It’s over: Sundin signs with the Canucks (Updated)

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So it turns out Glen Sather won’t have to make any magical moves to clear salary cap space: “Mats Sundin has signed with the Canucks, after all.”:http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=260123&lid=headline&lpos=topStory_nhl

“I am truly excited to be joining the Canucks,” said Sundin in a team statement. “Once I made the decision to return to play a few weeks ago, the Vancouver opportunity was simply the best overall fit. I want to thank Mike Gillis and the entire Canucks organization for their professionalism throughout this entire process.”

Still unclear is whether Sundin grabbed the full, two-year $20 million offer the Canucks first threw at him back in July.

Regardless, at least from a financial standpoint, it was a much better deal than anything the Rangers could offer.

As for those Rangers, they remain intact…for now.

The bad news in this is they miss out on a chance to throw an elite-level center and leader into their mix, perhaps the difference-maker this team needs to become a serious contender.

The good news is they didn’t have to compromise themselves in making any deal happen. And in staying pat — by choice or otherwise — they leave themselves options to make other moves before the trade deadline.

I have to admit, I’m a little surprised, not so much in the decision, but that it happened today. I always got the sense the Swede was truly torn. Maybe he really was, but it must have been apparent he was never going to get the same type of money in New York.

Enjoy that Northwest Division travel….

Update, 7:38 p.m.: According to J.P. Barry, Sundin’s agent, the deal with Vancouver is just for the rest of this season, and not the two-year contract the Canucks had offered back in July. But that very well could have been Sundin’s choice.

Update, 7:56 p.m.: Meanwhile, let the dominos start falling. With Sundin now spoken for, you can count on other teams starting to make some moves, and you can certainly count on a Brendan Shanahan signing not far behind.

I am skeptical of the Rangers’ interest in Shanahan at this point, although strange as it sounds, I wonder if Saturday’s showdown with the Sharks helps clarify things.

It could be a game when the Rangers see they’re not  far off. Or it could be one in which they realize they need to do something dramatic.

And with Dramatic Option A now committed to Vancouver, the Rangers would need to start looking for another one.

Update, 9:13 p.m.: No official comment from the Rangers since the team was off today. I’m sure there was disappointment from those people who had already started penciling in line combinations. But I’m sure there was also a sense that Sundin even considering their comparatively meager offer could be seen as an endorsement of the organization and its direction (or maybe it just had to do with the fact that they have one really good Swedish goaltender).

What to make of today? I suppose the one thing it does is take some pressure off the Rangers. Because if Sundin stepped into the dressing room tomorrow, there’s no question there would be a heap of it (along with the predictable amounts of excitement and euphora).

Now the Rangers remain a pretty good team with a fairly impressive roster. But they’re still a team that doesn’t have Mats Sundin.

That’s it for me. I’m off to play hockey…

More later…

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225 Comments

  1. I’ve gotta tell you folks, I was very antsy about the idea of Sundin coming in. This is a damaged organization, and he could have provided them a fig leaf for a few monnths…but at what cost.? This club needs a front office revamping, and the longer they get propped up, the lousier it’s gonna get.

    NOw we can all go back to watching the waltz of the toreadors, and Roszival and Kallinin have their red capes ready to wave as the fast forwards of the league charge past them. And did they ever charge past them last night. Poor Valiquette must have felt like Marshal Ney as the firing squad was loading up for him.

    Yeah, Roszival had his best night in the past two years..
    but Kallinin is still human body shy. Too bad the kid Potter had to watch that nonsense from the sidelines. He may never get a chance to show anything.

  2. leatherneckinlv on

    Ooooh Raaaah…finally and thankfully…so glad to see he is not a Ranger…i did not like his way of how he handled his situation which effected many..that B–S–RD..selfish mofo who really wasnt better than say Shanny

  3. onecupin67years on

    we don’t need anymore over the hill over paid stars

    get younger not older , now fire renney and make some trades

  4. awesome news. we certainly dont need him. wed give up too much for him and this team and organization would be going back in time again and we would set ourselves a few years back again. we werent winning the cup with him. we might with our high ass paid players playing damn good and some better d

  5. I think this say more about how other teams view our “tradeable assetts” than anything.

    I think Sather couldn’t get it done. Plain and simple.

  6. SAM…this may be true,…”The bad news in this is they miss out on a chance to throw an elite-level center and leader into their mix, perhaps the difference-maker this team needs to become a serious contender.

    The good news is they didn’t have to compromise themselves in making any deal happen. And in staying pat, they leave themselves options to make other moves before the trade deadline.
    “….. but you are lettinfg Sather off the hook a little to easily

  7. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! ....says Greg L. on

    yeah Mats Sundin is a real winner , he hasn’t won a cup for any club , hasn’t provided his old club with any trade options . He says he wants a training camp to jell with his new team but instead pulled a Teemu Selanne .

    Mats Sundin went to a team that deserves him .They honoured Trevor Linden last night by retiring his jersey Number. Seems linden was thrown under the bus once Messier arrived. He was traded to long island and the Canucks were without his services to take on a high paid Messier that failed.
    Vancouver again has gotten another high priced center to ” fix” their world. Good luck !! seems like some teams never learn.

  8. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! ....says Greg L. on

    Canucks said it was’nt because of the money ….HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAHAHAAAAAA yeah right!! he wanted to travel playing in the east , he wanted all the hassle from canadian media ..no I know ..he wanted to play the Redwings and the sharks 4 times more…yeah hes a smart one. Went for the $$$$$$$$ Mat$ $undin .

  9. Greedy Cack Sucking loser. I hope he pulls his groin getting off the fuggin plane.

    He wants a god damn Cup sooooo fuggin bad, yet it came down to money. What a low life scum bag. I hope Phaneuf catches him with his head down and ends his season.

    Thank you Slats, now we’re stuck with Rozi, for another 3 god damn years. Perfect. Just fuggin perfect.

    My whole god damn nights ruined. I hate this guy, i hope the Nucks miss the playoffs, and i hope the Sedin twins slip on some snow and smack their heads together.

  10. not that i particularly wanted him here, but jesus dude it took you the better part of 6 months to figure this out.? let alone he led everyone along the whole time, oh maybe today will be the day, oh no maybe next tuesday at 2:45pm.. oh nope not then either.. please sundin, i’m sure your truely excited to spend the next 4 months on a plane with that travel schedule.. enjoy your 10m per and still no ring on your finger, b/c in the end all this really came down to was money..

  11. Disappointing. But we are still getting points, and among the leaders in the conference. Now we can start talking about J-Bo!!!!!

  12. Only signed for the rest of the year huh? If he pulls the same crap next year I hope to hell the Rangers aren’t drawn in.

  13. The Sharks and Wings will RAPE the Nucks. They stand no chance !!!

    Nyr isn’t as good as those teams, but at least if he were here, who knows maybe there would be an upset, and those two teams wouldn’t make it.

    I really hope he sucks there, and doesn’t fit at all.

  14. ORR I COULDNT AGREE WITH YIOU MORE. YOU AND I SEEM TO HAVE SIMIALIER VIEWS. I AM WATCHING HABS FLYERS RIGHT NOW STARING INTO SPACE BECAUSE I KEEP THINKING THAT THIS SCREWS US OUT OF CAP SPACE OVER NEXT SEVERAL YEARS. SATHER SHOULD BE SHOT. ROZIVAL AND REDDEN I MEAN BOTH. ONE IS BAD ENOUGH. 11.5 IS RETARDED. BLAME SATHER I WILL HOLD ON SUNDIN UNTIL I HEAR HIM SPEAK. SUNDIN AND CAP SPACE OR THIS ROSTER FOR NEXT FEW YEARS WITH SOME TINKERING. U TELL ME. WHAT A JOKE

  15. I would like to have a nickel for everyone here who now advocates going after “Shanny.” Down-side / washed-up, over-priced mercenaries are the rage, around here.

  16. This move made no sense for the Rangers from the start. We need to replace Friesen, and compensate for the horrible Redden signing. Didn’t anyone watch the remarkable game against the Devils last Friday? This team needs DMen desperately, and someone to man the ever-loving point on the PP!

  17. This is not sour grapes but there is nothing certain about Sundin. He hasn’t logged an NHL minute in 8 months, it’s gonna take him at least a month to get back in game shape, and as Sam said he can enjoy his frequent flyer miles.

    Sometimes power forwards (or centers) in that age group just stop scoring overnight; Adam Graves, John Leclair, Clark Gillies, Tim Kerr, etc. so that could happen.

    I think he’ll be fine, a little disappointed but this is not earth shattering. Honestly, I was much more worried when I heard Anisimov got hurt last night, but he came back and played wing, so that seems to be ok and hopefully just a deep bruise to his arm.

    If we REALLY need some help later in the season, there’s always Forsberg or Shanny. I know, I know, I don’t endorse those moves but start throwing tomatoes at me anyway :)P.

    Maybe the Rangers can work out a trade of Prucha/Fritsche and a pick to ATL for Exelby, who is a nice bang for buck player and a crease clearer.

  18. onecupin67years on

    Its gonna be hard to dump salary , looks like we’re stuck with this hand, over paying is bad enuff ,but it’s the length of these contracts that really eff the club, Redden for 6? Rozy for ? etc.

  19. What the Rangers need anyway is some big bruising dee man; not Uncle Fester…

    And again, not what they really need but, Rangers have 2 guys on target for 23 goals this year…How many did Shanny score last year?

  20. THERE IS A SANTA CLAUS.HATS THE 1ST TIME I ASKED NOT TO GET SOMTHING FOR X-MAS,I ASKED FOR NO SUNDIN FOR X-MAS

  21. gimme a break about all of this “on track for crap” it will change in due time, I can now let out a sigh of relief, except now Rozsival stays! Bad! Begone you demon from hell!

  22. Leetchhalloffame on

    F Sundin – another money-grubbing, me-first athlete who cares not about winning but filling his pockets with cash. Thanks for stringing us along, baldy.

  23. Audioserf
    December 18th, 2008 at 8:08 pm
    Pick up Shanny, lose Kalinin, call it a day…
    Dumping a never will be and picking up a has been isn’t gonna do much for the team. Dump Kalinin and use the money to trade for an offensive player.

  24. I still think it would be beneficial for the rangers to dump prucha so we have the extra cap- it’s not like he’s going to play anyway.

  25. Matthew Bleiberg on

    Look. I truly believe Sundin wanted to play for the Rangers and waited for them to dump players for CAP space. However, that didn’t happen and the rosters freeze for a week tomorrow, and he decided to play for a good Canucks team (with Luongo).

    Honestly, if you look at Shanny’s numbers with the Rangers, they’re not wayyy too far off from Sundin’s.

    Trust me, Shanny coming here will keep the chemistry intact and can only make this team better. And, the guy wants to play for us.

  26. ChrisS
    Unfortunately you are right; what a waste!

    Now we can get back to the playoff race I guess.

    Anyone know why the Caps are playing a 3rd string goalie every night? What happened to Theodore and Johnson?

    Boston is good; will they last?
    Flyers and Caps have great forwards…what about their goaltenders?
    People in Mont talk about habs like we do Rangers

    The point is; offensively what is missing in NY is one of the young guys stepping up; Dubi,Dawes have been let downs, Korpi has not panned out, Prucha has been sterilized…anyone of these guys stepping it up and there is our Sundin..gomez and Drury though paid too much are what they’ve always been ( Gomer 15-20 goals, Drury 23-25 goals)Naslund and Z have been pretty good so far…upgrades over Jagr and Shanny possibly

    3 dee men who at least try to hit and 3 who try not to. They need to make the ration at least 4-2…dont know how.

    as far as the future cap $$ go? I think the CBA will be renegotiated again to the owners advantage; economy is in the tank; the NHLPA is like having your brother-inlaw representing you…

    roll backs and no cap-hit buyouts will be the rule of the day…again; hopefully we dont lose a whole season with it

  27. He went for the money? Maybe he thought Sather is a smug idiot…or he thought the Rangers organization sucks, where expensive players soon becomes underachievers…maybe he didn’t want to play in a team where only the goalies are as good as their talent.

  28. Brian Burkes at it again;
    Speaking about being excluded from the Trevor Linden ceremony; even though Linden thanked him during his speech

    ******************************************************
    I was clearly excluded and I’m extremely disappointed,” Burke told the Vancouver Province. “I would have flown from anywhere on the planet to be there last night.”
    ********************************************************

    This is a guy who loves attention; whatever happens its about him….

  29. Good — Sundin — super selfish, overrated. He’s happy to throw other players under the bus as long as he was paid enough. Probably pull his groin in his first game back anyway. Whatever. Is Prucha allowed to play now?

  30. Losing Sundin isn’t the worst thing in the world. He would’ve been a great addition but he would’ve hog tired us at the trade deadline. I think shanny would help the team. He is a proven goal scorer who will play a physical game. Last season he was beat to hell with back, knee, and hip injuries. He also played on the PP and the PK. If he came here this season he wouldn’t have to play the PK. Not to mention he would come at a much lower price than Sundin. Send korpo down to Hartford or trade prucha. No reason to keep prucha if renney isn’t going to play him.

  31. The Canucks’ signing of Sundin may seem like a bad break for the Rangers. However, this gives younger players a chance to crack the lineup. I’d like to see Artem Anisimov get a game or two with the big club just to see how the future looks.

  32. My personal opinion, fuck Sundin. If he truly wanted to play here, he would have been here a long time ago.

    Sundin, while he might have increased scoring would have required us to sacrifice our D. Let the Rangers win with the team they have. There is more than enough skill there.

  33. Wow, shesends. That sounds awful. You’re going to have trouble falling asleep tonight. Hope you get through the night ok.

    adam z- i know how dramatic right!!! SERIOUSLY PATHETIC WHEN U ARE THAT WORRIED ABOUT RANGERS SIGNING AN OLD TURD

  34. Kaspar, good point about Burke. That is kind of self-important of him to say that. Where would we be in sports without pompous pricks!

  35. Whats Sundin ever won anyhow?… and by the way Toronto only sucked since end of lock out…they had playoff teams before and always added Leetch, Ron Francis, Roberts etc.. to play along with Uncle Fester and he never won anything… alot of people have been crying about poor Mats playing for the woeful Leafs

    Watching Detroit blast Sharks..maybe sharks are looking past the Wings to that big Ranger game hah?

  36. ORR !! What Is It Good FOR ??
    December 18th, 2008 at 7:44 pm
    Greedy Cack Sucking loser. I hope he pulls his groin getting off the fuggin plane.

    He wants a god damn Cup sooooo fuggin bad, yet it came down to money. What a low life scum bag. I hope Phaneuf catches him with his head down and ends his season.

    Thank you Slats, now we’re stuck with Rozi, for another 3 god damn years. Perfect. Just fuggin perfect.

    My whole god damn nights ruined. I hate this guy, i hope the Nucks miss the playoffs, and i hope the Sedin twins slip on some snow and smack their heads together.

    CMON ORR WE DONT NEED HIM. WE GOT 3 TOP CENTERS. WE NEED SOME SCORING WINGERS AND BETTER D. WE’LL BE BETTER OFF. LOOK HOW FAR WE GOT WITHOUT JAGR. IF JAGS COULDNT WIN A CUP WITH US, SUNDIN SURE ISNT

  37. Atta boy Pavel, your last prediction got us a win & 2 more points. Keep it up !

    # Pavel December 18th, 2008 at 9:32 pm

    Lundqvist, Naslund and Sjostrom are going to suck on Saturday… just you wait..

  38. I was more excited about ( sorry Orr I mean aboot) the other moves the Rangers would make just to squeeze Uncle fester onto the team then for actually getting him…

    I actually feel good they didnt get him…expectations would have been too hi, like Mike in IA said if they couldn’t win it with Jagr ( not to mention Shanny and Straka) Sundin wasnt gonna bring us a cup anyway….

    We still need something or two though…no?

    Big banger ( in all of North America and europe do you mean to tell me there isn’t someone, un-attached, at least as good as Kalinin? I find that impossible to believe…where are all the ranger scouts? At an independent film premiere?)

  39. Doodie Machetto on

    Something I thought of yesterday about Sundin. Everyone was harping on how he never had lower than 70 pts in a season, except his rookie season and the half season. Well, we just let a player with a much more impressive resume walk out the door this summer in Jagr (who also can claim to have had at least 70 pts in every season but 2, except his were his first two seasons in the league- he had 70 points in the half season).

    Jagr was also two years younger, was a wing as opposed to a center, and showed in the playoffs that he was still capable of being one of the most dominant players in the NHL, and he was the only guy to show up for the first four games of the Pittsburgh series.

    So really, why all the commotion about Sundin?

  40. Mats You Phony!! I’m excited about joining the Canucks. What a bunch of B.S.!! I liked Mats but he is a joke at this point!! I guess money was what he was looking for. LOser thats all have to say. He has NO chance of winning a cup in the Conference! LOSER!! TAKE THE MONEY AND RUN LOSER!!

  41. “Kaspar, the Rangers scouts should look in St. Petersburg for that banging defenseman.”

    Tell me about it Doodie; but the only people hanging around here are in The Russian mafia

  42. Sharks are in a slump, hope it hangs around. Columbus beat them the other night and looked like champs doing it, at least from the bits I saw.

  43. KASPAR

    I was too. The whole point of this signing, for me was to get a good player, who can still play, but more importantly get rid of some of the players on this team.

    That’s all gone to shit. Yeah this team can go after Gaborik, Kovalchuk, who ever, but that will cost them a Dubi, or Staal, and i don’t wanna see that happen.

    MIKE

    Dubi isn’t doing much, Gomer is up and down, and Dru is getting it together, but for how long ? Mats isn’t gonna turn the team around, but he’ll give them a future, by making one of these big contracts go away, but now that’s over with.

    I hope Nicky Z, Cally, and Dubi don’t get greedy this summer.

  44. ROC

    I lost massive respect for him as well. I never had anything against him, even dragging this whole thing on, i didn’t care. But for a guy who’s DYING to win HIS FIRST STANLEY CUP !! The fact that it came down to money pisses me off. He’s a greedy prick, and if i was the Leafs fans id boo him till he cries like a little vagina that he is.

    Fugg the Nucks ! And their creepy ass Sedin twins.

  45. ROC
    It is about the money, but not just cause of the dollar figure. Mats does not want to be seen dropping his pants, too much pride involved, along with agent commi$$ion. The pride thing is because he is not yet ‘proven’ to be over the hill. If he does this half-season and isn’t seen to be an impact player, his price will drop for the next go-around and it will appeal to more teams than were really interested this time. I think he is full prepared to go to the well again, he won’t dance with the one that brung ‘em, in other words.

  46. I dont think we can look at adding anyone who’s a dufference maker to this team anymore; without, like Orr said parting with the Dubis or the Staals so this is pretty much it…

    If only there were someone who could score 30 goals laying around that we could play and wouldn’t cost us anything…think think think…where can we find one…what? not now Prucha can’t you see we’re trying to think?!?

  47. orr – how can dubi be greedy. he is restricted 1st off and second on pace for 40 pts. $ 2 mm should do it for 1 yr which is still triple his contract.

  48. Doesn’t mean San Jose necessarily comes roaring back on Saturday night, though they could. They were due to come back down to earth after their record-setting run. Those guys are probably mentally exhausted.

  49. Li Joe

    Just hope Dubis agent doesn’t bring Mike Fishers contract to the Arbitration table and say “look 10 goals 20 pts 5 million a year!”

    LOL

  50. Doodie Machetto December 18th, 2008 at 9:43 pm

    Something I thought of yesterday about Sundin. Everyone was harping on how he never had lower than 70 pts in a season, except his rookie season and the half season. Well, we just let a player with a much more impressive resume walk out the door this summer in Jagr (who also can claim to have had at least 70 pts in every season but 2, except his were his first two seasons in the league- he had 70 points in the half season).

    Jagr was also two years younger, was a wing as opposed to a center, and showed in the playoffs that he was still capable of being one of the most dominant players in the NHL, and he was the only guy to show up for the first four games of the Pittsburgh series.

    So really, why all the commotion about Sundin?

    Agree 100%.
    Sundin was only in the picture after our dumb arse GM realize he made a mistake by leting JJ walk.

  51. Well Season Ticket Holder another first round exit if we even make it that far. Oh and by the way since we made the playoffs our tickets are going up another 4 bucks a game!! What a disgrace! Not only Mats but this entire team!! Win another Shoot Out Win!! Get use to hearing that! Its our only hope of making the playoffs.

  52. By the way
    I’m watching my new fav-western team the Blue Jackets roaring back against Dallas ( my new most hated west team)

    Tyuten playing like 22 mints a game…all the big spots, PK, PP, final seconds of period…

    I hate Dallas because theyre all blaming Avery for miserable start…what did they think they were getting? Idiots, crybabies,all of them…take it like men..we did and thrived
    I hope they finish behind the Phoenix Roadrunners, I mean Coyotes or Hyennas or whatever the hell they are

  53. speakin of crybabies:

    anyone see Crosby punching some guy on Atlanta in the Jollies from behind? the guy was being tied up by another penguin and was bent over a** up and crosby snuck some shots in

    I’m watching with women and children and I’m thinking of calling Bettman up…if Avery gets banned what about that disgrace to manhood?

    Last weak he beat on that NJ midget Gionta when the little pip-squeek was skating away and now this?

  54. At least Shanny wont get greedy and charge a shitload of money.

    But i miss Jags the more i think aboot it. It would have been sweet to see a Jagr-Dubi-Nicky Z line, just for the hell of it.

    KASPAR

    I hate them too. I used to like them, but i cant stand them now. I like the Brat Hawks, Kings, and the Yotes.

  55. Isn’t Zherdev a restricted FA this summer? I hope he won’t be greedy. This team needs to hold onto him like grim death. That kid is fantastic.

  56. Its time for Plan B, which should of been plan A “Bring Back Shanny”. Shanny has played with this team and has practiced with this team therefore sign him so he can play with this team.

  57. Just for uncle Fester sake I wish Rangers would win the cup THIS year.(not that don’t wish it every year)

  58. I’m not sure what’s the deal with all the whining. Sundin isn’t the first guy to go for the money he might not be the millionth player to go for the money. Move on and look for other ways to improve the team. Hell Shanny lost out on joining the because he wanted 1.5 mill for this year and they only offered him a mill. Not long after they got red hot and said the were moving on. If not for Sather throwing money away on medicority the Rangers would have a good amount of cap room.

  59. SHANNY NOT COMING . THE RANGERS ARENT GOING BACK TO SHANNY BECAUSE SATHER WILL LOOK BAD. SATHER IS A COMPLETE MORON AND SHOULD BE SHOT. SALARY CAP HEL FOR NEXT SEVERAL YEARS. WE DONT HAVE ONE TRUE FINISHER ON THIS TEAM. ZHERDEV AND HES A POOR MANS FINISHER. WHEN GAMES GET TIGHT IN PLAYOFFS AND LOW SCORING WE WILL LOSE 2-1 3-2 GAMES BECAUSE NO ONE FINISHES AND BECAUSE OUR D WILL MAKE A AWFUL TURNOVER. OUT IN FIRST ROUND IF NOTHING CHANGES

  60. Shanny wanted I believe 1.5 million from the Flyers. We have a million right now. Waive Pruchs and we have Shanny.

    Send down Korpedo to Hartford. Move Voros to the fourth line and put Shanny on the third line.

  61. domi – what would shanny do. he will be 40 next month. that ship has sailed and i will be very disappointed if they go that route let the current team minus kalinin see what they can do. and if they don’t succeed many will get their wish re coaching change

  62. KrispyNYR,
    Very simple get rid of that waste wearing a Rangers jersey with the number 45 and free up enough dough to sign No. 14. No need to send guys down and you can keep Potter up.

  63. Sure Shanny is old. He isn’t as quick as he used to be, but he can score. He is a veteran player with scoring ability and defensive awareness that we really lack. Not to mention he’ll play physical and bring leadership to the team that Drury and Gomez seem to lack right now.

    On top of that hes already played with the majority of the players on this team. So chemistry wont be an issue like it may have been with Sundin.

    Shanny should have been signed from the start.

  64. Domi,

    Nobody is going to take Kalinin though. Would you sign him? Hes only got a one year contract. The Rangers are going to eat it up and come playoff time bench him like they did to Malik.

  65. Drury can keep his C just like Jagr did. However when Crosby and a few of the other NHL whiners that went over to the refs to complain about missed calls, it was Shanny that went over as well to defend his teammates.

  66. KrispyNYR
    Shanahan was not physical the latter half of last year. He might be a leader in the dressing room but it would be hard to say he played a physical game.

  67. this season is a lost cause anyway. i’m just concerned it is back to the future with shanny and he will want to be here next yr as well. physical no – not since the concussion. why does this team always have to sign the biggest name. i just don’t get it.

  68. Honestly, I don’t know what this team should do. work on signing Dubinsky on Jan 1 while he’s not producing so we will get him at the cheapest price possible. Drop Kalinin and bring in potter- atleast for now. Maybe try and get Mclarin at the deadline. I think Shanny would help the team.. if nothing else he’d replace Voros-they’re both pretty slow but we all know what shanny brings to the table.
    I say we pray that Gomez, Drury, and Dawes start/keep producing.

  69. I definitely like the idea of bringing Shanahan back in.

    For all the bullshit about this being a fast paced team, I haven’t really seen it being a huge advantage. There is probably a handful of guys in the league who can keep up with Gomez and unfortunately, the only guy the Rangers have (Zherdev) isn’t a good fit because he’s too similar a puck carrier.

    Shanahan on the 3rd line is better than anyone the Rangers have there right now or in Hartford. Ship him in tomorrow (before midnight)!

  70. Plus how many big name free agents have come here for the money? Hundreds to answer my own question.

  71. Evan,
    are you kidding- Getting rid of Drury now would be the best thing the Rangers could do going forward. We could use that money next year to not only resign our players but also get the top six scoring help we need-all while Anisimov jumps up and fills in that third line center role currently occupied by Drury.

  72. One thing I think will be seen, is that with lines solidifying and not being changed all the time, Drury will show up more. It is up to Renney on the line thing, but a guy like Drury does not just give up, and he has not lost his skill. Captain worthy or not, $6 mil worthy or not, I think Drury is going to contribute a lot.

  73. topcorner,
    I agree, I think that these players will all start producing more if they keep working with each other.. However, I don’t really like the lines-certainly I think we should stack the top two lines but I would take Zherdev off gomez’s line and put him with either drury or dubinsky to establish two true scoring lines. Right now I feel like we have one top line and three third lines.

  74. CCCP,
    haha “sundin changes his mind about signing with the canucks-sets another play or no play deadline for himself”

  75. Actually, a lot hinges on Dubinsky. His game has not come back, I hope the coaches or somebody helps him find it. Get him going, there’s your missing line.

  76. Wow, someone mentioned it before.. but how about columbus..
    Manny Malhotra coming up with a huge goal in OT.

  77. Pavel,
    I’d throw in Callahan as being a pretty important piece as well- not that it would cost all that much to resign him.

  78. Mara a must resign!!!

    ANd becuase?

    Mara is a avg. D man, yes compared to Kalinin he is good but he is avg. He cannot hit the net, is not a big hitter and is a fine 5th or 6th d Man..

    The rangers only depth in the minors is D men fir the next few years. The Rangers need what most teams need so high end scoring and a true stud D man something they will fill thru the development of Staal or some of the other young guys.

  79. All Hail King Henrik on

    Ugh. What a thing to come home to. First, I find out that Sundin signed with the Canucks. That sucks. Then, I see that San Jose lost 6-0 to Detriot, to lose their second straight game. That sucks. You know they’re going to be out for blood on Saturday and looking to get back on the winning track. It was going to be tough no matter what, but now it will be damn near impossible to beat them. SJ losing three in a row? Stranger things have happened, but it’s not looking good. I’m still hoping for a good game, though. They’re definitely capable of the win (or at least a point) IF they play like they did in Anaheim, but the big question there is the “if”.

    I really want to see them play a sixty minute game vs. SJ, sort of like the game vs. Detroit, sans the first 10 minutes. They can’t put forth a shit effort like they did last night, though…that’s for sure. Go Rangers!!!!!

  80. actually now that I think about it- the rangers could probably resign callahan, dawes, korp, and betts for less than 4 million.

  81. ChrisS
    Renney has to be concerned about Dubinsky, unless he is willing to f@ck him up like he did Prucha. I’m serious, he should be paying great attention to what has happened with Brandon.

  82. topcorner… Renney is the one who’s responsible that Dubi lost all the confidence… he was the master genius benching the kid in the first place… i knew nothing good is gonna come out of it… Dubi, Voros… thnk god Z wasnt effected as bad as those two

  83. in light of us being left in the rear view mirror by sundin, now is a good time to mention Redden’s “no-trade clause” is actually a list of 10 teams he will refuse to accept a trade to…naturally that narrows the list to 20 teams, and I assume the flyers, islanders and devils are not on the list because he knows the rangers would never deal with those teams, so, still gives the rangers options down the road…discuss! Before you jump to conclusions, be aware this was Glen Sathers’ doing, who refused to give Redden a full no trade clause…so don’t jump to screaming about him

  84. Topcorner,
    I see your point. However, no one expected dubi to continue the pace he was going at in the beginning of the season- I know that’s not you’re point but he’s still a kid. I think that if renney was smart and wanted to utilize dubinsky to his full potential, he’d move him to wing to relieve him of some defensive responsibilities and mold him into a power forward. He’s got that hard nose attitude to go a long with a decent a mount of skill and the one thing I see all the time is that he protects the puck on the boards really well like Jagr. If nothing else.. I think he’ll be fine..

  85. chris – drury’s line is 2nd line not 3rd. dubinsky only goes to 1st or 2nd if he’s paired with Z

  86. about the benching..
    I think renney was trying to send the message to a young kid that if you don’t show up for a full 82 games than you’re not going to get the ice time..I have no problem with that.

  87. It’s not Dubi’s pace so much that concerns me. Let him get to the bigger numbers when he gets there. But his effort earlier in the season used to translate into something. Now, even when I see him going fast and carrying his speed into a big check, it’s like he does not know how to score or become a scoring threat. It is very obvious, and actually I am not convinced that he will be fine. Just my take on it, cause he is a very special talent.

  88. Im kinda curious aboot how Shanny would play. So many people think he “lost it”, and he cant bring anything to a team, but who knows, maybe that lights a fire up his ass and he’ll play the way he played the first 2 months of 06-07.

    I don’t care either way, im not against it at all, but i wouldn’t cry if Nyr passed on him.

  89. Fritsche will be released

    Korpi should take a paycut from the 1.1 million he has

    Prucha should take a paycut as well, or he is definitely gonna be released

    Dawes, Betts, Callahan, Sjostrom and Orr can all be signed for under a million apiece next year.

    Mara will probably get in the 1.5 – 2.0 again next year.

    Vally will either resign around 750k or Wiikman and his 550k cap hit will replace him

    Dubinsky i see getting a 2 yr/1.5 per deal to ride out his RFA status

    Zherdev will get around 4 million as a comparison to Naslund’s contract. You have to remember Zherdev is probably “thanking his lucky stars” he’s out of Columbus and having good chemistry with Nazzy and Gomer … I honestly think there is a give-and-take relationship between him and Sather for rescueing him from a bad scene in Columbus,I dont think he will turn around a gauge the Team for a boat load of money

  90. Now I remember some guarantee I made about Sundin not coming here along with a rediculous consequence for myself if he did, involving something in front of MSG, maybe yelling or crapping there; I don’t remember. Good thing I don’t have to do it now, haha!!

    Betts can be signed for less than $650,000
    Orr can be signed for less than $550,00
    Sjostrom could probably be signed for less than he is making now, maybe around $800,000
    Dawes could still be signed for less than $700,000 unless he really starts producing
    Dubinsky looks like he will be had for less than $800,000.
    Korpikoski will probably be dicounted from his current salary, less than $800,000

    However, it is likely that cheaper numbers will lead to these players being eligible for free agency again in another year, since they won’t want to be locked in to such a low rate, so maybe add a couple hundred thousand to those figures for the cap hit, with a first-year base salary around or less than those figures. Since these players haven’t been overachieving (besides Betts), we are not in as much salary cap hell as we thought at the beginning of the season when Dubsinky was doing well. Obviously, Zherdev is the one we are worried about right now, since he will likely get a salary above $5 million at his current pace. That can also be a good thing, since teams will be less willing to take the risk of giving up draft picks following an offer sheet since he is still a restricted free agent. It’s just a shame that Drury and Gomez have not performed up to their contractual expectations, but that is mostly a result of Sather overpaying for seemingly mediocre players.

  91. Shanny can still be a threat. Even this late in his career, a 650 goal scorer is a 650 goal scorer. He is dangerous and can be the finisher this team needs. What he lacks in speed and youth he makes up for in experience. I for one hope to see something big come around tomorrow. I don’t think we will just yet. But that doesn’t stop me from hoping.

  92. LI,
    You’re right.. It’s just up until recently, I thought Dubinsky’s line had more chance of scoring than Drury’s. haha that’s essentially how I rank the lines-goal scoring potential.

    Topcorner,
    You know, I always notice dubinsky because he moves with the puck as well as gomez and of course because of his hits. but I guess I always equated his lack of scoring chances to his linemates(the loss of Zherdev). It’s certainly something I’ll have to consider the next couple of games I watch the Rangers..

  93. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! ....says Greg L. on

    This my friend made me laugh my ass off :
    (ORR said)
    ” My whole god damn nights ruined. I hate this guy, i hope the Nucks miss the playoffs, and i hope the Sedin twins slip on some snow and smack their heads together.”

    That was too funny , sedins knocking there heads together.
    Too true !!! But don’t worry the curse of the ‘ol bambino …Avery got it, now Sundin !! Muhaahahaa

    Maybe that night out with Sundin , Shoey ducking out on the cheque didn’t help?

  94. zZzZ 13 ZzZz rules!! ....says Greg L. on

    Sharks losing again is good . Who cares how mad they are? When ya lose 2 in a row , somethings wrong ..let ‘em whine about 3 in a row!! Rangers are gonna come out a flying . I do see another win comming and Im thinking Dawes will be on the scoresheet.

  95. Would love us to go after JayBo now – we obviously seem willing to move Roszival, although i suspect the Panthers would be interested in some of our RFA talent (Dubi, Cally, Dawes, Girardi). We have $1.37m of cap space, JayBo is on $4.875m, if it were done at the dealine we’d be fine, but any earlier we’d need to remove a few hundred $k in cap space.
    Maybe we can offload a spare part like Fritsche in the deal but i bet we’ll be giving up a good youngster and a high draft pick too.

    Now that Sundin is off the market (and currently shopping for a nice fat wallet to fill with all his millions) we should see Shanny go somewhere and maybe a few trades finally get done after the roster freeze.

  96. Bring back Shanny for the second half of season and playoffs. Everyone was concerned that he would not have legs for a full season (I disagreed). Sign him now, he’s won three cups and will be an important addition to the team in the playoffs and the second half. Forget about the argument that he’s to slow to keep up with the new “fast-skating” team. We need someone who can find the back of the net. We’re lucky to get 2 goals a game as it is now (not counting empty-netters/shootouts/overtime goals. That man still knows how to score goals and win games.

  97. Shanny is washed up. And don’t believe that “Shanny took less to play in NY” crap either. He got a deferred deal that HURT the Rangers. The Rangers are a team that bids against itself in every deal they make. Shanny is unsigned because he is a pig at the trough. No one is gonna pay him. . . . except for the Rangers. This is a rare day when I am THANKFUL for the salary cap. It keeps the Rangers from hurting themselves. Glen Sather running with scissors. Mats deserves every dime he gets. He deserves to call his own shots. If the Rangers wanted Sundin, they should have got him July 1. Sather blew it. And in hindsight, he blew it last year as well because he bid against himself for Gomez and Drury. Same for Redden & Rozi. So, if you have a problem with Sundin signing elsewhere, look no further than Sather for that disappointment.

  98. Glen Sather on ebay:

    Michel Roszival. Buy it now $3 mil per year.
    0 bids

    Sather’s bid= $5 mill for 4 years.

  99. Now Sather has to make a move for scoring. Is it crazy to think that #68 may be plan B? Or, does he move to the fore, and make a move for Kovalchuk? Which he possibly could have done by moving Dubinsky when he appeared to have some value.

    I would say J-Bo, but Sather is stuck with Redden and Rozi for the duration. There is no need to even think about a quality d-man.

  100. Oh well. I guess we can finally talk about something else. Everything happens for a reason. And another center really isn’t what this team needs. It’d be a disaster to completely revamp the lines all over again…midseason. So while it woulda been cool to see, it’s time to move on.

    Orr – I think it may be the opposite with the Sharks tomorrow night. They may have been shutout last night. But they’ve been “sliding” (for lack of a better word) for the better part of a week. The time may just be right to at least steal a point in SJ tomorrow night. NO ONE woulda thought we coulda made this trip and bring back 5 out of 6 pts as a souvenior.

    Personally, I don’t think slats should make ANY moves until at least 1/1. There’s 4 more games before that (incl tomorrow night) and they’re on a streak. Not that the play has been stellar…but steady enough to win the last 3.

    An upgrade at defense is needed. Although if anyone else caught it, Zip quoted Rozy saying that he “felt like he bottomed out a few games ago”. And with 2 goals the other night, it could be just the spark he needed to get going…before the trade deadline to trade that a-hole!! Even if that’s not the case, he’s got a lot of ground to make up to justify his contract the rest of the way.

    Another scoring winger is needed also. Shanny? Not sure on that. On one hand, he’s gotta be itchin to fire some pucks on net that count for something. And if he’s ready to do that, and we can find the right combo of guys to go to the net, he could be effective. On the other hand, he’s an aging vet thats been losing a step game by game. Although, I’d like to think his legs can take 40 games. I say make him wait as long as possible, and if he’s still serious about playing down the stretch…see if he’ll wait till we hit a real slide. There will be wingers available March 4th, so maybe we just want to wait it out until then?

  101. i really think we are 1 top six forward away from being a cup contender. Trading either Rozy or Kalinin really wouldnt disrupt our overall Defensive plan, because I think Lundqvist would still play stellar and i have faith in Potter to come into the lineup mid-season.

    I think we underestimate the value of our D-men. Yeah i know that we are stuck with Redden but Rozsival’s 5 mill contract, isnt THAT high(if you look at what some other D-men are making), and Kalinin might be valuable at the deadline if a team has alot of injuries going into the playoffs.

    Im just not sure if going after Shanny is the answer?? I think he could play well, and would have instant chemistry, but i think the team needs a GAME-CHANGER to put them over the hump like Pittsburgh did last season.

    I would have no problem trading away our 1st and 2nd round picks this trade deadline because, i feel we have plenty of good talent in Hartford, and i think we are 1 player away from the Cup

  102. I agree with that somerset. Shanny may not be the answer. But I’d be hard pressed to think his shot can’t help the PP. The guys know him, he knows the guys, the staff, etc. And he could be had on the cheap. Relatively speaking.

  103. Sorry boys, I don’t think the Devils were waiting to see what Sundin did before signing Shanny – in fact I think nobody was. If someone was going to sign Shanny I think they would have by now. Lou LAm has no interest…

  104. One thing we have to remember is that Shanny was great for 1/2 of each season he was with us and struggled late on due to injuries. If we get him fresh and injury free with 35-40 games left he should (in theory) be peaking when we need him to.

    I’m not saying we SHOULD sign him, but lets at least look at the true picture: 67 games, 62 points in 07 (plus 5 goals in play-offs), 73 games, 46 points in 08. Some drop-off but the injury slowed him dramatically in the last 3rd of the season.

  105. I dont see Shanny making the PP all that much better. He was on the PP last 2 seasons and it didnt do anything for us. If shanny is out there then the opposing team knows to just “shut Shanny down”, and it becomes too predictable. But he could benefit from not being on a PP with Jagr and Rozsival too, so you never know.

    The thing im torn about, is he really would cost hardly nothing and i feel Sather still owes him a “good faith” contract.

  106. UK – That’s EXACTLY what I’m thinking.

    somerset – That’s it TOO! haha I think this years PP would fit him a little better.

  107. I’m not sure i buy into the “owes him one” theory, these guys are very very well paid.

    The question for slats is what does he try and do with our remaining cap space? Add some scoring depth or try and grab a physcial d-man to replace Kalinin or Roszy.

  108. well i did a little research, and I think Rozsival is just as good as, or in some cases better than these players making around his kind of money… I dont think it would be impossible to move him, to clear space for a scoring winger still.

    R. Hainsey 4.5 mill, M. Schneider 5.6, R. Regehr 4.0, A. Aucoin 4.0, J. Pitkanen 4.0, S. Hannan 4.5, J.M. Liles 4.2, T. Gilbert 4.0, K. Ballard 4.2, K. Johnsson 4.8, R. Hamrlik 5.5, JoVo 6.5, E. Brewer 4.2, J. Mckee 4.0

    yeah Rozy might be a little overpaid, but most teams are willing to overpay to get a veteran D-man on their team

  109. Somerset, Rozi and good should never be in the same sentence. Maybe Rozi and horrible, bad or crappy are better fits. I don’t care if he makes the league minimum, he’s been horrible all year. Anybody who is hypnotised by his 2 goals last game just simply needs to look at what he did when Brown tied the game, NOTHING. He could have put the body to him but he turned away. I’m at the point now where I’m just watching his every move on the ice instead of watching the flow. Hurt or not, all a team has to do is dump the puck into his corner, put pressure on him and either muscle him off the puck or wait up the boards for his panic pass.

  110. This is great news. i don’t see how the rangers were all over Sundin but not interested in Shanny?

    Just don’t get it…

  111. Im just SO FREAKING HAPPY the Sundin Shit Show is over

    Greedy, Liar is what he is, and I could really care less that he chose Van.
    Lets us not disrupt our team chemistry, and make trades we NEED to make.

    As far as Shanny goes, anyone whose been reading this blog the last three years knows Im a huge supporter, BUT 1.5mil for a 3rd line winger PK and PP duties with 40= games lef tin the season and a 650 goal scorer? YES!!

    And anyone saying he donest have the legs the team is too fast? What the hell team have you been watching? OUr rangers aint no speed demons!!

    PRucha Fritsche – Traded or waived
    Try and get a solid Dman
    Sign Shanny

    Done

  112. One thing you need to say here, even if you aren’t so upset about losing Sundin sweepstakes ( which I’m not at all…to hell with him) is that Sather really screwed himself didnt he?

    I’m not allowed to bash Renney anymore so I’ll go after slats…being realistic, he had a chance to add a proven commodity to a first place team..halfway thru the season; without giving up youth; without having to commit to 4 or 6 years and he couldn’t pull it off because he hemmed himself in…

    Its gonna come up again…and lets not be too hard on Uncle fester here..I belive he did want to come to Ny and he just needed Sather to make room..AND HE COULD NOT GET IT DONE

    Forget Mats but where do we go from here?

  113. Somerset – you’re absolutely right, I would rather have Rozsival then a lot of guys on that list. When some of those dudes contracts come up, I bet they resign for more then Rozsival’s 5mn.

    Per my post the other day about even strength goals allowed, posters here somehow think Rozsival and Redden should never be on the ice for a goal against. It’s pro hockey, defensemen get beat – the other team’s players are pros too you know.

  114. Well well well. I had my company x-mas party last night. Went to bed late. A buddy of mine at work said – its over, he went to Vancouver. I had no idea what he was talking about until he saw the look on my face like a UFO just flew out of his head. I said “right, and it wasnt about the money, f*uck that bald douche” I read all of your posts and if you think the Rangers couldnt sign Sundin – what makes anyone think they could sign Gaborik. He would probably want $7-9 million LOL

  115. The BIG lesson learned from this entire saga is that Slats needs to make some room NOW.

    Hopefully, this will come as a blessing in disguise and we’ll be able to make a trade or sign someone decent come all-star break or trade deadline.

    We’re good enough to get into the playoffs, we just need a few peieces to make us a contender.

    Bottom line, is we have a handful of guys who are just EATINTG UP space and prohibiting us from even engaging in serious trade talk.

  116. czechthemout!!!!! on

    Sundin- Yeah right,it’s not about the money!.Another self hating millionare wh feels he has to be contrite about going for the big bucks.I wish I had a dollar for every athlete who claims before negotiating a contract that “it’s not about the money”. I can name maybe three or four NHL players who truly signed because they wanted to win the cup.
    Paul Kariya,Teemmu Selane in Colorodo,and most recently,Marion Hossa with Detroit.First two signed for a million bucks each for one year.Hossa singed I think for 3-4 million for one year and walked away from a 50 million dollar offer from the Pens.That’s someone who truly wants to win the cup.All thess other clowns,including our own,Gomez and Drury are full of shit.

    Sather and Renney need to stop looking for a quick fix and start developing and trusting their own draft players.If they do not trust them,isn’t that an indictment on them for their ability to draft and develop players? It is painfully obvious that Renney has zero ability to develop talen.All you have to do is look at all the young players who are regressing under his “system”. HOw in the hell is Dubi supposed to score any points when he is now playing with two players who are offensivly challenged.Moreover,how is he supposed to develop any chemistry with his linemates when the genious keeps changing lines every other period?

    As for the game on Wed.,They looked like shit most of it and were lucky for two reasons.

    1)Valliqutte saved their bacon and 2) La Barbera really sucks!!. ANd even with that,they could only muster up a meager 2 regulation goals against him.

    Renney and his “system” need to go.As does Sather and his player personnel decisions in orde for us to move forward as a team.

  117. Ha, I’ll take an injury proned Gaborik over just about anyone.

    Even when he plays only 40 games a season he scores 20+ goals.

    Dude missed 26 games and then had a goal/assist 2 nights ago.

    He’s a freak of nature with some of the most talent in the league.

    A top 5 guy when he’s healthy.

  118. I am sorry we didn’t get Sundin mostly because I thought it would be the catalyst to Somehow get rid of some combination of the three D-Men that are dragging us down, R,R,&K! Rosi’s 2 goals mean nothing. He got beat twice on the same play a few seconds apart. Our so called defense is getting Hank & Vally killed.
    I don’t know who would possibly want R&R at their absurd contracts as neither one can play a lick of defense.
    More than anything in the off-season we needed a big hitting, crease clearer & we got none!
    I laugh when I hear the different pundits talk about how good defensively we are. I not for our Goaltending we suck!
    Hopefully Sather will try & do something else now or else it’s another 2cd round exit!

  119. Czech,

    You forget to point out that they did indeed win the game… back-to-back nights, west coast road trip, back-up goalie, amidst trade rumors and Sundin saga, against the #1 defensive team in the league. Kings give up least amount of shots per game then any other team.

    You also cite Dubi’s linemates as part of a “system”. That’s not a system, that’s personnel. Who else is there. We have too many 3rd liners.

    Once again, not a coaching problem but a GM problem.

    Get a clue.

  120. “Sather and Renney need to stop looking for a quick fix and start developing and trusting their own draft players.If they do not trust them,isn’t that an indictment on them for their ability to draft and develop players? It is painfully obvious that Renney has zero ability to develop talen.All you have to do is look at all the young players who are regressing under his “system”. HOw in the hell is Dubi supposed to score any points when he is now playing with two players who are offensivly challenged.Moreover,how is he supposed to develop any chemistry with his linemates when the genious keeps changing lines every other period?”

    CZECHTHEMOUT!!! 12-19-08

    Well said, well said.

    Ranger home grown:

    Lunquist- cant ask for more
    Prucha – wasted
    Dawes -waiting
    Callahan- more than we hoped, good thrird liner
    Dubi -needs a mission
    Staal – one more step
    Giradri -not gold but incovered silver maybe

    who am I missing??

  121. Kaspar, I’m hoping we can add (and assess) Potter at some point :)

    At least the future D looks good… Sangs and Del Zotto are the real deal!

  122. The lack of development of players like Dawes, Prucha and others has more to do Slats signing and trading for guys then it does with Renney not developing them.

  123. Slats drafts players and gets blamed for their development…
    thats like blaming the person who gave you a gift for it getting robbed by a criminal..LOL

  124. Henrik- Best goaltender in the league
    Prucha – Substituted by better talent, bigger bodies
    Dawes – Not nearly as good as you guys think he is. When you can point out one play (pronger) a season, that’s not a good thing.
    Callahan- Maxed out his potential. Great third liner player, won’t get much better.
    Dubi – Developing nicely; sophomore scoring woes. Doesn’t have anyone on his line that can finish; not Renney’s fault.
    Staal – For a young defenseman, developing at an exponential rate. Will contribute to offense in future.
    Girardi – Cally on Defense. Great second solid D-man, but will never be a QB or top guy.

    So, who isn’t Renney developing? Dawes and Prucha? I’d argue they’re just NOT THAT GOOD. Not to mention, both are small guys with limited talent.

  125. Kaspar,

    These players you refer to are just not that good, point period.

    Nigel Dawes is and always will be a mediocre player. Peter Prucha’s first year was a flash in the pan, but he’s limited talent who needs a change of scenery.

    GM’s draft and sign guys based on what they anticipate they can do in the future. To say that Slats takes a guy on and then washes his hands is ridiculous.

    It’s even more so his fault if a guy turns out to be a bust

    Cough, Montoya, Jessiman, and the list goes on and on and on.

  126. “The Rangers are kinda of similar( to last season’s NY Giants team) They don’t really seem that impressive, but yet, the continue to win. And people continue to complain. Last week, I did the same, saying that they were boring and didn’t have the gas to do any real damage.Throughout the whole year, people said things like “this is the worst team to win a division,” and “this is the worst team ever to win a Championship.” But they kept on winning”

    This is from the rangers blog on hockeybuzz; from a guy named Pete V…seems like a good analogy no? Or, i hope its a good analogy….

    what’ya think of it?

  127. “I’m not allowed to bash Renney anymore so I’ll go after slats…being realistic, he had a chance to add a proven commodity to a first place team..halfway thru the season; without giving up youth; without having to commit to 4 or 6 years and he couldn’t pull it off because he hemmed himself in…”

    agreed. actually, I don’t see how anyone could NOT agree with that.

    Brandon – as usual, I agree with your point. You can’t make everyone a fuggin superstar. Being able to get the guys you mentioned into fulltime NHLer’s is in itself an acheivment. We didn’t have the high picks to get kane, toews, etc. We were picking towards the bottom of the barrel. And got mostly that. And Renney & co….all that are involved in the development process (graves too) are to be commended for that.

  128. PAVEL

    Eh, we already have Nicky Z from the 03 draft> We already semi made up for Jessiwoman.

    Id like to see Dubi with Shanny, and Freddy Shoes. Its just like Voros, they skate semi slow, but at least Shanny can finish.

    I slept on it, and im open to the idea more. Unless Slats can somehow get Cheechoo from the Sharks.

    J-Bo, eh that would be interesting, id prefer him over Rozi, but how much would he want after the seasons over ? Also what would the Cats wants ? Obviously Dubi, but there’s no way in hell id do that. Maybe Dawes, and ugh a 1st, but i don’t know, maybe im cheap when it comes to trading, but i cant give up a 1st for him. They suck at trading though, so who knows, maybe Slats can pull another trade like he did to the Jackets.

  129. czechthemout!!!!! on

    Brandon- are you a naive Renney apologist or are you simply ignorant about hockey?
    Sather is a shity judge of talent,I’ll agree with you 100% their if that is the point your trying to make.BUt some of the players that have made it to the big team are clearly regressing.

    Lundquist- was already the best goalie in the world not in the NHL before he came here. Renney had nothing I repeat nothing to do with his development.The goalie coach is the key here.As for Renney”Weeks is my goalie,end of story” this quote from the genius who only relented when Weeks got hurt and the king so clearly outplayed Weeks.

    PRUCHA-scored 52 goals in his first two seasons.Several of those on the powerplay.Yet for some strange reason,Renny just abanded him last year and it’s carried over to this year.Prucha was buiried by this”coach” on the fourth line last year and lost his confidence.

    Dawes-Scored 16 goals last year in very limited action and ice time.His ice time like most of the other kids on this team is given to the useless 4th line.He’s another player that has lost his confidence and probobly needs a change of scenery.I bet he’ll got to another team and score 20+ goals consistantly.

    Callahan-here,you are clearly talking out of your ass! He has scored in every level of play that he’s been.He’s been thrown around every line combo possible and if you recall,when he was brought up he looked like a scorer.COach genius has infected his mind with his “system” to the point where he just goes out now looking to hit people,dump the puck into the corner and than transition himself to defense.In fact that’s the biggest problem with most of the team.They haven’t got a clue of what to do offensivly anymore because the “coach” has destroyed their confidence and creativity on the offensive side of the game.

    Dubi-“developing nicely” are you out of your mind?Dubi’s offensive game has all but disappeared.He is affraid to get to the center of the ice to shoot the puck because he’s scared he’ll be out of the play if he misses and the other team starts on a transition attack.In fact most of the teams confidence on offense has disappeared.

    Staal- with the exception of the last two games,his play has leveled off as well.HIs iverall play is down from last year unfortunatley.I hope the last two games will be more indicative of how he’ll play the rest of the season instead of the first 30 or so games.

    GIrardi-his play has also regressed.He does not take the body as often.He’s not in as good postion on offense as he was last year.He also scored 10 or 11 goals last year,I think he won’t even come close to that this year.

    Tyutin-I’ll also add him to the mix.His play greatly regressed last year over his previous two wich is why he was trded.However,his play in columbus is almost back to the level it was two years ago and he’s playing alot of minutes for them.

    Gomez and Drury- although these guys were established vets when they came here,theier overall play has regressed from their previous teams.Gomers numbers are down substantially as are Drury’s. Ther is no other explantion for this nor is this a coeincidence.They both have one thing in common,they are both “coached” by Tom Renney.

  130. I know we “need” a dman “now”. But it’s a mistake to make a deal for a big name D if your not sending Rozy or Redden the other way. Also a mistake to grab another Dman making over $5mil. Even if you send one the other way. With the pending FA’s we have, we need to MOVE salary, not bring it in.

    Thanks slats.

  131. a casual observer on

    Do Redden and Rozy have limited trade clauses? We are still finding ways to win but we have more holes than swiss cheese. Do we plug those holes now or wait….

  132. I really like our prospect- Gordie Clark has done an excellent job grabbing quality.
    2004 1st lauri korp
    2004 2nd dubi
    2005 1st staal(moved up to get him)
    2006 1st sanguinetti
    2006 2nd Anisimov
    2007 1st Cheraponev :(
    2008 1st Del Zotto
    2008 3rd Grachev
    We’re finally drafting talented picks that should have at least decent NHL futures- I would hate to trade any of it away for a player that probably won’t resign with us anyway. And we’re going to need these players to step into big roles the next several years because of how handcuffed we are to drury, gomez, redden.

  133. Casual observer,
    redden has a limited trade clause in which he picks 10 teams he would not accept trades to and I don’t think Rozsival has any ntc

  134. czechthemout!!!!! on

    Beer me-

    I don’t think I am. Look,I don’t think either of these guys is a super star,but they are legitimate top six forwrds potentially and Staal is a potentially great number two dman.I just think with Renney as thier coach,their potential will never be reached.

  135. Just heard news

    Zubov probably out for season ( Rozy?)( team 990 Montreol)

    Senators actively trying to trade Vermette and shubert for Dee-man….????(Ottawa newspaper)

    Philly people convinced Flyers w/o Briere (15-7) are better than Flyers with Briere…will try to move hiim after his injury to clear space for a defensive aquisition…or goaltender ( Pierre Mcguire)

  136. The average salary of the two highest d-men on each team in the East is $4.4mn, safe to assume that the number goes up as old contracts come off. So the Rangers spend more on D and there is a corresponding lack of talent on the front lines.

    You would think from reading some the posts here that Renney has spoiled all of the talent on this team. Expectations are that every player on the top three lines should score at least 20 goals and a handfull should have 30 goals.

    Think about it for a second, the average team in the East scored 230 goals last year, a touch less than 20 per for the twelve guys on the top three lines.

    If your fourth line chips in 10 goals and you get 30 goals from two players that means that three other guys only have to score 10 goals each on your average team.

    On the Rangers, those three guys are Prucha/Dawes, Voros and Callahan.

  137. doodie machetto on

    I mentioned above how Jagr would’ve been a better choice than Sundin, but what I didn’t mention was that I’m OK with the fact that they let Jagr walk too. I mean, don’t get me wrong, I am a BIG Jagr fan. But I just didn’t see this team as a piece or two away from serious contention; we’re a lot further than that.

    The Redden and Rozsival contracts kill us. There’s no ifs ands or buts about it. With Drury and Gomez, they were overpaid, yes, but that was their market price at the time. Besides, it left us we solid down the middle, I’d say top 10 for 1-2, and top 5 1-4. Besides, those were done deals, so there would be no use complaining about them.

    But Rozsival and Redden? Both overpaid on their FA market value by a million. Add to that Rozsi was a resign, and Rozsi was overpaid by maybe 1.25-1.5. So those contracts really handcuff our cap. Instead, we should have been patient and saved our money for investing in our youth, signing guys like Zherdev, Dubinsky, Korpikoski, this year to long contracts, and the same for Staal and Girardi next year. We’ve drafted so many offensive defensemen, and instead of being patient for them to develop, we’ve logjammed ourselves in that department over the next 4 years by having two offensive defensemen tied to lucrative contracts that basically will prevent Sangs or MDZ from getting a chance.

    And now with all of our cap dollars tied up, we won’t be able to take a run at any scoring winger or hard hitting, stay at home defenseman that our team desperately needs and is nowhere to be found anywhere in our system.

    We were supposed to be rebuilding. Instead it is more of the same: Sign vets to huge contracts. No patience for our talent pool to grow and shine. That dream died when Rozsi and Redden signed.

  138. Doodie

    And it wouldnt have been so bad ( the dollars per year) if the two guys were stop-gaps for Sangy and Del Z…you know 2-3 year contracts but man..If Staal really does become the next Pronger we’ll be paying him $7M a year just to keep him at about the same time Sangy and Del Z are starting to command big bux…

    Insane

    We almost have to hope that a few bomb out

    Like people here were about Dubi….and he did

  139. doodie machetto on

    Dubi is slumping with the rest of the team. I still think he’ll be a great player. A lot of players take a few years to really hit their stride. He’s shown flashes of what he can do. He just needs more time. The guy is 22!

    Here are the first four seasons of another center:

    GP G A P
    82 13 15 28
    80 25 42 67
    68 23 28 51
    76 20 17 37

    Here’s Dubinsky’s first season and this season to date:

    82 14 26 40
    35 5 12 17

    That first guy? Vinny Lecavalier. My point is that players have up times and down times, some reach their potential and others don’t. But you have to give the guys a chance to reach it before you give up on them.

  140. St. Louis is decimated with injuries right now, They are missing their top 3 D-men (Brewer, Mckee and Johnson) AND top 2 scorers (Kariya and McDonald)

    Ottawa will be trading one their big 3 for a D-man later this year.

    Dallas is missing Sydor and Zubov.

    We have options to unload some contracts this year, to bring in a winger … Sather knows this, I’M NOT WORRIED.

    I like the idea of bringing in a 2-4 million dollar winger, rather then a Kovalchuk or Gaborik.

    Plus we DONT need JayBo, he’s gonna want 6-7 million and is nowhere near worth it !!!

  141. To be honest.. In the summer, just when I thought the team couldn’t get any worse with the big contracts to Rozsival and redden- Sather pulled the trigger on the Zherdev deal. so, I’ll TRY to stay optimistic- as hard as it may be.

  142. the team could use Aves always ha.

    NO way the Sens are gonna give up Vermette for Rozy and a 3rd round. Absurd trade.

  143. Roszival for Avery never happens.
    Makes no sense.
    Avery is damaged goods this year, why pay him to “heal” in the minors?
    If it’s about the clearing salary,
    Why not just waive Rozsival and if he clears, bury HIM in the minors to get the salary relief?
    Rozsival is more valuable than either unrealistic scenario, as much as I dislike his play.

  144. Good post Doodie …

    I think the Rangers have been doing a fine job bringing in young talent EVERY SEASON since the lock-out

    2005 had Lunqvist and Prucha get their starts
    2006 had Callahan, Girardi, Dawes, and Dubinsky
    2007 had Marc Staal
    2008 has Korpikoski and Potter knocking on the doorstep

    Point is … some work out, some dont but if we can keep signing good Veteran Free Agents while filling in holes with good talent from within, the Rangers will be set for a long time.

    Not Every player we bring up is going to be a great talent Long-Term (Prucha). So, lets not put too much high expectations on the Callahan’s and Dawes’s of the team because we can always say that we drafted Lundqvist in the 7th ROUND !!!I think the Recruit/developmental team has done a great job

  145. Czech,

    I was out to lunch. Just got back and read your post. I disagree with every single word you wrote.

    I can’t even begin to type a response b/c I wouldn’t know where to start.

    Scorers score goals. I repeat, scorers score goals. When you’re in the game, you’re in the game. Lines don’t score goals, players do.

    Reason being teams mix and match for the power play.

    There have been plenty of player who’ve scored with regularity in more defensive minded systems… gomez being one of them.

    There comes a point where players have to take responsibility for themselves and put the puck in the back of the net.

    You can come up with a million “reasons” why these guys aren’t scoring, but the fact of the matter is they are not. And, at the end of the day, it’s the player who are not burying the puck, not the coach.

    Clearly, you’ve never played any sports at any sort of competitive level.

  146. I think Orr pointed out that getting Z kinda offsets the Jessman gaffe…even truer when you consider the prime piece we moved was Ranger draftee Tyuten ( who we really miss) but with all the young deemen it was a position of strenth.

    and getting backman gone…pure genius from the same guy who brought you Redden and Rozy…wierd

  147. “You can come up with a million “reasons” why these guys aren’t scoring, but the fact of the matter is they are not. And, at the end of the day, it’s the player who are not burying the puck, not the coach.”

    What if Petr Prucha doesnt play?
    Or play on the PP?

    His fault I guess?

  148. Trade Rozi for Chris Neil. Give this team some BALLS ! And move some of these 3rd liners out of here.

    That link was creepy, Matin Laraque or who ever that was, and the Donald Jagr. Lets not even get into the Evgeni Ricci, that will haunt my dreams for nights to come.

  149. Dr. house,
    that trade isn’t as absurd as you think- To say that Ottawa has been struggling for the last calender year is an understatement.. What Ottawa needs is an Offensive minded D-man. If you look at Vermettes numbers, he’s on pace for 13(!) points this year.

  150. Thank the lord, the so called Messiah is on his way to Canudia to be a Canuck (we asked it in ’94, and I’ll ask again WHAT THE HELL IS A CANUCK?)
    Someone tell Mats that fat, drunk and greedy is not the way to win a Cup.
    This guy is now an exact replica of CC Sabathia – overweight & overpaid with no rings. Def not someone you want on your team.

  151. WAIT I GOT IT!!

    Redden to Ottawa for Neil??

    Orr you are onto something.

    Kaspars Girl friend is a big Ottawa fan,,,picture how everyone feels here about Ranger offense THEN MULTIPLY BY TEN how Sens fans feel for anyone other than the big three

    Includes Vermette, Fisher, Kelly, Neil and the rest..makes Betts line look like the GAG line

  152. I’d like to see Gomez and Redden gone. These guys have been lousy all year.

    Trade to Atl: Gomez, Prucha, Fritsche, Kalinin & Redden to Atlanta

    NYR get: Kovalchuk, Williams, Reasoner and Havelid

    lines:

    Naslund, Drury, Callahan
    Kovalchuk, Dubinsky, Zherdev
    Sjostrom, Reasoner/Williams, Dawes/Korpedo
    Orr, Betts, Voros/Korpedo

    Staal/Rozsival (these 2 together seem to be doing well)
    Havelid/Girardi
    Mara/Potter or Fahey

  153. czechthemout!!!!! on

    Brandon-you don’t have to play sports to be able to recognize if your team has an incompetant coach or not.Scorers have to be held accountable for not scoring,but only when they are not buring their chances.The problem with the team is that they are not generating many chances and that is squarley because of the coaching staff. A good coach,through his system, has to be able to put his players in a position to not only play good defense,but also to score.Than it falls on the players to bury their chances.You clearly don’t watch many games because can you honestly say that the Rangers generate alot of scoring chances? the answer is clearly NO!!!!. Does Renney’s defensive system prevent the other teams from getting many scoring chances? Once again the answer is NO!!!!.Only herculean efforts by the goalies have been responsilble for preventing a blood letting in almost every game.Contrast that with the Kings.They truly have a system that allows less than 25 shots a game.The problem with them is their goalteanding.That’s what is holding them back.They Had 41 shots against us and at least 20 real good scoring chances.Only because Valli played the best game of his life were we able to beat them.If you don’t beleive me,go on espn radio and see if you get a replay of Gomez’s interview.

    Quite honestly Brandon,no matter what I or any other Renney detractor says,you’ll still defend Renney wheather we make sense or not.You see,you are like an abused wife.No matter what you’re told about how bad the person is who is abusing you is,you still live in a state of denial and defend him.In fact there will come a day sooner rather than later that the “coach” and the Renneyaide that he spews,wiich, you and some of the other posters here have bought,hook,line and sinker will be gone,but you will continue to insist that it is the players fault and not his.It never is his fault you see,even he never takes responsability for anything that goes wrong.It’s always blame the players,the media for the shitty powerplay,but never “coach” Renney.

    And for your information,I played orginized hockey for 9 years.

  154. howyagonnatellme on

    It’s no secret Tyutin has done wonderfully with the Bluejackets. The same guy we complained about regressing is one of the top guys in Columbus, and apparently the fans love him.

    Tyutin was a source of hope right before the lockout, and he played great his first season with the Rangers, but last year he clearly regressed. Now Columbus can’t get enough of him.

    Maybe he just needed a change of scenery…

    Or maybe there’s another key here.

    Maybe the Rangers SHOULD have waived Prucha. If Petr gets waived, and succeeds… all of us in the “fire Renney” crowd has additional proof, beyond the regression of Tyutin, Prucha, and, this season, the disappearance of Dubinsky.

    It makes no sense to let Prucha rot here. But if the organization worried about what might happen if they let him go? I find it just silly to think that 60 NHL goals is a fluke. Have stranger things happened? Sure. But you gotta give the kid a chance to get that back, otherwise you’re wasting a potentially great asset.

    Is Dubinsky down the same path? Zherdev? I really, really hope not.

    What makes Dubinsky better than Prucha? His fourteen goals last season… how many came from Jagr? How many of his assists were off Jagr’s goals? Isn’t that what we say about Prucha? Except for Prucha never, ever played with Jagr even strength, like Dubinsky.

    I see Dubi’s strength on the puck, his willingness to battle, his size are all great assets. But will we be talking about Dubinsky this way next year? I really hope not.

  155. czech

    I need to add to your rant at Brandon.

    “Scorers score goals. I repeat, scorers score goals. When you’re in the game, you’re in the game. Lines don’t score goals, players do.”

    Well then if goal scores only score goals then there will be 9-10 unassisted goals every game? Lines absolutely score goals – they are called plays.

    “There have been plenty of player who’ve scored with regularity in more defensive minded systems… gomez being one of them.”

    Gomez has only scored 33 goals once in his career. Other than that season. He has scored no more than 19 in every season of his career. He is a play maker, NOT a scorer.

    I also have played organized hockey when I was a kid, played college and in DIV 2&3 in adult leagues. So my playing experience is about 20+ years.

  156. Brandon

    Czech is right.

    You are only partly right.

    Coaching IS the problem. True, Sather has latched on to a bunch of 2nd raters in his “player assessment” mode, but it’s the tactical movements behind the bench that occur which decide how the team will fare.
    There’s enough true talent on this team, that if used properly and in the appropriate instances that can decide the fate of a team. Renney is consistently inadequate in this regard ( and I have no idea what the other two assistants are doing to help out.) There is no reason ( as Brooks has FINALLY pointed out) for players like Roszival and Kallinen who continue to falter when subject to pressure and continually get flustered in their own zone. There are different spot combinations that he could use ( for instance as he did the other night with Betts on the PP.) Good teams make this type of move all the time. Poorly coached teams remain chained to a rigid format and stagnate as a result.

    He’s strictly a prep school coach – nothing better.

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