Weekend extended


On this second day of a two-day mini-break for the Rangers — they return to the ice tomorrow — it’s time to look at what might be out there on the trade market.

If you haven’t seen it already, TSN has a “pretty good list of names”:http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/trade_deadline/feature/?fid=10439&hubname being mentioned in trade rumors (both Jaromir Jagr and Marek Malik are mentioned frrom the Rangers).Almost all, if not all, of those players will be unrestricted free agents at the end of the season.

And as enticing as some of the forwards might be — Mats Sundin, Marian Hossa, Vinny Prospal — I have to think the Rangers main priority right now is strengthening their backline.

Which is not to say Brian Campbell or Dan Boyle, the two most enticing options, are going to be in a Blueshirt anytime soon (although Tom Renney did talk this season about how much he loved coaching Boyle in the World Championships a few years back). Neither the Sabres nor the Lightning are going to give those players away for free. And given the Rangers stated intent of holding on to their most important young assets, there’s no way they’d part with a Brandon Dubinsky or Nigel Dawes for a player who could conceivably only be a Ranger for six weeks.

What about, Al Montoya you ask? Sadly, the former No. 1 draft pick seems to be regressing in Hartford, “having been eclipsed by the fairly obscure Miika Wiikman”:http://stats.theahl.com/stats/statdisplay.php?type=goalies&subType=6&season_id=12&&leagueId=4&lastActive=&singleSeason in recent weeks. Of course, that might mean the Rangers would be more willing to part with Montoya. But that also means his value has likely dropped since the start of the season.

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  1. Has anyone seen Al Montoya play? What’s the deal there? Just not as good as he was expected to be? Emotional checkout after never making it to the NHL (hey, he can thank his agent — if it didn’t cost so much to play him, maybe he’d be up)?

  2. Doodie Machetto on

    Lenny, Russian sports journalists are notorious liars. NOTORIOUS.

    Salty: “I think Jagr goes and we DEFINITELY make the playoffs playing a much different flavor of hockey down the stretch.”

    No. That’s even more ludicrous than saying we would make it with him.

    You clearly have a hatred of Jagr, which is fine, you’re entitled to that. But the fact of the matter is that the team has almost no offense, and no other line plays Jagr’s style except for Jagr’s. So all of a sudden, without Jagr on the team, the other lines that don’t produce are going to start producing? That makes no sense. The fact of the matter is that we were relying on Jagr to get 90+ pts this season. He is going to finish maybe with 60. That’s 30 goals he won’t directly help create, not to mention how many more opportunities for his linemates and other lines to score would open if he was an elite offensive threat.

    But do you think that the lines he doesn’t play on are going to miraculously start scoring more goals once he’s gone? Get real.

    Hate him if you want, but it doesn’t change the fact that no one on our team has 20 goals, and we have a hard time getting 3 in one game, and when we do, it always looks like at least one of them was a soft goal (i.e., Drury’s goal against the Caps)

  3. Doodie, I hear what you are saying, but that is kind of exactly what I’m getting at.

    What you said makes a lot of sense, but see if you can follow what I’m getting at here.

    Okay, Truth: Jagr only plays on his line.

    However, I think at this point the entity “Jaromir Jagr” has become a distraction in itself. Subconsciously, the players see thier captain/leader/superstar/whatever not producing. I feel that has a ripple effect over the long term… “Man, Jags can’t even do it…I guess I can’t either” *type* of thing. I feel that the team is still kind of in the mentality of waiting for him to wake up and then they all will be able to, and the menatlity that if your top guy isn’t going it doesn’t even matter what everyone else does.

    It’s been said all along. “As Jagr goes, so go we.” (FUCK that, by the way)
    TRUTH: If the team believes in this…then we are dead in the water until Jagr pulls a rabbit out of his hat.

    If you take him out of this equation, the whole dynamic of the New York Rangers changes dramatically.

    I don’t “hate Jagr”. It’s more a matter of wanting to see the next phase of NYR, where he’s not here to “rely on” anymore, and players start to take on their new roles. I sure as hell think this team makes the playoffs without Jagr.

  4. doodie – yes. 100% in the case of Montoya. I think you can make a case for that with lots of guys. I’m just going to use Prucha as an example. What if there’s teams out there that want him as a key part of a deal and next year he’s still here, getting more pp time, but still can’t find the net. Or for that matter, maybe next time the shoulder isn’t just a bruise.

    Just like we’ve been saying (using Dubi as the example), if you want something good, you have to give up something good. Just a matter of what piece of the puzzle is the right one at the right time.

    Personally, I’d like to see 1 of 2 guys brought in. Kaberle b/c he has a few years left on his deal. I know he has a ntc, but with the other czechs, he may waive it to come to NY. Or Liles, b/c he won’t cost us as much. I’d say Campbell, but that’s a LONG shot.

  5. salt – I know I have nothing to do with that conversation, I just want to drop in a thought if I may.

    We all hope that it’s not true that his subpar #’s rub off on the other guys. And I completely agree that the “entity: JJ” is a distraction. To add to your point (I think I am), you can look at him saying “my best year ever” or “going further in the playoffs” type things and see them not happening as a sign of extremely poor leadership. I think it’s heightened by the fact that we were spoiled with the type of leadership that Mess provided and NY has struggled to find that since Mess retired. When the “entity” moves on, regardless of how, I think we’ll see someone emerge…at least I hope so!

  6. Chris — My opinion, based on having seen him play quite a bit, is that Montoya’s main problem is his inability to maintain focus. He can be lights out one night, and give up 3 softies the next. I’ve seen goals scored on him where it appeared he was just staring off into space, not watching the puck or play around him at all. Technically, he’s a pretty sound goalie, it’s just the consistency issues he’s battling at this point.

    In the meantime, it’s been a pleasure to watch Wiikman come out of nowhere. He may have some technical flaws that need to be worked on, but he never gives up on a play and that and his athleticism allow him to make some pretty incredible stops.

    Lenny, that article you link to is nothing more than speculation and conjecture based on an interview Jagr did recently in which he said (as he has many times in the past) how much he enjoyed playing in Omsk and how he would like to return to play there at some point. That’s all.

  7. Doodie Machetto on

    Salty, OK, I’ll buy that maybe having the team rely on itself may help boost production a bit, but to say it goes on a tear and definitely makes the playoffs is a bit much. If the other lines pick up their production, I imagine it will only be enough to match or only slightly pass Jagr’s already existing production (about 40 pts so far, probably another 15-20 before the season is over). So it’ll be a wash, either way.

    I want Jagr traded, but only so we can start looking at next year. I do not want them to reach the playoffs, as I don’t think they are capable of winning, but making the playoffs would let Dolan raise ticket prices again. Also, the lower we fall, the better our pick will likely be.

  8. Doodie Machetto on

    “that Mess provided and NY has struggled to find that since Mess retired”

    Mess was a pretty terrible leader his second go round as well. Guaranteed the playoffs every season. Not once. We’ve been missing that leadership since he went to Vancouver. Truth be told, so was he.

    As for Jagr not leading, if you had said that to me last year, I would have disagreed, but I could have understood your argument. This year, I won’t buy it. Sure, he isn’t scoring. But I see him trying harder now than he has since he came to NY. The guy is really busting his balls on the ice. He skates hard, he is driving to the net, he’s fighting for pucks in the corners, all things he wouldn’t have been caught dead doing when he knew he could just bury it with a shot from the circles. He is even going to optional skates! If he weren’t trying, I would hate on him too. But that he is REALLY trying, that is why I still respect him, and what makes the fact that he can’t score so much sadder to watch.

    laurie, your description of Wiikman makes him sound like MA Fleury, so I’m not thrilled with his NHL prospects. BTW, just as a pat on my own back, did I not say the Pens would be a much better team WITHOUT him?

  9. Beer Me, I agree mostly except for the fact that even Messier came back here and abused his status and stayed around longer than he should have, forcing and pulling strings that he shouldn’t have.

  10. doodie, don’t forget that MA fleury is only 23 and still has plenty of time to develop into a solid goaltender.

  11. Beer Me,

    I’d like Campbell or Liles, even though I know some people for some reason don’t like Campbell. I follow the Sabres all the time and he reminds me of a less-talented Brian Leetch. People think hes a defensive liability but I dont see it. He knows when to step up and take the body and can rush the puck up the ice while getting back to prevent an odd-man rush the other way.

    Also Montoya’s stats aren’t that bad. Hes just inconsistent and I think its because hes still bitter he didn’t make the big club. He made it clear before the season that he thought he was ready after having 2 solid seasons in the AHL and when he didn’t make it, I think hes almost bored to be in the AHL now. Its his ego thats getting to him and its not helping him or the Rangers at this point.

  12. salt – totally. But he was smart enough not to ‘garuntee’ too much. He knew his role. I think if we accepted jags for the player he is now, and not his prime, we’d be having a different conversation.

    johnny – I don’t see it either. And he has some speed to get back when need be. The problem with bringing in Campbell is that we don’t have a dman to compliment his style very well.

  13. Doodie, regarding Mess you are right that he was a non-impact player in his final years with the Rangers.

    Not to mention that Brian Leetch also was far from the dominant player he was in the early to mid 90’s during his last few years here.

  14. Did that make sense about jags? I guess a lot of it has to do with salary and which line he plays on. Not that it should, but it does. I’d pay him $3mil to take shanny’s spot next year. But we still need a #1 RW. IMO Marion Hossa is the choice there.

  15. What are the chances Jagr has been playing with an injury that he has refused to disclose? Just a thought.

  16. Doodie, I don’t remember Dolan making any promises of not increasing ticket prices next year, no matter what happens this year. You always want your team to make the NHL playoffs, anything can happen.

  17. Doodie Machetto on

    22, No, he made no promises, but if they make the playoffs, its guaranteed they are going up. It’s too easy for him to justify it for him not to raise them.

    As for anything being able to happen in the playoffs, I’m sorry, but there is NO way this team wins the cup. If they squeak into the playoffs, it’ll be on the sole fact that the entire Southeast division is terrible.

    Better that they get a good pick in this year’s draft, which is very deep, than bow out in a round or two (in case round one is against the Debbies or Flyers, in which case the Rangers might win).

  18. See, I disagree. I think if the Rangers draw NJ, Philly, Montreal, whoever wins the Southeast, Boston, Buffalo they go to round 2, and even Pitts they’s probably beat. Only Ottawa would scare me in the first round. And since basically they’re the only team that scares me, I think the Rangers go until they run into Ottawa, and even then, who knows what happens?

  19. Jonny D,
    As someone who watched quite a bit of Montoya. I might have to agree that he seems bitter at not making the NHL this year. But if he learned anything from playing with Vally last year..he should know that you play hard every night whether its AHL or NHL..cuz when the time comes he has to be ready. And right now Montoya does not look ready for NHL skaters.

    Also,Wiikman is a very good athlete like Montoya. But the difference here seems to be focus. Montoya loses focus on the game or loses composure easily. Wiikman however seems to thrive on it.

    To me- A good NHL goalie needs 3 things – solid Mechanics,good athlete,fearless mind. Montoya has 2 out of the 3. His mind seems week and easily rattled. And that alone can prevent someone from becoming a strong NHL goalie..especially with larger crowds,TV viewers,reporters,more pressure etc..that the NHL brings.

  20. It will definitely be interesting to see who gets the captain and alternate designations next season because there is the possibility that all of the players who currently hold those positions will be gone. Obviously, Drury will be one since he’s the first alternate to the alternates now, and I would guess Gomez would be another. I wonder if the third could go to Dubinsky or Staal or would it be a free agent that we bring in (since you know we will probably be signing some known player)?

  21. Someone just mentioned that Jagr maybe is playing with an injury that he has not disclosed. I had the oddest dream the other night and I found Jagr in the lockeroom with a bulge coming out of his back. Seriously I really had this dream, so if we find out a month from now that he has a herniated disk or something you will all think I has ESP.

    But seriously while the dream happened, I don’t think he would have gone this long playing this bad and not said ok maybe I need to get better. If he is hurt, and he is still playing, he needs to sit down because he is seriously hurting the organization.

  22. Next years captain IMO. I’d like to see Gomez get the C but we all know that it’ll be Drury because of his “experience”. So that leaves Gomez and … Well I personally think an A should go to Avery. The guy really wants to succeed here but I’m also a big Avery fan so maybe I’m a little biased.

  23. Staal or Dubi as an A? Come on.

    If Rozy stays, I think he’d be eligible for an A. If not, I could see Girardi possibly getting one. Def not a sophmore though. I’m big on having both an offensive A and a defensive A, unless your C is a defenseman in which case I think it’s good to have your two A’s as forwards…make sense?

  24. I love Gomez, and I wouldn’t mind having him be captain. The guy is always good with the media. But I wish he wouldn’t always have that goofy look on his face. He always looks like someone is tickling his balls with a feather or something.

  25. “To me- A good NHL goalie needs 3 things – solid Mechanics,good athlete,fearless mind. Montoya has 2 out of the 3. His mind seems week and easily rattled. And that alone can prevent someone from becoming a strong NHL goalie..especially with larger crowds,TV viewers,reporters,more pressure etc..that the NHL brings.”

    I agree. I think all the hype around him made him kind of full of himself and he sees guys he played with in the World Juniors from 2004 playing in the NHL and feels he should be there. Thats actually his downfall. I think if he had a better attitude, he’d be up in the NHL by now, whether it be backing up Henke or playing elsewhere.

    Beer Me,
    I stated the possibility of signing Hossa, Campbell, and a defenseman to go along with Campbell when the upcoming offseason comes up if/after we let go all of the older guys. With Henke supposedly signing for only 6 mil, it frees up even more room. People say they dont want Hossa for the fact that he’ll become just like another overpaid UFA star, which I can agree with, but at the same time hes younger than the other guys we got except Gomez.

    I know that watching Campell in Ranger blue will bring back memories of Brian Leetch. Will he turn into Leetch? of course not, but hes still pretty talented and not as bad of a defensive player as some people think. We sign a big d-man in the offseason and I think they could work well together.

  26. Almost forgot, the reason why we signed free agent busts before is A)we overrated the hell out of them by the contract we gave them and/or B) they were older and past their prime. today with players reaching UFA status at 27, most UFAs you sign won’t turn into busts because they have just blossomed into a great NHL talent and still have another 3-4 years that they’ll probably play at that level. I know its different in NY because of the media, but signing a guy like Hossa, especially for the fact that we already have Marcel, might not be such a bad idea since he’ll be 29 going into next season, unlike the 32 year old guys we used to get. May not seem like much, but those 3 years could make a huge difference.

  27. I obviously know Gomez has won more cups. I was being sarcastic seeing as how Drury is everyones golden boy but I’m not sold on that shit. He can be as clutch as he wants but he failed to get his team over the hump in Buffalo and he only won one cup with Colorado with a huge supporting cast.

  28. Enough of who’s gonna get traded and who we’re gonna get and who will wear the C next year,Let’s first sign Hanrik,and Avery.Any news on that ?????????????

  29. touche on the supporting cast. I guess what I’m trying to say yet again is that I believe Drury is always the first choice for the C but I’m not sold on him. I’m not a huge Drury hater right now seeing as how he is producing finally I’m just saying I’ve never jumped on his bandwagon. However I am a huge Gomez fan as I’ve sad before I admired him from afar these last several years. So I think being in this area having watched Gomez develop I feel he’s a better choice for captain for the Rangers organization.
    Nasty 1 February 12th, 2008 at 1:25 pm

    I love Gomez, and I wouldn’t mind having him be captain. The guy is always good with the media. But I wish he wouldn’t always have that goofy look on his face. He always looks like someone is tickling his balls with a feather or something.

    Don’t we all wish we could have that feeling all day. At least I do.

  30. Perhaps Montoya’s poor play has something to do with his feeling the futility of knowing he’ll never have a chance to be the Rangers #1 goalie. With Henriq in the picture for the next 10 plus years, it’s clear he’s got no shot here and he knows it, so why bother to bust his ass toiling for lowly Hartford? Somebody will take a shot with him, and I’m pretty sure he’ll be a good if not great NHL goalie in the future. Probably come back to haunt the Rangers as well.

  31. Salty – makes perfect sense on the D/O A, no pun intended. But I don’t see why we shouldn’t let one of our “farmed” players be an alternate? I can’t see Prucha getting it, maybe Tyutin (the senior member of that group)? I don’t know who’s loud in the locker room, maybe Sam could fill us in. We probably shouldn’t have Gomez and Dubinsky because they both look goofy to me, but in a good way of course! I could still see Straka coming back next season, since he plays a smart game.

    I wonder if the management expected Prucha, after his first two seasons, to become the first line right wing to replace Jagr. Obviously, that doesn’t look like the case now, so they drafted Cherepanov, but there’s no guarantee he will be in the NHL next year. If Jagr somehow turns it around over the last 20+ games, there’s little doubt in my mind that he will be re-signed if he wants to come back, since he is the captain and we have nobody to replace him. I don’t endorse it now, and I still don’t think I would if Jagr started playing better based on the facts everybody else has been bringing up. I’m just trying to focus on *reality.*

  32. Someone needs to sit Montoya down and tell him you are never going to be part of the big team so start tearing it up in the AHL so we can hopefully move you to where you will be.

  33. Doodie Machetto on

    I’d take Gomez as Captain over Drury, especially if the talk about him getting in Malik’s face is true.

    As for alternates, Drury obviously gets one, and I’d give the other to Blair Betts.

  34. I can’t remember whose rumors were pretty trustworthy during the summer, but now we know to trust *joejoe315,* even if he can’t spell *Henrik* correctly. Now, don’t take advantage of that trust!

  35. In order to make a deal, wouldn’t the GM need to be out of his coma and breathing on his own? Anybody home Glen?

  36. Doodie – Good idea on Betts; I forgot about him. But isn’t he someone who we know is very quiet? Or is he just quiet about being injured, like Sam & Joe were saying the other day?

  37. Doodie Machetto on

    Even if he’s quiet, he is a good lead by example type. The guy gives 110% every night.

  38. Spidey~

    I’m ALL for having system guys wear the letters, I just don’t think Dubi or Staalsy have any leadership value at this time… in the future, absolutely. But honestly, whos going to listen to what those two baby faces have to say in the lockerroom?!

  39. I dont think we should sign Hossa and probably not Campbell unless it is affordable, but if Henrik’s reported deal is accurate, we would have three players accounting for about $18 million, so I don’t think it then makes sense to sign Hossa and Campbell for another $12 or 13 million a year. I don’t think we could afford both. Campbell may be a good offensive defenseman and even if I am underrating his defensive skills, I still think we need a bruising defensive defenseman to play with Staal or Sanguetti

    and Beer you are right, if Jagr was given the ice time of a third liner then I don’t think people would be that upset. But he, like Messier before him, is given the ice time of a star player.

    And the organization has certainly not given Prucha the opportunity to develop into a first line right wing. I think ideally he is a number two wing, but Renney and Sather have done nothing but hurt his development in how they have managed his play the last two years. He may be having a bad year, but if he had 8 or 9 more minutes of ice time a night, inlcuding a regular shift on the powerplay, I think his numbers would be very similar to Jagr’s, at least in goals.

  40. Doodie Machetto on

    I think the only system guy we had that would have been credible with an A on the sweater at this point was Orty. I wanted him to have it last season. Man, I miss him.

  41. not to change the subject but I remember there were allot of ranger fans that wanted Sheldon Souray in the free agent market. Thank god we didn’t sign him, he is out for the rest of the season.


  42. Doodie, you are silly. Jed Ortmeyer: 46 GP this year, 4g, 3a, +/- is -8…..yeah really miss him a lot. Guy had hands of frickin stone. Just what we need, another 4th liner with no fights to his credit. Yeah he blocked shots but so does Betts. This team does not need Ortmeyer. No frickin way. Hossa should play if we want someone like that.

    If Montoya doesn’t have the brains to realize that he has to light up the AHL to get to the NHL than he is a dumb mofo who we don’t want or can’t use anyway. Cliff, if you think he is dogging it because he realizes his future in the NYR organization than that is the dumbest thing I ever heard.

    I have been away for a bit, what is the story with Shanny? And are Malik and Hossa both healthy scratches?

  43. I’d like to see Bettsy get an A. I was very skeptical of his play after the lockout, but he’s grown to be one of my favs. All heart there. If he only had hands.

    pete – I don’t know if Jags is willing to accept a ‘demotion’. At least his ego won’t accept it. That said, next season could be a fresh start. Ya never know.

    pig – I think brooks meant he was finshing stroking. nice.

  44. newman – malik/hossa got healthy on friday or so. They were technically healthy scratches for the weekend games. Shanny’s leg, hip, etc needed rest. Just old bones. He’s resting up for the stretch.

  45. It shouldn’t matter if he will accept it or not, that has always been this team’s problems with big names. They let them call the shots, when it should be the coach and gm who tell the players what to do.

  46. Well, the MSG announcers never really were sure if Hossa was off the IR or not. Malik was definitely a healthy scratch for Sunday, but I think Sam said he was still injured too much for Saturday.

  47. Doodie Machetto on

    They may have hurt Prucha’s development, offensively, but he has gotten a lot better on the other side of the puck this season, which I think is important for him and for us as a team moving forward. That is the only silver lining to this cloud. Maybe he can rediscover his hands when he gets more icetime. But at the same time, in giving him more ice time, we won’t have to worry about him being irresponsible defensively.

    As far as UFAs go this summer, there aren’t any I’d really be interested in, not for their price anyway. There are RFAs I would like, but none that would actually be feasible.

  48. Doodie Machetto on

    New Newman, I was suggesting that we should’ve kept Ortmeyer as opposed to someone useless like Hollweg. Ortmeyer would throw his body around, except he wouldn’t take stupid penalties when he did. And he kills penalties.

  49. Newman – You should learn how to read and comprehend. I didn’t say Montoya is dogging it. I said he is probably down on himself and the organization because he realizes he’s got no chance to ever beat out Henrik. My guess is that your SAT score wasn’t too high.

  50. Beer ME,
    You want Betts to get an ‘A’? He’s only good at penalty killing, which Renny uses him less than he did in the past, and face offs and even those stats are down…granted he understands the game but he has no imagination, no hands, he’s cardboard

    Re Montoya…yeah we messed him up big time…with top grade prospects you can’t put them in the AHL with no timetable when he’s gonna get called, and with Lundquist obviously our goalie of the future, even he knows he’s playing for a shot at the NHL at another cllub…but he’s done all he can do at the AHL level, anyother club would’ve had him the NHL…for his sake, I hope he gets traded so he can make his mark on th leaguge whatever it may be…I feel bad for him…and for us, we wasted good trade value, so this is a lose-lose situation

  51. Salty – Only because I am busy with tests and homework this week.

    Alex – I hope he plays in the NHL for the sake of one of my fantasy teams. Otherwise, since he seems like such a pouter, I really don’t care.

  52. Cliff..you are talking about SAT scores you must be in high school or something you dope. Call me when your babysitter leaves, I will come over and show you how I scored in “Asswhooping of high school students.”

    BTW, who the F is Henriq? Is that some fag version of Henrik? Hank or Henry, but Henriq? Use your spellcheck or “ballscheck” while you are studying for your SATs.

    If Montoya is down on himself and can’t play hockey because someone is better than him than that’s even more of a reason we don’t want him. So if your theory is right then it’s even more of a reason to dump that guy.

    Tell Montoya there is a little boy named Cliff who needs a baybsitter….maybe its a better alternative than having to work hard and earn your stripes in the minors before getting to the NHL.

  53. One thing I would like to focus a little of the attention on, is that hockey players have a specific value. This value can be looked at as deriving revenue. This revenue comes from ticket sales and advertising. A player’s value is determined by how he will impact revenue. This can happen by contributing to wins, and by having positive effects external to the actual playing of the game.

    When a GM evaluates a player, he will need to look at it this way:

    Will this player produce more revenue than the available alternatives?

    Will the costs of employing the player outweigh the revenue the player generates?

    What mix of players do I believe will maximize revenue this season, without compromising the team’s future ability to generate revenue?

    Think like this, and ask yourself what you would do as GM.

  54. Do we know if Montoya is sulking on the bench? I haven’t heard anyone from hartford saying that he is whining, but maybe…he should be upset, he’s got a right to be…

    This from Dom Haske from Kuklas’ website

    ‘’We have lots of passers, lots of skilled players who can pass the puck, that’s why it wouldn’t hurt to get one player who can have one-timer on the power play, something like that,’’ Hasek said.

    Sounds like they miss Shanny, eh?

  55. Newman – You live in your fantasy world. The dumbest thing you ever heard was the story your parents told you about the day they decided to conceive your stupid ass. If your father wasn’t drunk and high on coke 15 years ago you wouldn’t be here. The Best part of you rolled down your mother’s leg. Too bad – the world would have been a much better place without you.

  56. Also did anyone watch the game on versus last night. I’m a huge Renney supporter so I shouldn’t bring this up. But everyone always say he doesn’t get loud blah blah blah. Well I will say Gretzky is more vocal now than he was during his playing career. The Yotes got f’d on a call and he turned purple he was yelling so much. I thought of all of the Renney haters and meant to tell it to you earlier. I found it kind of funny that the Great One who was never really a screamer in his playing days looked like a taller slender Don Cherry last night.

  57. Cliff…high school is too old for you. I have been a Ranger fan longer than you have been alive, that much is proved from your last response, because I can’t tell if you are 12 or 14. You just basically told a “Mother” joke on a blog. Dude, calling you a high schooler is an insult to high school students.

    Nice to know intelligent conversations can be had on this blog and then also, for the humor factor, we can read Cliff’s “favorite lines from cutting up the other middle schoolers.”

    I tell you that your opinion about Montoya is shite and you come back with a “Mother” joke. Classic. Next you will throw a Hellen Keller joke at me.

    Cliff, I have seen your entries on this blog maybe 3x this past year. 1 of them talked about Montoya. The other two talked about “Mother” jokes at me.

    Great contributions Cliff. You’re wise beyond your years.

  58. Montoya has been good when he is on. He has suffered from back issues this year, which not only has kept him out of games but forced him to be a scratch.

  59. update on Montoya:

    “The other significant story line from Wednesday’s win was Al Montoya’s return to the net for the first time in two-and-a-half weeks, after Miika Wiikman had started six straight and earned the Pack at least a standings point in his last eight appearances. Montoya took hold of the opportunity and put up a Second Star-worthy performance, stopping 22 out of 23 shots for his 12th victory of the season.”

  60. tomg February 12th, 2008 at 4:33 pm

    Hockeypuckz February 12th, 2008 at 4:25 pm

    Shanny for Cleary?

    Good try, unfortunately cleary is out with a broken jaw.

    Hockeypuckz February 12th, 2008 at 4:25 pm


    I heard that during the game on Sunday. I didn’t know the player had to be healthy to be traded? He’s a UFA anyway so I don’t know that they would look at someone like him anyway. Just throwing it out there for discussion.

  61. New Newman
    Ortmeyer is a heart and soul kinda player. Kinda like Dominic Moore. He won’t produce offensively but he’ll do so much more. Plus he gets the team energized by throwing his body around, being great on the PK, forechecking extremely well and stuff like that. You could have a 3rd line that does that and a 4th line of goons that just is out there to fight. I see no problem with that since its what we’ve had for the last 2 seasons.

    If we drop Jagr, Straka, Shanny and the older guys and go for a fresh new look, we have like 24 million to spend if the Lundqvist deal is true. If he gets more like 7 or 8 then its 22 mil to deal with. After RFA’s get signed like Avery, Hossa, Tyutin and some of the AHL guys, I’d say we’d have maybe 17 or 18 left to spend. We’d already have a full roster except a forward position or 2 and a defensive spot or 2. We can fill some with guys from hartford and fill the others with UFAs like Hossa and Campbell. After signing those 2 we’d probably have anywhere from 4-5 million left to spend.

  62. Doodie Machetto on

    “And I would argue that an opposing team fears us more with Hollweg than Ortmeyer”

    And I would argue that no team fears us with Hollweg in the lineup either, so we might as well have something worthwhile in his place.

  63. It’s a shame that Byers didn’t get second game in after the Hollwweg suspension. I know it was one game but Renney could have sat him for another just go give the kid a look.

  64. Hockeypuckz – Playerz have to pass a phyzical when they are traded, which I guess Cleary could do with a broken jaw, but he is scheduled to be out for two monthz and a UFA at the end of the seazon, so of what use would he be to us? We can haz Shannyz!

    (*Spiderpig* just having a little fun)

  65. then id guess id rather have campbell, i don’t really want hossa and he will probably want around 7 or 8 per for five or six years

  66. Pete

    I took that into account. I figured that Hossa would want around 8 and Campbell would get about 6. I could actually see Hossa and Gomez doing well together and you never know, maybe he’ll turn Marcel into some assist making freak. haha. I doubt it, but them two playing together would be an advantage for the fact that they grew up playing together.

    The thing is if we get campbell, where are we gonna spend the other 12 million? I mean I’d like Liles too then maybe a checking defenseman, but that would be maybe 6 max to get both of those. I dunno where else we could pick someone up for another 6. I’d like Vermette but as stated before hes probably not moving now because of Ottawa’s recent trade. I’ll have to check the UFA’s and RFA’s for the following year, but we’d have a lot of money left that we could spend. If Hossa is out there and we can see him fitting into whatever system we’re running at the time, then I think getting him is a smart move. However if we feel he won’t fit in, then we should spend that money elsewhere or save it up to sign guys like Dubi and Dawes to new deals when they are RFA’s the following year (actually Dawes is an RFA this year I think).

  67. Alex – Hands don’t equal an “A”. Did Kisio have hands? He had a “C”!!! #’s don’t equal A’s or C’s either.

    newman – “the fag version of Henrik?” that was absolutely priceless, I’m giong to laugh about that for a while!

    pete – didn’t think you were attacking ealier.

    prucha27 – good point about Madonna..oops Modano. But slats is not the GM of dallas.

    hockeypuckz – I saw it to and I’m with you on the entire thing(renney supporter here too). However…he yelled, yes. But the refs didn’t overturn any calls. It doesn’t have the effect that people think. And if it were anyone other than Wayne, there probably would have been a bench minor called anyway. PHX got robbed at the end of that one.

  68. I think if there is a time to sign Campbell it is now. Whether he’s aquired via trade or signed in July. He doesn’t appear to be in the mindset of being a “hotshot” in the nhl yet. After he gets $6mil/8yrs he’ll change like the rest of them.

    I think Liles is a decent choice at this point. Not going to carry any team by a long shot, but an upgrade to our blueline for sure.

  69. How about Commodore for like $2.5 million. Would he be the solid banging d-man the Rangers need, or another Malik?

  70. Beer Me,

    I was saying points or good hands = Captaincy…but you have to provide enough on the ice to be considered a leader, as well as in the locker room and on the bench…what 4th line player is given the Captaincy to any NHL team anyway?…Renney doesn’t , nor should he, stand at the bench and say
    “Everyone is playing like a dog today…well fellas…you want some inspiration…Watch Blair Betts…watch Blair Betts…”

    we’ve got lots of leadership, alot of people are saying give the captaincy to Gomez, but he smiles way too much on the ice, which sounds rediculous I know but I like more ferocity, maybe with Messier we’ve seen what the ultimate captain is made up of and we’ll never reach that again, but they need to have similar qualities, I need a serious leader, I’d take Drury over Gomez…but Shanny would actually get it over him if I had to choose right now, the guy is a hockey legend, although yes past his prime…in no shape or form do I put Jagr as my captain…Straka would get an A, never the C, no D-men get anything unless everyone is hurt and then I’d reluctantly give Rosival the A.

    Anyone hear the rumor of Holik going to the Devils? Not sure how old this rumor is, just heard it recently…

  71. “The Yotes got f’d on a call and he turned purple he was yelling so much. I thought of all of the Renney haters and meant to tell it to you earlier. I found it kind of funny that the Great One who was never really a screamer in his playing days looked like a taller slender Don Cherry last night.”

    I see Gretzky a lot now; every day he comes closer to being Sam Kinneson.

    Anyway, you remember that game in Minnesota when Renney argued that a player on Minny ( I forget who)should be penalized for nearly decapitating Prucha? The Ref gave him a unsportsmanlike conduct-bench penalty….I swear ever since then he just stands there shaking his head and never says anything to the refs. Think about it; when is last time yo saw him verbalize…he was never very good at it and I think that Minny game completley shut him up….anyone remember that game??

  72. I hate to say this, but I would love to see the Islanders break out of their slump tonight for one game only.

  73. Doodie Machetto on

    Man, you people are naming the worst choices of UFAs. Liles is not very good, nor is he really what we need on defense. Hossa has good regular season numbers, but he is a perpetual no show in the playoffs. When Marcel Hossa outplays you in the playoffs, you’ve got trouble. Campbell and Boyle are offensive D-men: Staal and Sanguinetti will be those for us, why throw our money away on them. Here is a legitimate list of FAs we should be interested in, in alphabetical order of current team:

    1) Niklas Hagman, F Dallas
    2) Daniel Cleary, F Detroit
    3) Branislav Mezei, D Florida
    4) Trent Hunter, F NYI
    5) Mike Commodore, D Ottawa
    6) Jason Smith, D Philadelphia
    7) Radim Vrbata, F Phoenix
    8) Ryan Malone, F Pittsburgh
    9) Brooks Orpik, D Pittsburgh
    10) Barret Jackman, D St. Louis

    And they should also be in the market for a backup goaltender, these are ranked in my order of preference, matching skill against probable salary demand:

    1) Patrick Lalime, Chicago
    2) Alex Auld, Boston
    3) David Aebischer, Phoenix

    These three will all want starter money, and in the case of Huet and Kolzig, will only sign somewhere to be a starter. But, in the event they could be had for 1.5 mil or less and are willing to be a back up:

    4) Ty Conklin, Pit
    5) Cristobal Huet, Mtl
    6) Olaf Kolzig, Was

  74. Doodie Machetto on

    Alex, Iginla is all smiles a lot of the time. I’d argue that he is probably the best captain in the NHL right now(an argument can be made for Sakic, but no one else).

    Since when is smiling and having fun while you play a bad thing? Do you see Ovechkin everytime he scores a goal? Do you think he would be a better or worse player if he didn’t have that enthusiasm?

  75. I take it back after further review of the standings and and games played against each other. Go Philly.

  76. Doodie Machetto on

    Kaspar, you’re in Russia, so we can sign you at any point. We wouldn’t need to wait until the offseason. There was no disrespect intended.

  77. Next year Doodie; I’ll be a little cheaper no? But!! no less handsome…

    lets go Ottawa!
    Lets go Canes!
    Lets go lightning
    lets hope for earthquake in Nassau—can’t root for either them

  78. I mean “I wasn’t saying good hands or point= Captaincy”..

    Holy Sh$t…Detroit has 192 goals for, which with Ottawa at 196 is above by a good margin any other team, and only 126 goals against, by far and away the lowest in the league…goddamn

  79. alex – I have no idea what smiling has to do with being a captain of an nhl franchise. I don’t need to know either.

    “Liles is not very good, nor is he really what we need on defense.”

    Unfortunately though, he is an “upgrade”.

    Kaspar – you handsome devil, I remember that game in ‘Minny’ when Gaborick lit us up for 5. I also remember a game, I believe it was last season that Torts was letting the Ref have it @ MSG, and got tossed. I just don’t get the yelling at officials thing. It’s a detriment these days. At the players, sure.

  80. Doodie Machetto on

    Prucha, there are a few wings there with 20 +goals. That’s five more than Jagr right now.

    But being a little bit fairer, Marion Hossa has 24 g and 25a. Cleary has 20 and 20, and had good numbers in the playoffs last season. Vrbata has 20 and 18. So the numbers are comparable. Hagman a bit less so with 20 and 12.

    Now, granted, none of these guys are top tier forwards, but they are all solid guys to have while we wait for a true #1 wing to present himself. As far as I’m concerned, if we can get 3 or 4 guys who can all chip in 20 goals, that would be much better than what we have right now: an entire team of guys who can’t.

    And as I said before, Hossa is a perpetual no show in the playoffs. If Cleary has a good playoffs (assuming his jaw heals in time) I think he should be our target at forward. Vrbata is young, has a lot of potential, and is improving every season. Hunter and Malone I mentioned for size. Hagman was for speed, great two way play, and versatility (he plays both sides).

    Besides from Hossa, there aren’t any 1st line wings on the market anyway, and I think if we’re gonna cash in on one, we should wait until he its worth it. I don’t think Hossa is worth it.

  81. Rank these players in order of IMPORTANCE to their teams. Explain:

    Player P/G Age Cap Hit
    Daniel Alfredsson 1.49 35 $4,414,000
    Jarome Iginla 1.21 30 $7,000,000
    Shane Doan 0.98 31 $4,550,000
    Jaromir Jagr 0.8 35 $4,950,000
    Bill Guerin 0.56 37 $4,500,000
    Jamie Langenbrunner 0.82 32 $2,800,000

  82. Prucha27…good point with Buchberger, but he was of a different lot that Betts…everybody respected Buchberger, Betts is a marginal NHL player, Renney actually does a good job using what little talen Betts has to be best of his ability…Betts obviously is well coached, stays in the system but offers nothing else…why am I talking about Betts so much? Oh right…Beer Me wanted him as team Captain

    Whatever happened to barett jackman, he was turning his heads his rookie year and now it seems like the Blues are disappointed in his play…there was Bouwmeester too, I don’t hear anything about him, his stats look pretty good though

  83. Rank these players in order of IMPORTANCE to their teams. Explain:

    Player—–P/G—–AgeC—–Cap Hit

  84. Vrbata is finally having a good year after flopping elsewhere, I say stay away from him, we don’t need those types…

    Beer Me- There’s something different about Gomez’s personality that is personified with his smiling, even on the MSG pregames shows they’ll have, he just seems very young for a guy in his late 20’s…I woulnd’t be pissed if he ever had the C, but I’d have my favorites over him…and if you ever hear Gomez in an interview, he’s a train wreck he just spews out words, makes no point, mumbles incoherently the typical hockey cliches, repeats “Yeah I don’t know” a million times, I cringe everytime he gives one…it’s not an ultimate necessity, but for fan purposes and media relations, it’d be nice if the captain was articulate publically

  85. Lenny I just read something over at our favorite site bb, and dubi is sayinf he heard jagr say what you were trying to show some of these ingrates. So I guess you shouldn’t take a break as you were asked but instead keep informing us at least the ones that count when you hear or see something. Great going big guy

  86. Doodie Machetto on

    And just so you know, here are some of the forwards who will potentially be UFA next summer:

    Zetterberg, Lecavalier, the Sedin twins, Gaborik, Cammalleri, Horcoff, and most importantly, Manny Malhotra.

    And a few from the year after that:

    Kovalchuk, Frolov, Holmstrom, Jokinen, and Hejduk(although, he might be circling the drain by then)

    And that’s not to mention any RFAs that can’t be signed to long term deals by their respective clubs. So, instead of handcuffing ourselves with Hossa, why not take a risk at landing a better player?

  87. Doodie Machetto on

    “Vrbata is finally having a good year after flopping elsewhere,”

    Are you serious? The guy is 26. His numbers have gone up every season since and including the year since the lockout. He has already passed his career high in pts and goals this year. The guy is on the up and up. Lock him in now for a few years at like 2.5-3 mil and it’ll be a steal.

  88. As a long time observer of amateur, college and professional hockey, I have had ample opportunity to see Montoya play. While he did win the 2004 u20s, it might be said that actually Fleury lost. I think this was shown when Montoya had a less than stellar performance in the worlds the following year. When his performance was subpar in MI, it was said he was bored. Perhaps his numbers are a factor of the team in front of him as through the years he has always had a good defense in front of him. Now he is bored in Hartford?

  89. I’m not sold an Sangunetti yet. I know kids that played with him and he wasn’t really anything special until the last 2 years he played. I’m not saying he’ll be bad, but it would be nice to pick up a Campbell or a Liles while we wait for him to develop in the NHL. Plus those guys could probably teach him something too.

    And Prucha is no way a 1st line winger. He’s good, but hes not that good. Us as Rangers fans overrated him a lot based on his first season. Hes not a winger that can dominate the game. Most of his goals are from in front of the net. I’d like to have a 1st line winger that can go one on one with someone and control the play. I know Gomez like to carry the puck, but we could still have a winger that might not be like Jagr, but can hold the puck rather than just crash the net and score.

  90. Ya know if a goalie can’t be a top goalie in the AHL, on a pretty decent team, how can you expect him to be better at the NHL level? And to say that it’s the Rangers fault Montoya is not an NHL goalie seems a bit far fetched.

    At some point doesn’t a player become responsible for his development? I mean it’s not as if Montoya has been riding the pine, the team was pretty much given to him, it’s been his job to lose as far as I’m concerned.

  91. Vrbata- 4th team in 5 years…this year is his first year of putting things together…maybe there’s something year, I remember when he was with Colorado he was a young player with a lot of potential, but is he one of thsoe players you have to coax to play well? I wouldn’t want him though…

    If you’re looking at AHL numbers to determine an NHL Callup…Cloutier just got called up in LA and his AHL stats were over 3 goals against and less than 900 save percentage…not watching these guys plays I just wonder what says “Alright, he’s finally ready”…but Montoya’s numbers are way better than those

    it’d be nice if we had some cushion where we could give Lundquist a break in March or so play Montoya if nothing else just to showcase him, see what he has…

  92. Anyone know what kind of player Sanguinetti is…I know he’s an offesneive d..but does that mean good outlet passes, good on the point…can he lead the rush, carry the puck, go end to end, does he have speed? and importantly, can he handle his own zone, play the body?…

    my biggest fear from what I’ve read is that he could be a Tom Poti…

  93. Prospect report:


    The big defenseman still needs to work on becoming stronger physically and on the puck, but he has shown real growth in the area of his defensive play.
    Good skater with … good agility and balance … he makes hard accurate outlet passes, sees the ice well and is able to move the puck through traffic … a big guy who is effective with his long reach[;] he uses the poke check to strip opponents … will be more successful when he learns to use his size more.” – NHL Central Scouting-

    He needs to focus more on the play in his own zone, playing smarter, stronger, and tougher in his own defensive end.

  94. zg settle down with that graph

    salt skrote.. you have to be kidding me.. rozy with a letter?? watch him play next game. He f’in sucks as a defensemen.

    new newman..classic domination of the pre teen cliff..poor lil bastard

  95. I’ve watched Sanguinetti play for the Wolfpack; pretty good. A lot more responsible in his zone than people give him credit for and kept the puck in the offensive zone on the PP, made some dashing moves on bad passes to do so. He’s gonna be fine.

    Trent Hunter; always been a fan. Imagine a line of him/Avery/Callahan…brutal to play against.

  96. Ergh, it makes me cringe when I read prospect reports of Sanguinetti, they all sound like Tom Poti and I hate to a an irrational degree, Tom Poti…

    Trent Hunter…that’d do…but he’s kind of up there in years isn’t he…let’s just hope Avery gets resigned…I’d be pissed if he goes somewhere else…

  97. Poti wasn’t that bad. He was just kinda soft, but his offensive abilities were pretty good. I mean hes done pretty well since leaving and has always played well against the Rangers. I feel like if he was more confident about him rushing the puck up the ice, he’d be 20 times better. And like I said, lets not put the mortgage on Sangunetti yet, he’s got a lot to learn. I’d rather him play in the minors another year or 2 and sign a guy thats been consistent over the last couple of years.

  98. JD is saying it’s not official, but will be by tomorrow maybe. He’s a NYR for at least 6 more years. Now sign Avery before Saturday.

  99. Doodie Machetto on

    They overpaid by a million. I thought the point of resigning him to this one year deal at such a high salary was so that he would discount us later. 5.5 million is about right, given that he has been mediocre for half of the season.

  100. Doodie Machetto on

    As for Avery, let him walk. He’s starting to turn into the Avery that we were warned about. Sign Trent Hunter instead.

  101. Yeah I’m not sold on Avery being that much of a difference maker anyway. He’s gonna want a lot more money and he’s not worth it. I like him as a player, but he hasn’t done all that much in our lineup to make us a better team aside from taking peoples attention away from the game. Maybe it worked last year, but this year it hasn’t done all that much.

  102. Alex – We see the tangibles of being a captain differently for sure.

    “and if you ever hear Gomez in an interview, he’s a train wreck he just spews out words, makes no point, mumbles incoherently the typical hockey cliches, repeats “Yeah I don’t know” a million times, I cringe everytime he gives one…”

    Just like another guy wearing a ‘C’ right now…jags. How well you speak to the media should not bear on your ability to be a captain. The captain should make his players his 1st and only audience/priority. A lot of teams have a GM that doesn’t mind ‘getting there nose dirty’ with the media.

    I think in a post-Jagr NYR world, Gomer or Drury will be probably be named captain. Whichever it is, I’ll be happy.

  103. I still don’t see the *Henriq* deal confirmed anywhere…. link?

    Also, I thought I posted this last night, but sausage guy, don’t act so flabbergasted that I mention Rozy might be eligible for an A. *Marek Malik* wore the A for several games. Rozy is largely held as our “veteran defenseman” and likely the only UFA we’d be very interested in keeping. I don’t think the idea of him being our defensive captain is that far fetched at all.

    That’s also not to say thats what I *want*.

  104. Beer ME- Well, I have to assume, seeing nothing else (we don’t have video inside the lockerroom) that Gomez is uncomfortable speaking in front of a group… does he mumble and avoid eye contact when speaking to his teammates as a group? I don’t know for sure, but he does that outside the lockerrom…would you want that as your leader?…contrast that with Shanny, who answers questions completely, looks right at the interviwer or camera, obviously isn’t shy, you want a leader who doesn’t care what the situation is they’re going to be unnerved, confident, and know what to say at all times

  105. Alex seems more interested in a Captain that is for the fans than he is one that is good for the team. Looking more at superficial factors like someone who smiles on the ice and who gives good interviews, rather than someone who knows how to bring the best out of the his teammates.

  106. I’m a Lundquist fan, but 6.5/year is too much – especially for 6 years. I remember when players had to wait for unrestricted free agency for their payday. I sure hope Lundquist gets closer to his peak level and stays there.

    Sather’s hands are tied now for the next 6 years regarding a goalie. $39M over 6 years? Poor fiscal responsibility with the Rangers as usual.

    I hate to say it, but the Icelanders-DP deal sounds more reasonable to me now.

  107. Okay Alex, great point there too. To be honest, from what I’ve seen of the two of them, I would still take Gomez over Drury in that department any day of the week.

    What I like about Gomez is that he’s apparently not afraid to emote his differences with a team mate (or interviewer for that matter). For all his youthful smiling, he really does strike me as someone who does not take shit from people.

  108. doodie,
    I agree about lundqvist. I posted on here not to long ago that I would give lundqvist 5 yr’s 5 to 6 mil.

  109. lets go over who is full of shit so far:

    joejoe: promised announcement by yestersday = negative.

    Mark: says he “just saw” fox news story on a “Done Deal” = nothing on website = negative.

    brklynblue: “JD is saying it’s not official, but will be by tomorrow maybe” what does that even mean? Who is JD? John Davidson? Why the **** would he know anything, why would he comment on this before anyone else?

    “not official but officially tomorrow maybe. definitely maybe.”

    = negative’d

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