But Orr backed away after the linesman said something to him (which is not what you want out of your enforcer). This team loses its will because it seems unable to compete physically. That’s why all of the offense is perimeter. This team is cooked. I actually want them to tank because this next draft is so deep, it would be great to get a higher pick out of it.

  114. interesting observation from a TSN fan…On Avery…
    feb 6th:
    “Very interesting. He sat across the aisle from me yesterday on a flight from Toronto to Los Angeles. He looked like a train wreck with some crazy camouflage trousers and a strange sort of windbreaker. He was sullen and never once said please or thank you to the flight attendant. Very rude. And then those stupid big sunglasses came out. “9 or 10″ NOT”

    NYRinPHX: the only players I could see Calgary trading might be D man Vandermeer or Aucoin…Dawes doesn’t seem to fit size wise in Sutters Plan…maybe he thinks he could rebuild Reddon!!

    On Avery….yes the best way to right this Ranger ship is bringing on board…a Rat!! If only HE realizes HE is a 1/2 priced rat….

    If Dallas and the Rangers work out this “deal”, is their the possibility that the 21 teams below the Rangers would have first crack at him?? (L.A., Toronto, Edmonton)

    How about Neil instead??

  115. oh and about last night….

    This was heard from the head coach after Buffalo beat Edmonton last week ….hmm 10-2!!

    *”A debacle of monumental proportion”*

    craig mactavish
    TUESDAY, JANUARY 27, 2009

    Heard from the Rangers dressing room last night….

    Renney said. “You know what a loss is a loss.”

    “No one’s saying it’s rock bottom,” said Scott Gomez


  116. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! .....says Greg L. on

    yeah Salty , you were right all along….give your self a great big pat on the back!! Yeah what the hell do you know . Avery back would shake things upa and he holds people accountable . Hate him like we all do but lets face it …he plays with passion.

  117. Sutter probably sees Dawes as a St. Louis type project.

    Maybe Calgary would take Redden for some junk..eh, who am I kidding.

    Vally did have the flu so maybe that’s why he broke down the way he did. This team should be on the ice today, but of course they’re not.

    Seriously, why is everything it NY always a big deal and song and dance? It’s really not that hard. We as Rangers fans should do like that earlier post said and pay $100 each to take over the team and elect a President every few years. If I took over as GM of this team right now, first order of business is to waive Redden and if he whines, he goes to ECHL not Hartford and Gomez would have to earn my trust back.

  118. Can we also stop the crap about Jagr having heart, he never did. Which is not to say i didnt like him.

    There is a difference between having passion plus wanting to win and having heart.

    Anyone in columbus who thought Zerdev was lazy never saw Jagr backcheck

  119. Said it last night Carp and gotta agree with you. That was definitely a “Firing Game” for Renney and staff. Can’t believe they’re still employed, unless we just haven’t heard about it because of A-Rod.

  120. Voice of Reason on

    If Avery clears Waivers, then clears re-entry waivers, and is still available, what does that tell everyone on this Blog that wants him?

    30 teams passed on him in round 1, then another 20 would have to pass until the Rangers had a crack at him on re-entry.



    Great…Just what the Organization needs…

    As far as playing with a guy you hate: This isn’t baseball where your actions are individualistic. You have to communicate with your linemates, and adjust shift by shift. If your linemate is someone you can’t stand, the communication suffers.

    Should it be that way? Maybe not, but it IS that way..

    Bringing in Avery is desperate act by a desperate GM.

    Wanting him back as a fan is like wanting that old girlfriend back that you hated (and were relieved to break up with).

    Usually one one your buddies reminds you to stop thinking with your penis, and to wake up!!!!

    Consider me your buddy…lol

  121. across the wire…

    “Carolina Hurricanes acquired left wing Jussi Jokinen from Tampa Bay in exchange for Wade Brookbank, Josef Melichar and Carolina’s fourth-round draft pick in 2009.”

    Tampa Bay gets bigger and tougher.

    Jussi Jokinen is at the least a top 6 forward, although he might be a bit soft….

    I wonder if Sather ponders trades, looks at the waiver wire….gets any updates from NHL head quarters…or does he just reminisces about the good old days??

  122. Cynar great post on Jagr … he won’t come back to the Rangers now … no way … they disrespected him … not offering a 2 year contract and then giving it to Naslund …

    Unfortunately Renney has to go … if Shoney does not want the job give it to Messier …

    Also the Rangers leadership is lacking … this is the worse leadership since Messier phoned in his last 2 years as a Ranger … Gomez is not a leader … he sucks … Naslund- why is he a captain?

  123. Jussi Jokinen who hasn’t scored since November 13th, don’t we have that guy in the lineup last name starts with a V?

  124. voice of reason….great post!

    Bottom Line: He is still nothing better than a third line winger, never has been, never will be!

    Perhaps last nights “sit in” or “revolt” or “quit”, was more of an expression of how they feel about Avery coming back as opposed to the “skate your bag off” practice from the day before….or maybe it was just “the flu”!!

  125. I love the closed door meeting BS.

    How many of those have they had this season?

    “We’re embarrased”

    Whatever. They should have been embarrassed after the Graves night debocle. Or after losing to the Isles having given up 2 shorties… or after blowing a 4 goal lead against the Caps at Christmas… or after allowing 5 goals in the third against the Leafs…

    It goes on and on!!!

  126. *A debacle of monumental proportion*

    It wasn’t so much about Jussi but about taking action and moving forward….and Jussis wopping 16 points would put him above all our third line forwards…yes all 7 of them.

  127. If I were Renney and I had defenders like the ones on this board who do not know the difference between being a puck possession team and a trapping team, I would be afraid. Very afraid.

  128. What do we have to loose?

    Messier, Richter, and Leetch for the Rangers coaching staff. It’s worth a try in my opionion.

  129. If you want to indict Sather, the true problem with the team is not only with the expensive players they’ve signed (although Redden is a huge problem) but with his abysmal drafting record.

    The Rangers have 2 All-Star caliber players that they themselves drafted – Lundqvist and Staal. Everyone else that’s part of the “youth movement” are spare parts. Even Brandon Dubinsky is at best a second line wing or third line center. Ryan Callahan is a third liner, Dawes a third or fourth liner. Korpikoski a good third liner. In fact a great third line for this team would be Callahan/Dubinsky/Korpikoski. As great as Blair Betts is on the PK, he cannot score.

    Every good team in this league has at least 5-6 guys who are the result of good scouting and development. We dont have that.

  130. Gomez burns me up with his “it’s not rock bottom” comment. he was trying to absolve himself from criticism for his bonehead blunder that started the whole mess.

    he won’t take responsibility, except in a hushed, inaudible whisper that few can hear, that was more of an “everyone” comment, not addressing his key blunder.

    and Drury is the same way. getting him to do an interview is like pulling teeth. captain Introvert, he wants to be left alone.

  131. I don’t think anyone will pick up Avery other than the Rangers and probably another 1 or 2 teams he might want to play for. My bet would be that Avery’s agent has spoken to most teams to either gauge their interest or put it through the right channels that Sean isn’t going to play anywhere he doesn’t want to go and to watch out if you pick him up against his wishes – a major headache is coming your way. That’s at least what I would do.

  132. Man….you’re post is dead nuts on…..The Rangers will never be a competitive hockey club as long as Glen Sather is the GM!

  133. It is way too depressing even to skim through these posts!

    I just want to say that we aren’t the only team to have our fourth line on the ice during overtime. I just saw Yelle out there for the Bruins.

    Ference did his best Marek Malik impression to lose the game for the Bruins in OT. The ouck bounced in off of his leg (or something) from the side of the net. Not good for us, especially since the Flyers were losing 3-1 after one.

  134. on Dubi and Korpi being 3rd lines the guys are 22 years old…..

    you think Jeff Carter was a star the first few years??

    that is the ranger thinking, 22 yr old not producing he stinks and never will be good trade him.. Yeah Marc Savard will never be anything!!!!

    dawes is 23 years old, is he going to be a superstar????Highly highly improbable but can he be a 20 goals scorer??

    Absolutely, he scored at every level, and he has always been small.

    THe stupidity and impatience on young players is laughable on this site…Staal has 2 goals he will never be any good on offense..That is mocking statement for you morons…

  135. 5-0 wings, lol anyone think they’ll get more than 10… didnt oilers just lose 10-2 to sabres like 2 weeks ago?

  136. Tim Thomas is defintely going to be the go to goalie I think for the B’s when it comes to playoff time. I don’t see how the Bruins would trust Manny Fernandez in a big time spot, even though that goal he just let up was a fluke in ot.

  137. JJP…(although i agree that this is probably going on)

    “Sean isn’t going to play anywhere he doesn’t want to go and to watch out if you pick him up against his wishes”

    If he (avery) puts this “out there”, with restrictions on where he will play….you think teams or the NHL will assume he he is “rehabilitated” or “fixed”

    …nope the same SELFISH, MALCONTENT,MALIGNANCY…third line winger.

  138. yeah peter way to be able to count..

    Girardi is that from good scouting? Every team in the league thought he could not play except 1.. I forgot Girardi is 24 and will never amount to anything and Dubi and callahan in like the 6th round.

    AA in the 2nd round.. I forgot he will never be any good he did not score in his first and only NHL game…

    When you evaluate the ranger incompetence at least be fair.

    Again there biggest problem system wise is the seniority system vs a meritocracy like most other teams..

    They are the 5th youngest team in the league.. the ycannot score and there big signings have underachieved those are there problems…

    there cap situation is not great but not as bad as portrayed. Especally if they had any guts and waived players that deserve to be waived..

  139. stuart, the knock on Dawes is not about him becoming a 20 goal scorer. the problem is that he is horrible along the boards and in the corner, 2 things that are vital for wingers to be.

    he does not have the GRIT to be a good PLAYOFF winger, and that is what you look for . not a reg season floater who can get a few opportunistic goals, but a playoff grinder who can go into the corners and the front of the net with authority.

  140. guys how does the waiver thing work in general, say a player is placed on waivers, does each teach get a call saying ok u want him and team says yes or no or how?

  141. anyone intersted in flyers rangers tix for sunday let me know. the seats are 330 and they are 70 each. have 2 tix. 516-749-3110

  142. “Jagr felt privilaged to play here, does anyone think the current roster feels that way??”

    Exactly. Shanny as well. It was an honor for them, but for these greedy pieces of shit, it’s all aboot the money. They can see a Rangers jersey lying on the floot and they wont care, as long as it’s not the one they’re using for the game.

    I hate this team, us fans deserve better. If they’re gonna lose, go out fighting, don’t give up.

    I still cant believe Renney still has his job. I don’t care if this makes me less of a fan, but i hope they lose the next game, and the game after, and just keep losing until this scumbag gets fired. I had enough of this team under Renney, changes need to come. It would be nice if Slats just quit out of nowhere, and the Dolans jumped into a car that they thought was Car Service, but it actually was Heatley’s car, and he was driving with the wheel in one hand, and a bottle of scotch in the other. That makes for a good movie.

    I agree with the guy who said some other team will pick Aves up. Too bad they cant get some insurance out of this, Dallas is getting what they want, and Nyr might get what they want. It’s a little unfair if we help them out, and someone snatches Aves, and we get left with jack.

    Im looking forward to Aves as a Ranger. He belongs here, and at the very least, we’ll have a player that shows some passion, unlike the great Gomez, and Drury. Losers.

    Hopefully the Devils, and Isles win tonight, just to bury these losers even more.


  143. Joe make the playoffs and then worry about that. my rebuttal would be Sjustrom is 27 makes more money and brings what to the team? Same for Voros and others.

    THe coaches job is to put players in position to suceed and therfore it is renny’s job to either have Dawes line forechack harder or use him in more specific situations(no faceoff in own zone etc.) the bottom line is in my mind Dawes would benefit a team more then voros, orr, sjustrom and others…

    again why would a team that cannot score not roll 4 lines of better scorers????Boston has yelle, thornton, and others who are brick layers but they have high end scorers such as kessel, savard, krecji, etc. You can have a gritty defensive 3rd and 4th line when you have enough scoring elsewhere the rangers do not……..

  144. Voice of Reason on


    Dubi 2nd round
    Callahan 4th round respectively…


    Teams file an admission to the league which posts the waived player. The other Teams have a period of time to place a claim on the waived player. If more than one team places a claim, the team with the inferior record is awarded the waived player.

    Should nobody claim the player, he can go to the teams minor league affiliate or assigned to another team’s minor league affilate on loan. For the time the player is in the minors, his salary does not count against the cap.

    If they choose to summon the player from the minors, he must go on re-entry waivers. Similar to the waiver process, the other teams can claim the player. If they do, they can acquire the player at half of his salary (the team that originally waived him must match the freight). Once again if multiple team claim the player, the team with more inferior record will be awarded his rights.

  145. great seats sucks that team is playing this poor. 1230 start next sunday cant make. call me 2 seats 70 each 516-749-3110

  146. you don’t get it stuart. the 4th line has GRINDERS on it. Boston has Thornton, Yelle, and Bitz. the Sharks have Shelley, Lemieux etc

    dawes is not suited for anything but floating and looking for oportunities. you can’t forecheck with someone who is lousy in the corner. period.

  147. From today Daily News Article

    “Not incidentally, the last time the Rangers lost by eight goals was a 9-1 defeat in Ottawa on Jan.24, 2004, in Jaromir Jagr’s first game as a Ranger after being acquired from Washington. After that one, Bobby Holik opined that “fundamentally, we are the worst team in the NHL,” comments that did not sit well with then-coach/GM Glen Sather.”

  148. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! .....says Greg L. on

    Gomez is still a New Jesey Devil!!?? why is it , the Rangers lose and hes just a smiling up a storm. He looks like the muppet , ” gonzo ” and he should sound like Bobby Holik!! I hate old NJ players and Bruce Drver was the only one I did like. Like someone said earlier , NJ has “system players” so to put them on another team is pointless ….ala Gomez . Still hard to see him in a Ranger Jersey …I have hated him for so long!!

  149. Lev,


    I’d wait until he re-signs though.. I bought a Dubinsky jersey (jersey + name for 155) and I have a fear he might be traded (paranoia).

  150. After that one, Bobby Holik opined that “fundamentally, we are the worst team in the NHL,” comments that did not sit well with then-coach/GM Glen Sather.”


    right. compare that to “we did not hit rock bottom”

  151. i see on ebay from pro-sports.com a bid for $9 plus shipping but 6 days left…. seems like they have good feedback, anyone bought from them??

  152. Lev just make sure you can look at the picture of the Jersey real close. Then compare it with Moddells or whatever. I found 2 Manning Jersey’s 1 I got for $30 the other for $39 and both are pro jersey types. Stitch numbers and stuff, but if you don’t look close you could get burned.

  153. Leetch is the man on

    That was the worst game since the Rangers lost 91-92 to the Penguins 11-4. Mario scored 6 goals on Corey Hirsch. Major changed need to happen. Why would anyone ever think Drury and Gomez are first liners. They have played the second line their whole careers. You can pay them 7mill with no cap but 4mill at most with a cap. Its Glen Sather trying to hard to please the fans by just signing people. you Sather

  154. eric
    February 7th, 2009 at 4:05 pm
    great seats sucks that team is playing this poor. 1230 start next sunday cant make. call me 2 seats 70 each 516-749-3110


    eric…ill give u $5 for both tickets? let me know what u think…

  155. I got a Jagr jersey off of ebay. Great looking home (blue) jersey for $65. Replica with the tags on it.

  156. Lev- Yes projerseys is very good, and they have a good return policy, and if you have any additional questions email them they get back to you in less than a day.

  157. RICK is it the players, the coach, the system, the GM, or a combo of all? Seems pretty easy to just blame the players.

  158. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! .....says Greg L. on


    Betts : wont pass on a 2 on 1 , he shoots all the time!!??
    Voros : not being a factor out there and is too slow.
    Redden: unispired and can’t score.
    Rozi : wont shoot and is a pussy
    Kalinen: can’t stop making bad plays .
    Gomez : crappy defense and Offense.
    Vally : send to the minors , called up a rookie.
    ORR : can’t hit or fight when needed.
    Drury : Wake up and do something , your team is coming apart!

    My honors :

    Zherdev : keep being creative , god knows no one else will!!
    Staal : makes way more great plays than bad , like Z .
    Mara : Hits and act like a Ranger should.
    Dubinsky : The kids all heart and should be Captain .
    Korpi : solid play , needs more help form teamates.
    Hank : Ill take his A game anytime even if he lets in high shots!
    Callahan : little big man is as solid as they come!
    Naslund : Calm , cool and never smiles when he scores. Such class.
    Shoey: can controll the puck great along the boards.
    Girardi: good player on a weak system team.

  159. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! …..says Greg L.- I loved what you said about Mara. That is a guy that took less money to come back here, and has played well. I hope he is back next year. Defense next year something along the lines of Roszival, Redden, Staal, Girardi, Mara, Sanguinetti, with maybe Reitz or Potter as the 7 guy.

  160. RICK way too many fans think it’s one more than others. I would imply from what you wrote, that Renney has lost this team , and needs to be the first move & reassigned or fired. With others moves to be made by the GM until the owner wakes up, and hopefully sells out or gets a new GM at least.

  161. it’s a combo, but the owner is not going to change and neither is the GM for years, so fans are being realistic when they target Renney. they know that he is the main person that could be changed. heck, even getting rid of certain players with huge contracts will be harder than getting rid of Renney.

  162. orr was able to sell my tix on stubhub and made some money. this team isnt worth watching right now. as a season tix holder i should get some money back. i freaking hate all of these losers. devils 5 rangers 1. shanny has a hat trick and beats up voros.

    sather please drop dead

  163. funny orr. in all seriousness we have similar views so i agree i wish your right hand could knock them all out. i have never felt this ashamed of this team as i do today.

    by tues night we will be in 9th.

    sather u freaking suck

  164. Carp, if you get a chance in the near future to ask any Ranger vet players a question,

    please ask them if they think that the poor performance in Dallas was in any way related to the bag skate,

    and also ask if they think it was in any way related to the rumors about Avery returning.


  165. I’m a little late to the party here, but Carp:

    You can say that a team isn’t good enough when it breaks its back in all three zones, does the big things right, does the little things right, outhustles, outhits, out-hungers the other guys ….. and still loses because it can’t finish, etc. Circumstances like these are when it makes sense to say a team isn’t good enough.

    But when a team collapses in terms of effort, structure, willingness to be physical, play without the puck, inability to generate offense the way the Rangers did last night, that is the LAST set of circumstances to justify a statement that a team isn’t good enough.

    GEt what I’m saying? A 2-1 loss where you outplay the opposition but can’t bury the chances you are working to create? The definition of “not good enough.”

    But when you lose 10-2 to a middle-of-the-pack team and show no guts or character or fight or cohesion or clue as a unit, you have not even risen to a level where the ability of your roster can be evaluated in any professional way.

  166. Left out a word that ought to have been inserted: “A 2-1 loss where you outplay the SUPERIOR opposition…”

  167. agree wd40. when the GM is on the trip and you play lousy in front of him like that, it looks like the players were giving him their statement about Renney.

  168. It would surprise me if the Rangers were in 9th by Tuesday, morning or night, considering that we can’t lose points for playing, and the Hurricanes only have one game before then. It just goes to show you the stupidity that runs rampant in the Rangers Report comments section. You should charge money for people to be able to see your hilarious comments!

  169. But I didn’t think the team was good enough before the 10-2 game. Or before the losing streak began.

    And since you can’t change the owner, who won’t fire the GM who signed all the unmovable players, well, it will all land on the coach. And the next coach, whomever he is, and whenever he gets here, is going to have some huge job in front of him. (an even harder job if he is handcuffed with Avery for the next three years).

  170. Gump Worsley was hilarious

    on the old show with Don Cherry, they asked him when he was playing for the Rangers in the old days, which team gave him the most trouble.

    he said, ” the Rangers, of course”

  171. Rick

    Who would you think would be the front runner if Renney gets canned? I wouldnt mind it either Hartley or Torts – both coaches with some fire…

  172. If there are any bored stat nerds


    interesting stuff

    Dubinsky is 2nd on the team in points/60min (zherdev #1)

    Callahan doesn’t have a primary assist this year (5 on 5)

    CORSI RATING – “Measures the number of shots directed at net while a player was on the ice at even strength, excluding empty net situations. For example, if Player A skates a shift in which he takes a shot that misses the net, his teammate then puts one on goal and another teammate blocks a shot at the other end before the end of Player A’s shift, Player A will have a +1 Corsi Rating for that shift.”

    Sjostrom’s -13 but has a corsi rating of 4.3
    Orr -10 and -10.2
    Betts -6 and -3.7

    Strange the one line that remains essentially intact could have such different numbers.

    Voros’ Corsi is 14.2! It’s higher than Zherdev’s!

  173. Redden’s got a nice stat

    He’s on the ice for the least amount of goals against/60 min*

    *among players who avg 15 minutes or more of ice time (only 4 of them, so not an impressive sample size)

    i tried wade. i tried

  174. That’s what I said earlier Carp, Renney would go long before Sather does.

    Renney talk aside though, right now it just doesn’t seem like the Rangers have a true leader on the ice or in the locker room. Drury was praised all offseason of how great a leader he is, but I haven’t seen it. He seems dead in interviews and rarely shows emotion.

    The Rangers need someone who can bring them energy and give them a jolt in their game. I still think Avery would be a good start, even though he comes with a lot of baggage.

  175. staal’s only blocked 28 shots. Rozy’s leads the team with 56, but that’s only good enough for 50th in the league! Michaelek on the coyotes has 130!


  176. wow devils announcers are such s, clearly puck was kicked in, bad luck or good luck but it was obivously kicked in, put his skate down and kicked it in

  177. Rick Carpiniello
    February 7th, 2009 at 6:12 pm
    But I didn’t think the team was good enough before the 10-2 game. Or before the losing streak began.

    And since you can’t change the owner, who won’t fire the GM who signed all the unmovable players, well, it will all land on the coach. And the next coach, whomever he is, and whenever he gets here, is going to have some huge job in front of him. (an even harder job if he is handcuffed with Avery for the next three years).

    Why isn’t the media roasting Dolan? If it’s the owner’s fault, shouldn’t you guys let the people know it? I live in Dallas and Jerry Jones gets his butt handed to him in the media regularly. This leads me to believe that either Dolan has more clout (Cablevision also owns a newspaper) or the Dallas media has more balls.

  178. Because people have been roasting Dolan for 10-12 years now, and it goes nowhere. He doesn’t answer for it, he doesn’t talk to us, he takes no responsibility, and every sports related decision he makes is wrong. And what good does it do? He won’t sell the team(s) or the Garden. And, yes, he owns a newspaper and several cable stations.

    Hey Josh, what don’t you like?

  179. Colton Orr is a buffoon…. watching him try to fight Steve Ott and get clobbered by three other Stars players with no back up was humorous…. your Rangers looked pathetic out there and the Stars completely destroyed your precious bunch of overpaid morons…. alot like other New York teams trying to pay for wins… HAHA pathetic

  180. mike… u came here all the way from Dallas? to tell us what we already know? sad live u got buddy…very sad… do us all a favor… disappear :)

  181. No scoop yet.

    by the way, I meant to mention this before … doesn’t it seem that Gomez doesn’t understand the phrase “hit rock bottom” because he kept denying that this is rock bottom, as if he was being insulted? Sometimes it’s a good thing to say you’ve hit rock bottom, because what that actually means is it can’t get worse. So unless Gomez thinks it can get worse, he shouldn’t get all ticked off when somebody asks that simple question. I really think he doesn’t know what it means.

  182. watching the devils-kings. the kings have some phenomenal young talent. Announcers just said kings are the youngest team in the league, devils the second oldest.

  183. yea rick, listening to that interview yesterday i pretty much understood gomez as saying” no no this isnt rock bottom we can get worse”

  184. …or Gomez just meant..losing another ten games, dropping out of playoffs, finishing in last place, never winning again…thats hitting rock bottom..not just one loss i Dallas…

    personally…I think it can get worse as well

  185. Good call Carp, I found that a little strange, as if Gomez lost something in translation. Like someone asked him “are you the worst team in the league?” Little did he know he was keeping alive the chances of a 14-0 loss.

  186. Hey also I just remembered, when giannone was giving renney that interview on post-game, renney said something they have to be worried come sunday… i didnt get what he meant, i actually at first took it as if he thought game against devils is sunday OR there would be a major change sunday. any thoughts?

  187. Oh really? I’ll believe it when I see it.

    Maybe we shouldn’t get too worked up about Scotty Gomez’ postgame comments. He looked like he was trying to hold it together, had just played a terrible game, been benched for the entire third period until the last minute when he was put back on the ice to truly make him feel ashamed.

    The hope is that it’s not in fact the players but the system that Renney is asking them to play that is getting the least out of them. otherwise Rick is right, we’re in deep doodoo.

  188. Is John Tortarella on TV tonight? If he is on TV, he is not Ranger coach. If he isn’t. . . . . . .

  189. Joe if that statement u made isnt true then we all get to beat u up. its very wrong to post something like that and get our hopes up.

  190. Hartley isn’t a good coach, he can’t coach young guys as epr an interview with John Dellapina during the 07 playoffs and as evidence he set that ATL team back 3-5 years with his stupid trade of Coburn and mishandling Lettohnen in the playoffs. C’mon Rangers fans, you’re better than that. I’d hope you all want a young team that fore checks, plays hard, and plays tough.

  191. …although I dont think Hartley made the trades…that was Waddell or woddle or whatever his name is

  192. yea maybe but there was this like 5-10 second pause after renney said that, eitehr giannone expected renney to say something else or he was like wtf?

  193. Well the 8:20 flash on espn radio was the national update where they just did the arod story, college basketball scores, and NBA scores so I will wait for a local NYC flash to see about this Renney story. It is sad on the national update they didn’t even nhl scores.

  194. Dear Rick,

    I am really diappointed in your Fall Out entry. Being a journalist I would think that, to be fair and objective, after you posted Tippet’s record with the Stars, you would post Renney’s record with the Rangers. Since you didn’t do it, I will.

    Renney’s Coaching Record 2004 to 2009

    Games Coached 318, Wins-162, Loses-96, OTL 40, Playoffs-3

    You admitted that you have only just come back on the scene and need to come up to speed with the last few years of Rangers history. Renney’s history with the Rangers had been the most positive since 1994.

    Regardless of what anyone thinks of Renney, Sather is the architect of this team. Sather is the one who signed all these bad contracts. He is the one who should take the fall. We all know he won’t. He’s the Isaih of Hockey.

    The Penguins lost 9 games in January. Everyone was saying Therrien had lost that team. He has Crosby, Fleury and Malkin among others. Do the Rangers have these caliber players? Don Cherry crys boo hoo. Poor Cindy. The Penguins lost Hossa and Malone in the off season and Gonchar has been out injured. That’s their excuse. Therrien’s still there.

    The Stanley Cup Champions just lost 5 games in a row but no one accused Babcock of losing his team. Babcock’s team is 1000% more talented then these Rangers. Babcock still has his job.

    Does Renney have cup finalists on his team like Babcock or Therrian do? We all know that answer. The Rangers, as presently constructed, are be lucky to make the playoffs.

    I still say it’s the players. They didn’t give up last night. They never came to play in the first place. Maybe they are riddled with the flu but the fan base is sick of excuses.

    Firing Renney will make the fans feel better. It won’t turn things around this season. Players need to be moved or waived, starting with Gomez and Redden. I say make Renney GM and get rid of Sather. Nine years of his malfeasance is enough.

  195. Gotta love the Rangers website…after they lose 10-2 the story becomes the “fifth deep” oh the main screen…usually when they win its the first pic/story until the next game…they put up 4 newer stories today to bury it!!

  196. 0necupin67years on

    If they fire Renney who will replace him?
    I mean who would want to replace him?
    then if sather is fired the new gm will most likely want his own hand picked stooge and stoolie asst’s.
    So , unless sather is also fired you’ll have another lame duck coach with no power to act ,because the players hold the power, they can’t be moved.

  197. Gals and Guys-How would you feel if Ken Gernander took over? He’s done excellent work in HFD in his 1.5 seasons as head coach and guys like Callahan, Vally, Dubinsky love the guy. Plus he’s very familiar with Sanguinetti, Anisimov, etc.

    MHurley-Sather stays President, Reneny to the GM Press Box, and Kenny G takes over as head coach. Thoughts?

  198. HOLY CRAP and WOW!!!! That is all I can say right now. We can discuss tomorrow if what I just heard really happens.

  199. The Rangers are barely .500 team since the 2006 Olympic break….dont let the OT loss/ Bettman gizmo fool you…
    42W 40L the last two years

  200. Milbury and Strachan on the Hotstove both say that rumors are swirling around Pat Quinn and Shoney to take over for Renney. Milbury called the Rangers “underachievers” for all your droolers. LeBrun pointed to Sather (with reason) as the culprit for signing Gomez and Drury, but McLean at once slapped him down by saying ” it’s the coach, they’re great players, who wouldn’t have signed them.”

  201. Ah, screw it. I just heard from a friend, who usually has pretty reliable information that. He is saying that Renney is DONE, and that someone who was once a part of the Ranger organization will be the new coach. He also said, someone who was one time coached by this incoming coach will also be a part of the Rangers by March 4th. Also, 1, maybe 2, of our big contracts will be gone by March 4th in order to make room for an even bigger contract. And also, that Avery will be a Ranger.

  202. mhurley, your argument was too cogent for most on this blog. Between the knee-jerk reactionaries after every game (trade everyone) and the experts who quote the “obvious” deficiencies but have very little positive to say, you’ll never win. Unfortunately, I think Renney will ultimately be the fall guy for horrid play by his players and Sather’s mistakes as GM.

    As an aside, Gomez has been the most disappointing player for me so far. Between two Hall of Famers, Zherdez, young guys – he has yet to be consistent with anyone. His snarky attitude post game bothers me too, it’s bearable if your team is kicking ass but he and they aren’t. People beat up Drury but he’s been far better, I see a lot more hustle and smarts in his play – even if he is understated.

  203. Nasty

    all i care about is that renney is gone. if this happens by wed’s game. nasty ur first drink of the evening is on me.

  204. The only person on that show that has ANY credibilty is Strachan. What did Al say?

    McLean is Cherry’s smiling second banana and enabler. He has nothing between his ears. He’s the Chico Resch of HNIC.

  205. That was it, pretty much word for word in the email I just got.

    What I take it as:

    Tortarella, Lecavalier, Avery

    Going the other way, I have no idea.

    I am not saying this is 100% reliable, and I am not making this up, but I have received accurate information from this guy before and I am willing to at least accept it. It is not Eklund BS.

  206. JJP,

    i disagree a little bit. For a few games renney had nas gomer and nikki z together. They looked awesome renney didnt like it cause gomer and nikki z rnt the most defensively responsible.

  207. You know what Rick, I do feel better. Ha, I knew I couldn’t keep it in all night. I was going to try to. Renney could be gone as soon as tomorrow.

  208. Speaking of Pat Quinn. I was in Turin for the Olympics, and one of the nights I was there I went to a random restaurant on some side street. Low and behold Quinn is dining their with his entire family. It was after the disappointing showing (as i was there to watch the SF between Swe and CzRp). The guy seemed like such a nice guy and his little grandson kept telling him ridiculously bad jokes. Some French people recognized him and harassed him, which was pretty uncool, and he told them he was trying to eat with his family. We were right next to him and I guess he noticed that we recognized him, so after he finished dinner he came over and shook our hands…shame I didnt have my camera. So because of that encounter with the guy, I’d love to see him coach. By the way, the guy is huge…and I dont mean in the fat sense.

  209. Rick, if you have heard anything in the same ballpark, can you just say yes or no? You do not have to give any more than a yes or no answer.

  210. Torts and Vinny are vinegar and oil right now. Forget that one. Schoney & Vinny. . . . .maaaaaayyyyyyyyybbbeeeeee. Maybe

  211. Gomez 3 trips to Stanley cup finals….


    I think one of them knows what it takes to get there…no?

  212. JJP,

    Thanks. Yes, I realize I am a Don Quixote. My cross to bear.

    Your take on Gomer and his “snarky” attitude is spot on. I’ve had enough of it, too. If he’s ging to run his smart mouth, he should be able to back it up.

  213. I am waiting on an inside scoop as well. . . . the lack of a response means it is either happening or not. . . . .maybe.

  214. Lecavalier makes sense for us. If we can move out one of Gomez or Drury. We need badly a legit first line center and scoring threat. He only makes sense if we can clear cap room though.

  215. Nasty
    your awesome, love you sharing it with all of us other Ranger die hards

    And Carp, love that you respond to us, way more than Sam ever did. (not taking anything away from the great Weinman) but jsut so you know, it’s appreciated!!

    Im going to the March 8th game vs boston, I wonder what our team will look like by then?

  216. mhurley

    Strachan was pretty dismissive of Renney, said the rumors have been out there for a while, and rolled his eyes while saying that losing 10-2 will not help stop the calls for his firing. He was not, in short, very supportive of the argument LeBrun was making.

  217. Hey guys, it is my pleasure. Just know that I am sharing what was told to me and that I am not making it up. If this was just a buddy of mind speculating I would not even bother, but because of my source, I am more than willing to believe there is truth to it. Again, people throw the word “source” around like it is a frisbee, but I am being sincere here.

  218. Sincere in the sense that I am being honest with all of you. Maybe sincere was not the right word, but it kind of works there, no?

  219. Double the posts, double the waiver claims, double the mediocrity on the ice. You are a catalyst Carp!!!

  220. My excuse is that I care way to much for an organization that lost by 8 goals last night. What the hell is wrong with me?

  221. Do you all know what Tampa is going to ask for for Vinny L? They’ll take Gomez alright, but with him they’ll demand at least a first rounder, and any two of Anisimov/Grachev/Del Zotto/Sanguinetti. I’m not down for that.

  222. JJP, mhurley


    The list goes on. No question Sather deserves every bit of condemnation, but frightened, vanilla, “Atlanta is a good team” Renney is right there with him. It is not an EITHER/OR …. they both stink.

  223. Im waiting for my fiance to get done with Girls night dinner so we can get some drinks, thats why Im still here

    And NAsty you been good in the past, so no worries.

    How do you feel about that rumor though?
    And who do you thinkis going south in this deal as far as two big contracts?
    I cant see Drury going?
    Gomer and Redden?

    and the debbies jsut loss, a little bit of a breather

  224. I am not sure. I can see a big contract, prospects, and a roster player or two going for Vinny. I can see another big contract going somewhere else for some roster players and a pick or a prospect.

  225. Nasty if you are correct…I will always remember you as fondly as I remember this old-fart in the Bronx bar who told me that the Rangers had signed Messier…he actually said “messy-lay” but I knew what he was trying to say as he gulped his 35 cent glass of tap-bud

  226. Also, I am not sure it would be Gomez that is sent off. For some reason, if this Avery thing is a reality, I can see Drury being shipped out.

  227. yea rick it is pretty cool that you are willing to hang around on a saturday night like this and chat about the rangers, it is appreciated

  228. Nasty-

    Was your inside email about 1 big contract leaving and you hypothesizing about another big contract leaving us, or did it say 2 big contracts out the door?

  229. No, it was exactly as it was typed above.

    “Ah, screw it. I just heard from a friend, who usually has pretty reliable information that. He is saying that Renney is DONE, and that someone who was once a part of the Ranger organization will be the new coach. He also said, someone who was one time coached by this incoming coach will also be a part of the Rangers by March 4th. Also, 1, maybe 2, of our big contracts will be gone by March 4th in order to make room for an even bigger contract. And also, that Avery will be a Ranger.”

  230. “traded for messy-lay I meant”.. anyway…enough crying for poor Renney and the inept- Sather he had to put up with………I can hear Sather now..”Yea, sorry about the Lundqvists and Jagr ( at half-price) and Shanny and Straka..sorry about Prucha scoring 52 goals in two seasons he actually got to play..sorry about adding three stanley cups with Drury and Gomez…sorry about the Avery trade…I really screwed you over heh?…and then Redden…and Zherdev…sorry you were so undermanned here in NY”

  231. I figured it out, Nasty IS Glen Sather.

    Have you ever seen them both in the same room together??

  232. Didnt see your earlier post
    so you DO think it will be Drury going?
    I thought Gomer had more of a hard time with him than drury

    Hockey nigh tlive was jsut talking about whats going on in Rangerland and DAve Maloney said ALOT is goin gon, then al Trautface said we have to talk about that later

  233. yea i think if these rumors are legit it would be drury being sent out over gomez because i think drury was quoted somewhere that he wants no part of avery returing to new york

  234. No I don’t care to share the source. And you can take that however you want it. I have someone who is willing to share inside information with me, and I am not going to say who it is. I don’t mean that in a nasty way.

  235. Prucha25, LeBrun was essentially saying this is all Sather’s mess for signing Gomez and Drury (note he didn’t mention Redden). But as I said the sentiment on the show was hey, those guys have excelled elsewhere, won Cups, so it’s probably the coach who can’t get the best of them, etc…

  236. I gotta tell you, I think changing coaches at this stage ruins our playoff chances for this year.

    I’d love to be proved wrong

  237. I hate Dolan. You want a good owner, look at Ted Leonisis from the Caps and all the charity work he does and how he answers your questions if you email him via AOL..except that one time he strangled a fan…….



    oh its only going to get worse! strap yourselves in!

  239. 07. now ur obviously gonna say well ive been posting on this site before 07. so this convo is over. but i have a compromise. we both use matt and then the first initial of our last name. ur not the enemy here renney is.

  240. If Perry Pearn is the head coach he should call up Jerry Manual and ask him for advice…………

  241. You gotta figure that if Renney is fired, his assistants would be gone too. Schoenfeld would be the replacement in the short term I would think. But this is all speculative and I don’t believe it will happen at all.

  242. I’ll believe this Renney is gone stuff when I wake up at like 1 P.M. tomorrow from my slacker sleep and get like 6 txt msgs. In the meantime I gotta get away from this board; it’s addicting and gonna force me into some Internet rehab program.

  243. i feel like im on cocaine*, im very antsy right now.

    *i have never done cocaine and dont plan on starting to

  244. jeffluke February 7th, 2009 at 10:13 pm

    sorry matt k. forgot that we can draft existing nhl’ers.

    You can..its called the Expansion draft. All you do is make a new team, draft Mike Green, trade Mike green to the Rangers, fold the new team, ta da.

  245. wd40 – I agree with you on the accountability issue, that has become increasingly troubling.

    I don’t really care about the Atlanta game. It was one game and I don’t know a lot teams that change systems game to game. Look at NJ tonight losing to LA (was tied for worst in the West).

    I don’t think Voros is good but I do notice when I’m at games that he is the only guy to get in the other team’s face in the offensive zone regularly. Okay, Dubinsky does once in a great while. Dawes/Callahan/Sjoestrom/Prucha/Korpikoski/Fritsche/Rissmiller didn’t/don’t have that element to their game. I kind of understand wanting someone other than Orr with an edge in the lineup.

    On Prucha, we’ll have to agree to disagree. I think he was a flash in the pan who was propped up by his HOF countryman. I do enjoy his effort and watching him but ultimately I think he will prove to be ineffective. He’s to be commended for his ability to play hard after the long layoffs. This debate should be solved eventually, I can’t imagine Prucha is still here next year if the current management/coaching staff is (traded) and if the above rumors are true we’ll see what another coach thinks of Prucha. Either way the great Prucha debate will be answered.

  246. Prucha, Korpo, Sjostrom, Dubinsky, Dawes, Callahan, potter, and Reitz all restricted free agents this offseason. Betts, Orr, mara, kalinin, and valliquette all unrestricted free agents next off season. If we do get a new coach..he’ll have his team.

  247. JJP

    I know we disagree, but I appreciate your tone and general thoughtfulness. I just think a coach who needs to feel out every team, regardless of their worth, is too frozen in fear to be effective. No argument if you feel out the Bruins in Boston and play for a point ….. but to take that same stance against a bottom feeder guarantees that horrible team will stick around far too long (ie. a blow-out becomes an impossibility) is all I need to see to know that Renney is over his head.

    Even a terrible team wins a 4-1 game every now and then. But not Renney’s Rangers — and that speaks volumes.

  248. OH MY GOD!

    I was at an event at college and have been riveted to reading the posts since I have left, since about 6:00.

    If the Nasty 1 says he has a source, I believe him. He has come through with info before and would not trick us.

    josh – I can’t understand what exactly you don’t like here.

    Columbus has San Jose’s number this year it seems. A playoff series between them would be very interesting, especially with San Jose’s history of early exits. They have beaten San Jose twice in overtime in Columbus. http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/recap?gid=2008121729

    *stuff* is going down!

  249. I notice that mhurley did not go back to the Vanc days of Renney’s coaching career.

    you know, where he was fired after Messier ripped his system

    btw, his record counting OT losses as losses, and including Vanc,

    is 168 wins, 173 losses, and 7 ties

  250. if they make Pearn the coach, it will only get worse. he is the clueless PP specialist and Dman coach

    I want Renney, AND PEARN fired

  251. if this shakes down like it is suggested it will i hope pearn is the first one out the door.

    btw, has anyone noticed how quickly things change in the NHL….in december the sharks, hawks, rangers and mtl were on top of the standings. 2 months later the rangers and montreal are free falling, sharks lead out west is down to 4 pts and the hawks are getting smoked on west coast lately (down 5-0 top van right now)
    the devs, sabres, dallas,and pitt sucked 5 weeks ago and now look whats going on they are the hotest teams in the league!

    keep faith rangers fans change could be coming and things can get better in a hurry

  252. no, it leaves Renney a loser with more losses than wins. and it has zero to do with Messier as a coach, since he has never coached an NHL game.

    but as captain, he got Renney fired, and I can see why when I look at that vanc roster

    Bure, Mogilny,Messier, Linden, Naslund , Ohlund

  253. so many Matts… so little time! this is what my sourse is saying… i wont name it (the KGB)but i say what i heard… I heard that …

    eh, forget it!! :)

  254. my source says that Scotty Bowman is going to coach the Rangers, and that they are going to trade for Vinny L, Joe Thornton, and Bobby Orr

    but then again, my source is seldom reliable.

  255. You know..I just took a 2 hr break from this blog and watched that Movie “The Truman Show” with Jim Carrey…it got me thinking…some weird stuff has been going on around me lately too

  256. I knew you would ask that CCCP…I just threw a rock at my neighbors house…cause I know he’s in on it too… and OH NO!!!

    That means Tom Renney’s in on it too then!!!

  257. i don’t know if this has been said yet because i dont feel like scrolling through 400 posts but be prepared to welcome back Sean Avery

  258. Okay, If you guys thought it was bad to see the game on television, try being there for it. This was my first live ranger game, and it was completely humiliating. Seriously Dallas fans aren’t classy at all. As we were leaving, everyone was like “RANGERS SUCK!” “GO BACK TO NEW YORK” “SO MUCH FOR THE GREAT MSG” etc. It was extremely hard to watch that game, and not walk out of the arena before it was over.

    I seriously think we need a coaching change. Badly. Prucha just happens to be my favorite player, and I’m extremely angry at the fact Renney isn’t playing him, when everytime he is in the line up, he does well. Could it get any worse with him in it?

  259. ..thinking another way from Nasty’s source.. laviolette did have a long time Rangers affiliation and coached uhhh, Yashin – sorry, just thinking like Sather would..

    I would trade gomez a top prospect and 1st rder for Lacav – assuming his head is all there – he is a game changer..

  260. There is a repot from Spector that Dawes my be on his way to Calgary. No name coming this way yet

  261. There is another “rumor”that Pat Quinn is in the running for the soon to be vacant coaching job.That is if you believe anything Milbury say;s I don’t…….

  262. Hilary,
    Truly feel bad for you. Fans of opposing teams who come to MSG to watch a game are typically left in peace to enjoy the game, unless they make a nuisance of themselves, and even then they are cut a lot of slack.
    Shame on the Big-D fans who gave you a hard time.
    I get down there once in a while, Texas is one of my favorite places otherwise.

  263. If you can get Lecavelier, you give up anyone and any prospect and any pick with the exception of Staal and Lundqvist. Anyone and everyone else, including Dubi, is fair game. In fact, if you can make that deal (say Gomez, #1 pick and either Sanguinetti or Del Zotto for Vinnie) you do it yesterday. Vinnie brings this team something they haven’t had since Jagr’s dominant year of 05-06 and also is an excellent defensive player. The next step after that is to somehow unload Redden or Rozie (or both) and go after Jay-Bo in the off-season. Vinnie is an elite talent, one of the top 5 or 6 players in the league and that is exactly the main thing the Rangers lack currently.

  264. Peter …

    agree 100 % !!

    The only problem is T.B. isnt stupid, and i’ve heard that all negotiations start with Staal going their way.

  265. peter,

    i agree 100%. you have to be willing to move anyone but staal and henke for lecavelier. with vinny’s salary you HAVE to move salaries too his new contract pays him and avg of 7.75 for 11 years. he makes $10million/ for the first 7 years of the new contract.

    that sounds cheap when you compare him to drury and gomez

  266. i think that tampa bay might bite on girardi, dubinsky and a prospect (AA, Grachev or a dman) for vinny

  267. If you think of the fact that we may be able to get an elite forward (which this team is hungry for) for Staal, I think I might think about sending Staal for Lecavalier. He’s arguably the best player in the game right now.

    And to think that Lecavalier is making the same money that Drury/Gomez is making makes me want to puke. Bahhhh….

  268. QWERTY

    Renney had Lundqvist playing out of his mind and Jagr having an MVP season to make him look good in his first year that artificially padded his record. We all know a great goalie can make anyone look like a good coach. ‘Nuff said.

  269. Rangers to Tampa…we’ll take Vinny and we’ll give you AB &C
    Tampa to Rangers…we want Staal or forget it
    Rangers to Tampa…have a nice 11 years

  270. Quite honestly I think they are giving Renney one more chance against the Debbies, and then he is gone if we lose.

  271. yep, agree with you peter anything is fair game for Lecav..I’ll tell you what, if Sather get Lecav, can move 2 of the 3 awful contracts (he signed off on) and gets Bou.. I will will write a nice post about him.

  272. I think with Staal you have a guy who is at the beginning of a long career as a top pair defenseman and we haven’t had that in ages, since Leetch left. And he’s home grown. I think at some point there has to be a line you draw at which of your young players are off limits. Look at it this way: the Rangers that won a Cup 15 years ago were built around an elite goalie, an elite defenseman, and two elite forwards. Right now they have an elite goalie and a guy who, while no Leetch offensively, is certainly on his way to becoming elite. So in my mind giving up Staal to get Vinnie is robbing Peter to pay Paul. Beyond those two, though, I don’t think anyone is truly elite on this team. The rest are nice players that fill out a roster and can be productive but we really can’t hold onto them at all costs. You have to remember Vinnie will also raise the level of those around him. How much better do you think a finisher like Nigel Dawes gets playing with Vinnie?

  273. it sux to sit here and wait for any news to come out lol i wanna know already… yes or no! Who’s coming and who’s going… my whole Sunday is ruined lol

  274. yeah brain surgeons give up dubby(22), girardi(24) and your 2nd best offensive prospect Grachev for VInny and that will accomplish?

    I forgot it will help the cap situation!!FInancially it is impossible besides being a steal for Tampa.

    WOW young ranger fans are just as stupid as old ranger fans.. WHy don’t we trade all our young players for pronger, recchi, and curtis joseph..

    the trade ideas here often are friggin moronic even sather would not make these trades..

  275. Rick
    Whats going on with these GMs in the NHL?
    Every long term deal blows up in teams faces (Drury, Gomez, Penner, Briere, Smythe, Huet, all the Ottawa deals, Redden, Dipietro, Souray, Avery,….on and on and yet….every new re-negotiated contract seems to be another long term deal??

  276. just saying I would prefer Levac tying up the cap long term than the players we have long term now …… In reality, I cant imagine Sather clearing up any real cap space for Lecav or Bou; a deal involving prucha+something for a player making abou 2mil is prob the only change we will see.

  277. stuart,

    i am glad to see your anger management classes are working out for you. in case you were not aware lecavalier is probably the best or the top 3 all around forwards in the league. he is 28 yrs old and is a MVP and stanley cup winner.

    what guarantee do you have that dubi, AA, and grachev are going to be anything close to lecavalier? you don’t. based on the rangers history of drafting players i would ssay it a given that they are overrated by the organization and the fans. dubi could be louie Debrusk or todd marchant below average at best or he could be darren turcotte or tony amonte. would you trade those 2 for lecavalier? yeah! remember manny malhotra? insert any bust draft choice the rangers have had the last 20 years

    i know that the salary cap issue would be difficult to get around but if it means we dump drury or gomez on some sucker GM then thats what has to be done.

  278. a casual observer on

    Here is a quote from Renney yesterday
    “I know this group [of players]. I firmly believe they want to do well for the organization, themselves and the coaching staff, but I’m not sure that they know how, and that’s generally what the conversation just now was about.”
    Does he not understand that this statement points to HIS lack of leadership and execution??
    Good bye Tom.

  279. sitting here at DFW airport in Dallas. The fans @ the game were fantastic. The game was a little more bearable…thanks to the wonderful Stars fans around us. We had a blast…at least were we were sitting.

    So I wouldn’t make a blanket statement that ALL Dallas fans are rude. Just thank your lucky stars that you were in Dallas & not Philly getting blown-out 100-2.

  280. I dont think you can compare Vinny (a top 5 NHL player) to Pronger, Recchi, and Cujo.

    The main reason i think the Rangers should go after Vinny is because i would like to an actual bonafide superstar play here while still in his prime.

    His length of his contract sucks, but i think he is worth every penny of the 7.7 million he stands to make staring next season. He is a top 5 player, making top 5 player money.

    Drury and Redden i dont think we can ever get rid of, but Gomez could be traded to a team that has cap space that lacks a top center (Tor, Fla, Atl, Chi, Phx, etc.)

    Basically, at the end of the day, we would be swapping out Vinny for Gomer, and losing a couple of picks and/or prospects, that i think we have plenty of.

  281. somerset,

    i agree that there could be some team who would take gomez. i think of the teams you listed tor and chi would be strong possibilites. leafs have $8 million under the cap. chicago is up against the cap but might be willing to rent him this season for a the playoffs and a run at the wings and sharks.
    LA has more than enough cap space and might want gomez to help with the young stars they have coming up.
    unfortunately you are right about redden and drury, here for duration

  282. Mr. Carpiniello – This is the first time in years of this Rangers blog that we go 2-3 days without a new header/topic. Having 600 postings is ridiculous. We need a new daily blog topic more frequently please. Thank you.

  283. Cliff-

    Its been a little over 24 hours without a post….which he told us. Maybe if you read the comments you’d see why there are so many posts.

  284. don’t quite belive the vinnny rumors, but if they were true and we were actually getting a bona fide 1st line player (on any team, not just the rangers) and getting rid of 1 of either or gomez or drury; i think that whichever player remains will play MUCH BETTER. Less pressure to provide numbers that they’re incapable of providing….i’d prefer drury.


  285. NYR13 how the hell can they add Lecavaliers $7 mill a yr. under the cap????

    Yeah someone will trade for gomez and redden!!!Sure…

    also I know VInny is great but his problem in Tampa is they have almost nothing around him and if the rangers give up 3 or 4 players for him his problem in NY will be the same.

    If cherapnov did not die maybe things are different because the rangers would have 3 potential high end players with grachev and Aa but that is not the case..

    Also VInny has a 10 yr. deal in about 6 years that deal will suck, 4 yrs. of overpaying by a ton..

    I have a novel idea let’s try to build a team thru the draft and minor signings and trades(non blockbuster) on occassion..

    I think Dubi will be a good player one day but never what VInny is, I think GIrardi is good not great D man, and I have no clue on Grachev but I know VInny has a 10 yr deal…

    10 friggin years….

  286. i do believe that some sort of trade is coming, not necessarily a big one a la jay bo or vinny lecav, but maybe a dawes or prucha type being sent out.

  287. Stuart thats ridiculous saying that in about 6 years that deal would suck.. its the same thing as saying signing lebron james for the knicks for 15 years would suck after 10. yea maybe but meanwhile they can win about 8 nba championships….

  288. if they are going to trade either prucha or dawes trade prucha. he is 3 yrs older, makes more money, and is a FA at the end of the yr.

    how about dustin penner for Edm. young, 2 or 3 yrs more on his deal, big, and underachieving???Edmonton is not happy with his play..trade prucha, voros, another player, and a 2nd round pick for him..

    prucha and voros will make his contract work the other player would be a B level prospect, and then the 2nd round pick. I assume they would never go for it but what the heck if people can think that redden is tradeable let me dream

  289. Lev you are wrong way wrong. Lebron is 24(just turned), VInny is at least 3 years older and hockey is much tougher on your body then basketball.. Basketball they play with 5 guys at a time and 12 on the team and 1 player can dominate much more then hockey..

    Basketball is a game of superstars hockey is a team game. If I thought VInny gets them over the hump I am all for it but even with VInny they are far from a cup team..

  290. stuart,

    would you rather have vinny for 10 yrs or dubi for 14? you say in 6 years that deal will suck? in 6 years he will be 34 and still be younger than jagr, shanny and straka were last year. plus, in 6 years whoever is under contract now will be off the books.
    you answered the question about the cap. someone has to go. and btw nobody would miss whoever goes.

    he has nobody around him in tampa and still is a great player…so why can’t he be great in NY?

  291. bottom line- he is better than gomez or drury and make the same $! whats the problem with trying to get him here?

  292. dawes for iginla and flames pay for iginla’s contract and through in commalleri out of desperation :))))))

  293. jeffluke February 8th, 2009 at 11:50 am

    matt k

    get pumped for a 36 year old craig conroy!

    Craig Conroy? i was hoping for Charlie Conway

  294. Lev February 8th, 2009 at 11:50 am

    dawes for iginla and flames pay for iginla’s contract and through in commalleri out of desperation :)))))

    I was thinking Dawes for Iginla, Phanuef, and Darryl Sutter’s son Brett. This way Darryl would trade away his whole team..and his son!

  295. jeffluke February 8th, 2009 at 11:57 am

    funny mattk, gordon bombay’s been eerliy quite during all this…

    Maybe he could teach us team unity. DUCKS FLY TOGETHER!

  296. Dawes is the type of player (soft, perimeter-hugging, without a mean streak) that Keenan loves to hate — and when he views the tape of that ballerina move Dawes made vs. Lucic, he will hate him even more.

    Dawes has an upside, but I don’t quite see how Calgary is the place to develop it.

  297. if coach clueless makes it to tommorow, and we get our asses handed to us like we all know is coming.. that has to be the end of the line

  298. John it’s only 12 o’clock. Most reports happen around 1-2. And Ford, this has nothing to do with Keenan. Keenan’s not the GM. Dawes is a Sutter guy. Sutter’s the gm. Hence Keenan might have another bench player.

  299. Why does Nasty have the same credibility as one of the ESPN insiders in regards to scoops???? I don’t get that.

  300. kern because nasty always made reasonable, informative posts and i doutb he would toy with us like that.. unlike for instance bob

  301. If Sather or Dolan actually fear bad-press about letting Renney go..there really isn’t a better time than now to do it…its not playoff time and A-Roid has exploded onto the news and its all anyone will talk about in NYC…

    Just tryin to think positively here

  302. Renny is not being fired.

    sather is a joke who would he pick to coach the team??Trottier..

    the rangers are not getting VInny either, sather only likes old washed up stars not 28 yr olds…

    vinny’s contract is a big problem, 10 yrs.. how is dipietro doing???

  303. Jane’s got a new post up. Renney is still the coach.

    Sorry for the delay between posts, but I assure you I was working the phones to see if anything major was happening. Other than the Avery mechanics, it wasn’t. Not yet, anyway.

  304. jeffluke

    You mention Callahan’s lack of assists..not surprising when you consider that he’s usually all by himself forechecking in the attack zone while the team is hiding behind their own blue line.

  305. good riddance to Dawes. he is exactly the type of player you have to get rid of. guys who won’t battle for loose pucks along the boards or grind in the corners or go hard to the net

    he sets a bad example. you have him wimping out, and a kid who will battle hard is kept in the stands. pathetic.

  306. How is it that just anybody can write a blog and get as popular as this? Its not like youve said anything extremely impressive –more like youve painted a pretty picture around an issue that you know nothing about! I dont want to sound mean, right here. But do you seriously think that you can get away with adding some quite pictures and not genuinely say something?

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