Crunching the numbers

108

So here’s “my newspaper story”:http://www.lohud.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080910/SPORTS01/809100346/-1/SPORTS on Brendan Shanahan’s return appearance at the MSG Training Center, and his hope of rejoining the Rangers for season No. 3.

Larry Brooks at “the Post”:http://www.nypost.com/seven/09102008/sports/rangers/shanny_in_wait_mode_128388.htm and Andrew Gross at “the Record”:http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/hockey/other_nhl/view/2008_09_10_Brendan_Shanahan_hoping_to_remain_with_Rangers/srvc=sports&position=also also chimed in with stories on the matter, and it’s worth noting that we all have slightly different takes on the Rangers cap situation.

A couple of thoughts on this: One, it doesn’t help that the NHL doesn’t allow teams to disclose their cap situation (in part, the theory goes, because it would expose those teams trying to operate on the cheap, even though we all know who those teams are); and it also doesn’t help that I am an admitted mathematical idiot (which is why my wife, who I used to sit next to in math class in high school, balances the checkbook in our family).

But there’s also room for interpretation based on what the Rangers do with their roster. For instance, the $715,357 in cap space I’ve been quoting includes Thomas Pock’s $667,500, but it’s more likely that Pock starts the season in Hartford and the Rangers only carry six defensemen. And that number also includes Dan Fritsche $875,000, who is also a question mark for the opening-night roster.

Of course, while Shanahan and others told me yesterday that the contract number isn’t a huge obstacle, there are other considerations. For instance, if the Rangers really do want to clear both cap and roster space for Shanahan so he actually has a prominent role this season, the team might want to explore trading other forwards (I don’t know who, so don’t ask). And yes, that’s where Mats Sundin comes in, because even if the Rangers aren’t necessarily interested in the Swedish center, other teams are, and they’re not ready to commit to other moves until they know where Sundin stands.

So in other words, it’s complicated…

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108 Comments

  1. REPOST

    if people think that Shanny is too old to play and he’s slowed down and will single-handedly (according to 1 poster) somehow “screw up the team for the next 2 years”, what about the Chelios signing by Detroit? They won with him in the line-up at 45-46, and just re-signed him at 46 for another year… and people seem to think they have a good chance to repeat.

    Also, about Prucha. He hit a LOT last year. the reason it wasn’t incredibly memorable was because he’s too light and hits like Theo Fleury used to… take like 4 strides, FLY into somebody, fall down, get up, and skate off, while the hit person is just watching the whole thing unfold. It wasn’t really effective all the time, but the effort was there.

  2. Dr – I feel the same way, I’m SO sick of hearing about it. but the sad truth is that he’s one of the biggest (non)stories, and will make lots of waves once he decides and all these other players get shifted around because of it.

  3. The Post link wouldn’t work for me. That’s probably the best thing that’s happened for me in a week! lol Probably better off that way.

  4. Theo Fleury was also like 5’6″ 180lbs. He wasn’t scrawny, just short.

    Not to detract from Prucha, but its a different situation.

    As for Shanny, I can take it or leave it. I love the guy, have his jersey, but I won’t be heartbroken if he doesnt end up here. Nor do I think it’ll ruin this team if he resigns.

  5. I’m trying to figure out how Sundin effects Shanny…lets see here. Less than a mil in caps space. Shanny says its not about money. Sundin…probably wants ~7 million…so if Sunding wants to play for the Rangers we have to unload a crapload of salary…meaning bye-bye Gomez or Drury or a combo of high paid players. My goodness this is so f*&^ing idiotic and can’t even get my head around it!!!!!!!!

  6. Sorry Thor – I was making the point they both hit the same, not that they’re the same size/shape. Although I’d be thrilled if Prucha turned out like Fleury, without the alcoholism.

  7. all i know is that we have enough centers. Personally i would like Shanny back, but right now i dont care. I am completely bored watching sports at night. Whatever happens i will be in my seat opening night.

  8. staal – I may be wrong here. But I think what the big mess is that the Rangers may need or want to move players to get shanny under the cap. The problem with moving the players is that there’s not that many takers until sundin settles on a spot so other GM’s can get their rosters straight.

    Unfortunately for us and the other teams heading to Europe, theres a short camp.

  9. Fleury hitting Chara is one of my fondest memories…

    Keep cooking Theo.

    Prucha is so expendable (sorry, wife). He is definitely one of the most logical dump-offs for a 3rd pick to free cap space for Shanny. The thought of Sundin and his big depressing sweedish frame in a Ranger uniform makes me want to vomit my coffee and bow-tie.

  10. Sam, why nothing on Zherdev from your visit to the training center yesterday?

    Please, give us something, I’m dying to hear about this kid!

  11. Maxim Kondratiev in camp? They still want to try and make chicken salad out of chicken S? Unbelievable….

    Isn’t that guy the scraps from either the Leetch or the Kovalev house cleaning a few years back?

  12. The Sundin – Shanahan comparison, Sam was making is… A lot of Gm’s are holding out on making moves until Sundin decides what he wants to do. This will make it tough to sign Shanny and move some of our existing players since there are a handful of teams (mostly with the largest amount of cap space to take on our salary dumps) wont make moves until Sundin signs somewhere.

    Unfortunately i think Rissmiller is here to stay. I’ve been complaining about that signing all summer, but he is the biggest body on the team at 6’4 220lbs. Some scout on the Rangers likes him since he was one of the first “July 1st signings” and at 1 million this season i dont see any team allowing us to trade him there.

    The only guys i can see being moved for salary dumps are Prucha (1.6 mill), Rissmiller (1.0, but see above), Sjostrom (840k), or Fritsche (875k). Everyone else makes less then 840k so it really wouldnt be much of a salary dump.

    KEEP BETTS !!! BEST P.K. MAN WE HAVE !!!

  13. I feel like forming a line of people ( from all teams blogs), each person on line armed with a three-stooges type weapon ( saws, hammers, pliers and large pieces of wood) and we all take turns trying to beat the senses out of, or into Mats Sundin….and when its over he begs to play somewhere and someone says “hey, I hear they have this new league in Russia….why dont you there?”

  14. kaspar…so violent. Look, the game passed you by, but you don’t need to take it out on guys that can still play.

    Yeah, I don’t think moving betts from his role is a good idea at all. And knowing the way Renney runs the team, it’s not even worth the time to debate. Betts performs in the role that has been given to him better than the role that’s been assigned to any other skater on the team. (I say ‘skater’ b/c hank does a pretty good job of holding his own back there eh).

  15. “kaspar…so violent. Look, the game passed you by, but you don’t need to take it out on guys that can still play.”

    Beer Me!
    Sorry, you’re right I’m banished to the cossacks and everyone’s begging this big-bald clown to come play, it seems like he’s actually holding up the start of the season!!….

    Forget what I said. I’m on my way to therapy right now…

  16. Kasper, like Beer said, even though the game passed you by…you still had one of the best hip checks I’d ever seen.

  17. I guess it would be pretty unRanger like to start the season without a forward who will run out of gas at the halfway point of the season.

  18. haha kaspar. Just take a deep breath and count to 10. Interesting point about him ‘holding up the start of the season’. It really DOES seem like that.

  19. one of my favorite Kasper moments was when he (you) beat the Sabres in OT with a goal, then dove at center ice and kicked his (your) little penguin feet. CLASSIC.

  20. BEER ME – I completely agree re Betts. I think he is one of the most underrated players. He knows his ability, his role and does it well. Great on the PK and did a good job between Hollweg and Orr just getting the puck into the offensive end. His line did a fair job in their capacity. No scoring (Let’s not forget Orr’s goal with Shanny’s stick though!), but they were often put out to shut down the other team’s top line and they handled it pretty well. I think Betts is a guy who knows his limitations but still brings it every night. Always willing to throw his body in front of a puck when necessary.

  21. I look at the amount of bums the Rangers have brought in this summer and I just can’t understand why they put value into some of those guys and just seem to have no respect for Shanahan. They overpay for other teams’ players, but won’t pay anything for a guy that wants to be here. Stupid.

  22. SEAN

    You make an excellent point. I don’t understand why so much time is spent devaluing Shanahan on a (probably) bargain rate, one year contract while we are paying lots of money to players who “need a change of scenery”. I hope that that’s all they need, but you can’t question Shanny’s heart. He’s earned respect if nothing else….

  23. Fritsche is a ?? Seems to me, he’s done more in the NHL the last 3 years than Voros, Orr, Rissmiller or Sjostrom

  24. Please let the era of Shanny pass. His time is up. He only wants to play here because it’s convenient for his family. He’ll slow down the team and take a roster spot from Prucha. I doubt Shanny will accept 4th line roll. He’s too slow for a top 6 position just when the team is attempting to use more speed. Let’s move on. Please. This is disappointing to hear he may be back another year. I like Shanny, but he’s done. Sorry.

  25. not sure if someone posted this before but the NHL Network is televising games from the Traverse City prospect tournament. I believe the first game airs on Saturday night. I don’t think the games will air live but it will be great to see some meaningful hockey other than that classic crap they show on the network. (thanks Jeff L. for the info)

  26. “new 3rd jersey’s for Carolina’

    A black Jersey???? Whats that now 46 pro-teams using black?

    Anyone see mixed-up Atlanta Falcons on sunday? They had brick red jerseys and helmets in the 70’s, switched to Black jerseys and helmets later….Now? the keep the Black helmet and switch back to red jersey!!!

    Is there anyway a team can be lessed respected than to continously change their uni’s???

  27. Did I just see a post from Prucha25…welcome back!…unless of course you are a new Prucha25
    Honestly, I don’t know where I stand on Shanny. I like him and think he’d be a good veteran for the team but on the other hand I see a team that is heading in a totally different direction. I wish he would just take Pearns job…I think our PP would be good then.

  28. Let see Shanny has never since 1988 put up less than 20 goals a season?
    Prucha had ONE year of 30 goals
    and you want him in instead of Shanny? Retarded.
    Nevermind he was tied for third in goals leader last year, and prucha had what? 8 Goals or something.

    Sign him, one year, lesser role. BArgain price, for what were getting.
    Everyone else get over it

  29. that link that Beer Me posted, about if Shanny would fit in. I liked the writer’s suggestion that Shanny could just retire and instantly become commish. I favor that idea.

  30. 05-06 Shanny put up 40 goals, 80 points, but in 96-07, only 29 goals i think, which is still good, but it was that freak injury that slowed him down, and last season Shanny didn’t get off to great start, and didn’t score until that shit game at Atlanta, where Girardi scored his first career goal, and Pruchs got elbowed in the fuggin face by that reject Exelby, then Exelby refused to fight Orr cause he’s a POOSY. Damn that game sucked. But Shanny started to get his sheet together, but the knee injury screwed him over, then playing though the injury caused his hip to fugg up due to the knee injury.

    Point being, like i said in other posts, if Renney uses him the right way, then that would be good for him. Take him off the PK, just play him smart.

    And i would NOT trade Fritsche, he’s still young, and you never know. Every Nyr fan is against trading Betts but i can care less if he’s on the team or not. He’s a good defensive player, but we’ve had this argument a month or two ago, he’s not the only one on the team that can do that, everyone makes him out to be the MOST important part of this team, but he’s not. But Slats wont dump him.

  31. Mikey, in 2000-2001, Mark Messier had 23-44-67. Great stats for a 40-year old, right? Well, sure…take a legendary player who still has great hands and give him 20-22 minutes a night, and he’ll put up those numbers. Of course, he’ll also compile most of those stats during Oct-Nov-Dec, slow down and get banged up during the middle portion of the year, and disappear at the end. Meanwhile, your young, former 30-goal scorer will sit at the end of the bench during power plays, play 12 minutes a night, and yes, finish with 8 goals.

    I’ll reiterate a point made yesterday: If you’re most excited about October and November, by all means advocate for resigning Shanny. But if you’re more excited for Apr-May-June, give those minutes and sifts to Prucha, Callahan, and Dawes.

  32. So…. having 1 guy around 40… and he (supposedly) slows down at the end of the season.. means the ENTIRE team suffers and does badly at the end of the season?

    I never realized Shanny was THAT important to the team.

  33. Jeever…supposedly? Unless you’re Barry Bonds, 40-year old athletes slow down. There comes a time when you just can’t do what you used to do or what the mind thinks it can do. It’s no disrespect toward the man…I’ve got the utmost respect for Shanny. It’s impossible not to like him. He does and says all the right things. But this team can’t get over the second-round playoff hump, and I think we stand a better chance of that with young guys on fresh legs who can put up those same numbers with fewer shifts and fewer injuries.

  34. Sather just can’t let go of washed up has beens. Years ago it was Jurassic Mark Messier now Shanny. He is too old too and too slow to have much of an impact. He being around will also retard the development of our young players(someone will get less playing time and someone might not make the team)If not for guys like SDtaal, Dawes, Dubi and Cally stepping up this team might have not made the playoffs last year. Give Prucha another chance(he was great his first year and very good his second year) give Voros a chance to show he might be a poor mams version of Randy Mckay. Let’s see what Fritshe can do. My worst nightmare is Shanny coming back and Nedved making the team.

  35. I would much rather carry Dan Fritsche and Shanny on the opening night roster rather than Prucha and Mr. Softee Pat Rissmiller. Lets be honest at this point Fritsche has a lot more upside than Prucha, he better make this team out of camp.

  36. Watching the Rangers-Pens series from 92 on Nhl Network as Joe Beningo would say oh the pain! Francis was just unstoppable in that series. Beuk had a wretched series vs the Pens both in ’92 and ’96.

  37. Fritshe’s top end is what 12-15 goals? Prucha and Cally and Dawes’ top end is far better than Fritshe’s or Shanny(at this stage of his career)

  38. its obvious people slow down some as they age… but you’re saying he’ll go from a great player to non-existant. that’s a bit of a hyperbole. IF (and that’s a big if), the coaching staff manages Shanny’s playing time, keeps him to 5-10 minutes a game, there wouldn’t be as much to tire him out.

    Also, how does Shanny making the team “retard the development of young playerS”? Would he take like 3 roster spots??? Since when is it bad for young guys to have an older, incredibly successful player to learn from and soak up knowledge from?

  39. “You mean Drury. Jagr was a great Ranger. Anyone that claims different is not being objective.”

    Was that in response to carrying jags?

    Jagr has admitted that he didn’t give 100% for the majority of the season. Great Ranger? sure. Disgrace of a Captain? Sure. HORRIBLE influence on a young team? You bet ya.

  40. because Shanny will be nothing come spring as he was last yr. and guaranteed he gets at least $ 2.5 mm including deferrable bonuses which may very well happen if players ratify. so figure 1/2 of the $ 2.5 mm will count vs the 09-10 season.

    by reading the blogs Sather and jr dolan are giving the fans what they want. especially those who bought Shanny’s jersey. and the mindset will continue because most fans want their 40 year old “star”. even if that reduces next years cap money available.

  41. GRAVES9

    Lol, another stupid comment aboot Shanny. If you don’t like the guy, just say it, don’t make pathetic excuses as to why you don’t want the guy on the team. He is sooo far from a has been, or a washed up player, honestly i don’t know where you Shanny haters come up with this shit. Look at a couple of 40+ year olds in this league, compare them to Shanny, and ask yourself if you still think Shanny is washed up, or a has been. Slats is doing what all these whiny Nyr fans wanted, a young team, thats what you got, Shanny isn’t gonna drag the ENTIRE team down, lol if you really think that then there’s something wrong with you. Wings had no problem signing a 45-46 year old Chelios to there cup winning team, and id be a whole fuggin hell of a lot more worried aboot signing a 40+ year old D man than a 40+ year old forward. All the kids seem to want him back, like Dubi, Dawes, Cally, Danny, they know he can still play, and i definitely choose to believe the people who actually see him play than the fans who imagine how terrible he has and will be. Have a cookie, your delusional.

    ANDREW

    Im with you, id love to see Fritsche on opening night. But who knows what the final roster will be. He just needs to bust his ass in camp. Pre season is a week from Saturday i think, i cant wait, its cool that there playing all 8 of them, they usually just play the home games.

  42. If the fans were getting what they wanted, NYR would be the team overpaying for Side-Show Sean.

    Sam must have one hell of an update if it’s this late to get an update!

  43. graves9 September 10th, 2008 at 2:47 pm

    You mean Drury. Jagr was a great Ranger. Anyone that claims different is not being objective.

    Am I being objective if I say that Jagr admitted to not giving 100%, which passed bad habits on to the youth?
    Drury is going to be a great Ranger, and his effort last season put Jagr to shame.

  44. Maybe the Rangers should sign Shanny for the first half and either Forsberg or Sundin for the second.

  45. Jagr started to show up when it mattered which was during the final 10 games of the season, Dru started to show up a little towards the deadline. i didn’t like Jags’ comments aboot not giving 100%, but he did show up in the playoffs, so im not gonna cry aboot how he didn’t give 100%, he was our best player, and he was one of the best in the playoffs overall, until we got eliminated.

    I miss Jags like hell, but i can get over it quickly. He’s always been my 2nd fav player in the world, so i cant bash him like some Nyr fans. It just pisses me off that he can still play the game, and he’s not playing in the right league. Its a damn shame.

  46. GardenFaithfulinFLA on

    “You mean Drury. Jagr was a great Ranger. Anyone that claims different is not being objective.”

    Jagr may have been a great hockey player, but he was not a great Ranger!

  47. What message did JJ’s effort send though? To me its that you can glide through the season and if your in the playoffs thats when you “turn it on”

    Dru showed up at the deadline? whats that supposed to mean?
    Its not like he was trying to save himself from being traded, or playing well to get traded
    Plus, not to open a can of worms but I remember all the whiners who said Dru is paid too much…so in that light who would have taken him?

  48. I miss Jags everyday and i am still having trouble gettin over him. Best player on the Rangers in awhile.

  49. He wasn’t a great Ranger are you kidding me? He had one of the best seasons in Rangers history in 05-06 he along with Lundqvist carried this team to the playoffs. He after a slow start in 06-07 had a very good year. Once he clicked with Dubi last year his play picked up. Shanny is no different than Mess was in his second run here. The Rangers need to move on from Shanny. They got him ten years later than they should have. Jagr was really good to young players like Staal and Dubi and Prucha.

  50. Drury had a rather medicore season last year hopefully he picks it up this coming year. If not either move him to the wing or move him to the third line and let Dubi be the second line center.

  51. Jags? Say what you want about him but he helped bring this franchise back to respectability and was an offensive juggernaut specifically in the first year. Plus he holds all the single-season franchise scoring records, so for that, he was a great Ranger.

    Drury was solid. Dude didn’t have consistent linemates last year. He’ll have a better year this year and his linemates from last year regardless of who he plays with (Cally and Dawes) will improve.

  52. STAAL WART

    What i meant was, he struggled scoring until around the deadline or a little after, meaning he showed up when the team needed him the most. Both he and Jags.

    MikeA is right, for that 05-06 season alone, Jags is a great Ranger, he had 3 good enough seasons where he put up 70, 90, 100+ points, thats good enough for me to consider a great Ranger. Last two playoffs he showed up, but in 06 he didn’t have the chance, thanks to Gomer’s metal back.

  53. He didn’t have consistant linemates because he didn’t have chemistry with anyone till he was put with Dawes and Cally.

  54. That was probably the dumbest move Renney ever made putting Jagr on the pk in a playoff game while the Ramgers were being blown out. Pure stupidity.

  55. big difference with chelios tho is once he got hurt and was clearly not capable to play at a high level he didnt play (most notably at all in the last two rounds) renney isn’t gonna hold shanny to 5-8 minutes a night. the moment we are down by two goals he will bump someone off the first two lines and put shanahan on. shanny wont retard the growth of all our young players but it will certainly hurt one who will get less time b/c of him. that has already been the case with prucha over the past two years. if it was really the case he would be on the 4th line and not moved up id be fine with that, i mean orr doesn’t need to play every night, and we can teach someone else to kill penalties besides betts who is way too limited a player (hell he isnt even that good at faceoffs)

    and how could fritsche have more upside than prucha, he hasnt even scored 30 goals in his 3yr career and the blue jackets, one of the worst teams in the league, had no problem getting rid of him.

  56. question for those who want shanny – and seems mmost of you do. what salary would you pay him, what do you think he’d accept realistically, and at what salary would you not do it. for example at $2.5 mm would you still do it (total includes possible deferred bonus if that is allowed)

  57. You guys are now comparing FRITSCHE to PRUCHA?!?! Jeeze…what’s next? Comparing Betts to Drury? Their two dynamically different players. Prucha has raw scoring ability, there’s no question about it. If he’s on a line with a large wing and a talented center, he’ll put up serious numbers, no question about it. Fritsche is a two-way player who doesn’t have nearly the hands or shooting ability as Prucha, but plays a very good two-way game and can certainly knock in goals with his grit. Though I really like the kid and think he’ll turn some heads in his first game, I HIGHLY doubt you’ll see him on a top line with the Rangers, or any other team for that matter. PP, on the other hand, has a DISTINCT possibility of playing second and even first line on nearly a third of the teams in the NHL. I could see him becoming a Martin Straka like player one day.

    Nevertheless, there is simply no comparing them, or their respective contributions to the team, especially since Fritsche has never laced a skate in Ranger blue.

  58. ’05-’06 will always be my favorite season even though we got swept, but that year was fun. If i could do that year again i wouldnt change a thing except the playoffs. That year got me back into the Rangers more than ever because of Jags.

  59. dr.HOUSE

    Amen broseph. That year was great, all the young players, Lundqvist, Pruchs, Moore, Ortmeyer, Hollweg, watching Orr break Godard’s nose, then knocking him out in the rematch after he threw a cheap shot at our Kaspar. Watching Kaspar do the peace sign, and blow kisses every time he would draw a penalty, Jags finding a new best friend with Nylander, and on and on and on. What a great year that was. Another great moment was when Kaspar, Tyutin, and Ville Neiminen aall sandwiched Brashear, and jumped him, that was awesome.

    And lets not forget the 15 round shootout. The only reason Nyr fans still had respect for Harry was for that game. We do owe him for that, so what we have him was 2 extra years, now he’s gone, so i think that settles both parties.

  60. jeever – shanny is a forward and chelios is a dman. The 2 positions are totally different with regards to skating ability and keeping up with linemates.

  61. 05-06 was a great year. My top 5 favorite Rangers years in chronological order are;

    1. 89-90; Win the division with Leetch, Richter, Beezer,Kissio, Gartner, Nicholls, Miro freaking Horova etc. They did trade away some youth which was bad but this was a fun team and a great time to get into the Rangers. One John Druce away from a trip to the Conference finals.

    2. 91-92; Most purely skilled Ranger team ever. It’s a shame they had that mini strike, it killed the momentum and then the whole ridiculous Devils series that should’ve been over in 5 and Graves slashing Lemieux thing put a damper on the end but it was an appetizer for two years later. Does anyone here remember Turcotte’s game-tying goal against Vancouver on President’s Day 92 with like .3 seconds to go?

    3. 93-94: We all know the story :)

    4. 96-97: The last old skool hoorah: This wasn’t a very good team but they got hot at the right time and Tik alone was worth the price of admission. Richter was sick in the playoffs.

    5. 05-06: Strudwick starts it in Philly, the intro of the stick salute, “The Move,” Prucha, and the whole Rangers vs. world don’t give a you know what attitude this team had.

    Honorable mentions to 86 but I was too young for that and 06-07 which was a roller coaster ride.

    Fristche=Jan Erixon type player.

  62. ’05-’06
    Jagr making that ridiculous move to beat Kolzig. Sykora’s shootout goal against the flyers. Jags’s 54th goal against the Bruins in Boston (was at that game). Mark Messier night thats for sure. Opening night was great even though we lost. Of course Maliks’ shootout goal what a night that was. just loved the S-N-J line that was amazing.

    ’06-’07 i was in college, but Jagr’s 600th goal was great, and Sean Avery on April 1st. The night before New Years eve was good too.

    Last year was very special even thought it was annoying as anything. Shanny’s winners, making the Jagr haters shutup. My section which is awesome. Every devils game. Seeing Rod Gilbert drink at the CBG! and alot more and i cannot wait for October 10th!!!!!!!

  63. I don’t see why the Shanny can’t get an invite to camp, at least. I mean, if he can’t get up and down the ice with the Rangers, then why would another team sign him? No harm in giving him a look.

    However, with Nedved there and then Shanny, it minimizes looks potential rookies could be getting, and this is not something I want done.

  64. dr. house:

    I would add:

    Avery fighting Tucker at the Garden. Big win for Aves!

    Orr knocking out Fedoruk. Orr taking out Ovechkin and then Shanny going at it with Brashears at center ice. Classic MSG moment.

    Avery and Brodeur at the Garden.

    I’ll miss Seany!

  65. 06-07 had some great games as well; when Shanny dropped the gloves with Brashear, Avery pushing Brodeur, beating the Islanders after the Simon chop, the St. Patrick’s Day Game with Cally scoring his first two goals, Avery goes crazy on Toronto a few weeks later, and my favorite Rangers game since the lockout; the 7-0 whooping of ATL in game 3 of the 1st round.

  66. Graves9 – its ironic that you would make a projection that “Fritsche’s top end is what 12-15 goals?” 17 years ago, another 23-year-old 2d-round pick completed his 3d full NHL season, with a to-date career total of 23 goals (compared to Fritsche’s 29). Then, like Fritsche, he joined the Rangers. In a few months, we’ll see his #9 raised to the MSG rafters.

  67. Sparky can’t imagine Fritshe coming close to turning into what Graves was. I would love to see it but I doubt it. Graves was never given a chance to be anything but a 3rd or 4th liner with the Oilers. Fritshe was given a chance on the second line at times with clb. Graves actually started the 91-92 season playing with Turcotte and Broten. Once Kerr(who was supposed to be Messier’s wingman) showed he was done Graves was given a chance to play with Mess and the rest is as they say is Rangers history.

  68. that shanny/brashear fight was classic. St. Pattys day was amazing toooooo. Game 4 was nice against buffalo.

  69. Everyone’s writing off Shanny – 2 things to remember:
    1. He’s admitted he made a mistake trying to come back from an injury too quickly last year and it affected his play, so this “drop-off” was down to that not age.
    2. His contract will likely be a smaller salary plus a deferred bonus, which can’t be agreed until the NHLPA agree to extend the current CBA (they have until the 15th). Until that is signed there is no guarantee to be an 09/10 season for teams to defer Over 35 bonuses to…

    Besides, i’d take a motivated dedicated Ranger like Shanny over a shilly-shallying Sundin any day….

  70. I’d like to see a speedy, young forechecking 3rd line, and Shanny staying with the team prevents that from happening.

  71. Naked Joe
    whats the matter with this:?

    top two lines some combo of:
    Gomer-Zherdev-Naslund-Drury-Voros-Prucha

    young speed line Dubi-Dawes-Cally

    4th line: Betts-Shanny-Freddy Sjo ( fritche/Rissmiller and Orr)

  72. That Orr knockout on Fedoruk was so friggin classic. I remember in the previous game Philly beat us, and we totally blew it, after they were clearly out of the playoffs, and they were playing dirty, and Renney didn’t play Orr. We had PP’s after PP, but couldn’t do a friggin thing. Fedoruk elbowed Jagr, slew footed Pruchs, and boarded Ortmeyer, ALL on the same shift, and was call for ONE two minute minor. That game pissed me off beyond belief, the fact that somehow the Flowers won that, it blows my mind. Avery fought Richards, Ward fought some guy. Friggin Shanny has that freak collision with Knuble, Malik gets injured, Ward gets injured, Hank gets hurt, and leaves the game for Vally.

    I don’t care how much of an asshole i sound like, but Fedoruk HAD it coming to him. He should have shown some fuggin respect, and he didn’t, he played dirty, and justice came and beat the be-jesus out of him, that justice’s name is ORR, Colton Douglas Orr. Don’t mess with the stars or you’ll be seeing them !!!

    Id prefer Orr playing in all 82 games to be honest, ever since that one game, i just don’t wanna see the team without him. But ill never forget that game, i was there, and i picked a damn good time to go to a game.

    Orr’s had knockouts in all 3 seasons as a Ranger, i wonder who the next victim will be. Hopefully Brashear.

  73. I bought NHL 09 for X Box 360 last night. It is amazing! I also have NHL 2K9 for the Wii. I must say that it is very fun to play as well, because you actually can wind up and shoot. If I had to choose just one though, it would be NHL 09 all they way. I didn’t think it could get any better from last year, but it did. The boys in blue are pretty good in the game, and Hank is awesome in it. They have the first line as being Naslund Gomez Zherdev and second being Prucha Drury Dawes. For some reason though, the second line seems faster to me in the game, and Dawes has a hell of a shot in the game as well. And for what ever reason, Naslund is a dirty ass player and took a 5 minute major the first minute in to my game and also injured someone else for the game. Kind of made me laugh. Anyway, it is a lot of fun, and something to entertain me until the real season starts.

  74. Does anybody get the feeling that if Zherdev and Gomez dont mesh well this year, Zherdev will be gone and Brian Gionta will be on the team next season??

  75. I really do think that Gomez will mesh with either Zherdev or Naslund. If he did with both on the same line it could be a HUGE year for us and each of them point wise. If not, well you all know the other way it could go. Who knows, maybe Dubi and Zherdev could mesh well. Dawes/Callahan Dubi Zherdev. Dubinsky can control the puck along the boards very very well and can also bring it in on the rush, and for a bigger guy, he has some pretty good speed. I am expecting some big things from Dubi this year.

  76. Yeah Fritsche won’t become Graves but I think he has more potential than Voros or Rissmiller or even Sjostrom.
    RE lines, I like the idea I saw posted somewhere of Dubi w/Gomer and Zherdev, then Drury/Naslund/Callahan. Then Fritsche/Dawes w someone (PP/PR/FS/AV), and Betts/Shanny w someone. Shanny as a PK\PP specialist.

  77. sparky … i saw something similar (it had Prucha gone to make room for Shanny though)

    Dubinsky – Gomez – Zherdev
    Naslund – Drury – Dawes
    Fritsche – Rissmiller – Callahan
    Orr/Voros – Betts – Shanny/Sjostrom

    I really dont like Rissmiller, but apparently he is a decent PK guy, and someone on the Rangers staff thinks he has potential to offer him 1 million this year after scoring only 17 points last season? I think they signed him purely to have bigger bodies in the line-up, but i hear he doesnt really check anyone so whats the point then?

  78. we’re talking about favorite recent Ranger moments, and NOBODY mentioned when Marty shoved Avery in the crease, and Avery shoved him back? That was the game that made me an Avery fan and made me go out and get his jersey. One of the best recent images for ranger’s fans was Avery shoving, and Brodeur flopping on his ass, and ALMOST smacking his head on the crossbar on the way down.

  79. I posted a link (twice) to Jagr’s 1st goal over in Russia. Both posts ‘are awaiting moderation’. Not sure why. But if you CAN’T WAIT to see it, go check out the NY Times blog, or youtube.

    Glad to see the Nasty1 back. Kids are in school, so Nasty’s on the ‘net.

  80. Jeever – when you watch that on youtube all you see after Marty throws himself backward with such style is Prucha flying past, flat out like a missile. That whole thing cracks me up every time…

  81. Jeever
    You are right man! Avery’s single most valuable ( and entertaining) personality trait was that he gave no respect to anyone…not even fat-triple cup winning-crybaby Marty

  82. kaspar – im fine with shanny on the 4th line but don’t think renney has the stones to put him there.

  83. Yes, it is good to be back, I think. Not good to be back to work, but back to work means hockey is just around the corner.

  84. nakedjoe – I think your underestimating the impact that Jagr being gone will have BEHIND the bench this season.

    I don’t think there will be much of a choice but to move guys around on the bottom 2 lines (4th line especially) because of the number of players there are to fill those roles. I also don’t think it has as much of an impact as changing the top 2 around.

    I still think that there will be a trade sometime before 10/4. Nothing significant, but doesn’t it seem like there HAS to be?

  85. somerset zherdev may very well go back to Russia either way. can probably make a lot more money with no income tax

    uk ranger – Shanny is very likely to get hurt this yr as well at age 40. also you make out deferring his bonus to be a good thing. it is terrible since it affects the 09-10 season where allegedly we should be a bit better than this yr. so why do we want to start in the hole just for the privledge of watching shanny slowly skate arund the ice this yr

    shanny at $ 2.5 mm per yr is a huge mistake – especially if a good amt gets deferred. but junior dolan and sather hear the fans and you can bet he’ll be back

  86. Nasty 1

    I got NHL 09 as well last night. Have u tried be a pro mode. its pretty absurd. u can even add ur own music. so when u score it will play the rangers goal song. sick game

  87. I actually think that Nasland and Gomez won’t mesh and that he’ll actually mesh with Dubi. Dawes imo will mesh with Gomez and score 30 goals this year. As far as Zherdev I think he’ll be much like Kovalev was here at times he’ll have moments of sheer brilliance and most of the times he’ll drive us crazy. More Jagr bashing by Beer. Hey Beer go take a luck at Renney’s record as coach with and without Jagr it’s rather stark. Renney owes a great deal of gratitude to Jagr for putting him on the Hockey map and getting him a nice new contract a few years ago.

  88. Jagr also saved Sather’s rep as even the Canadian media killed Sather for his sheer incompetance. That Carter for Jagr trades was one of the best and most lopsided deals ever.

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