Renney: We have the horses


It has never been Tom Renney’s style to call out an individual on his team, so I wasn’t surprised when the coach stated today that the Rangers have the personnel to emerge from their latest crisis.

“You want to do it with who you brought to the dance,” Renney said today. “So if we don’t move a single person, I don’t have any problem with that whatsoever. I believe this team can win. There might not be a team in the league that can improve itself more by how they choose to play than the New York Rangers.”

Make no mistake: that’s not to say the Rangers aren’t snooping around, nor does it suggest that Renney would be opposed to Glen Sather providing the coach some new options.

But the coach, sounding very much like he did a year ago, made clear that the ability to turn things around was within the Rangers dressing room.

“I’m very comfortable with this group,” he said. “I think this is the challenge this team needed. And we’re all committed to rising up to it. It’s not going to happen overnight. A turnaround requires patience and a certain level of composure. I understand the sand is running through the hourglass. We have 33 games remaining and we have to win a significant amount of those to make the playoffs, but our goal is to be better every single game moving forward.

“If that doesn’t manifest itself I truly believe it’s not because we didn’t try or apply ourselves. I think the days of us beating ourselves are over.”
Of course, this is all well and good. I agree with Renney that the Rangers as they’re currently constructed have the most room for improvement of any team in the league (and that’s not a compliment, by the way). And based on what happened last year, there are reasons to think a similar turnaround is within them.

But what makes you worry are three areas:

<li>The team is getting outworked. It is an ominous sign when a team already in such a dire state can point to being outhustled as a reason they lose. There is no greater sin in professional sports than not trying, and while I think the Rangers effort isn’t so much lacking as it is misguided, they simply have to be the more urgent team moving forward.

<li>This isn’t the King from a year ago. We’ll see whether Henrik Lunddqvist emerges from his latest slump and returns to form. He was brilliant on Saturday and much less so yesterday. But the point is, the Rangers problems are either magnified or minimized depending on how well he plays.

<li>There isn’t another Sean Avery out there. Or even if there is, that’s not to say he will have the same affect on the Rangers. It wasn’t so much that Avery on his own answered all of the Rangers problems. It was more how his arrival changed the entire dynamic of the team at just the right time. That’s not something you can count on from one year to the next.

And besides, trades are hard. The prospects you cherish are the ones other teams want. And the ones you deem expendable aren’t going to fetch much in return.

And by the way, if you want to talk about trading the Captain, that’s a worthy discussion when assessing this team’s long-term future. But when talking about this season, despite what Mike Millbury might think, the Rangers are still a much more dangerous team with Jaromir Jagr than they are without him.

And that’s even taking into the account that Jagr has been a shell of himself so far this season.

More later..

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  1. Sam,

    The problem isin’t Henrik, I expect more from you.

    We know there is a problem when our beloved blog reporter starts putting one of the major problems the Rangers have on the goaltending.

    I don’t even have to list all the problems that are much worse than Henrik. We all know what they are.

  2. czechthemout!!!!! on

    Just what I expected from Renney.Blows alot of hot air and follows that up with a typicaly meek solution.The same old Renneyade being peddeled by this slick,snake oil salesman and is being eaton up by Sam.How unfortunate.Sam,you owe it to your loyal readers of this blog and your column to challenge this man disguised as a hockey coach.

  3. “I’m very comfortable with this group”

    *We noticed.*

    Chewin yer bubble gum like a cheerleader on the bench.

  4. I have to admit, that was hideous what Renney said. Basically,
    We will be watching the same brand of hockey we all been watching for most of the year. I just hope Sather doesn’t do something stupid and trade any of the rangers youth to try and make the playoffs because that will be worse than watching this team flounder for the rest of the season.

  5. “If that doesn’t manifest itself I truly believe it’s not because we didn’t try or apply ourselves. I think the days of us beating ourselves are over.” Tom Renney

    Prove it!

    “You want to do it with who you brought to the dance,” Renney said today.

    Does that include Malik?
    As far as Jagr goes, at least take away the “C”, he’s no Captain!
    Strip the “C” and use 3 assistant Captains.
    How many Captains, Generals, and Presidents have led by sulking around, gonna start calling him “Lurch”
    Step up already!

  6. I think it may have been geared towards motivating his players and making them believe that they are capable of it. I don’t think any of his comments were to make fans ease up on the idea that a trade won’t change the team.

  7. I’m just wondering why does Chris Drury get a free ride around here? What exactly has he done for this team? He killed the Rangers in the playoffs with the Sabres and he’s killing the team even more this season as a Ranger. Jagr on the other hand had one of the greatest seasons in Rangers history in 05-06 leading the team along with Henrik to the playoffs. After a subpar first half last year he again was opne of the main reasons the team made the playoffs last year and played well in the playoffs. Yes he’s had a subpar season but that is still better than Drury’s season. I swear you can cvount on one hand the number of good games he’s had. Nerve have you watched Lundqvist play the last six weeks? He’s giving up one or two bad goals a game.

  8. Let’s face it, When he has the fourth line out there when we are behind by a goal or two late in a game, with a faceoff guy and two checkers, then we know he has faith in this team. That time should be for the top three lines only, quick shifts for them, The Dubinsky line deserves more ice time then its been getting, its almost like that has turned into our fourth line.

    And if Renney throws Hollweg/Betts/Orr out there on another power-play, he should be fired on the spot. I realize that is supposed to be our energy line, but in clutch situations we need people who can score, not people to provide energy.

  9. Nice to know that Tommy Boy’s tough guy talk lasted all but a few hours before retreating back into his shell…and good to know how confident he is in this group that has done little more than embarrass itself this season with nary a hint of passion.

    For all the Renney haters, this is just more fuel for the fire. The man hasn’t got a clue what to do with this team, that was obvious 6 weeks ago…

    About the only thing that’s changed is that Renney’s open-jawed stare throughout a game is matched by Dreary’s same emotionless visage last seen popping that mouthpiece in his glove…the one move he’s shown this year with any consistency…

    This team CANNOT and WILL NOT go anywhere. Not with this group, not with this coach.

    Now, think about this for a second…just hours after hinting that major changes needed to be done, people possibly getting sat down or moved…before the fear can even grab hold in this emotionless, passionless group of players…before they start to worry about the ONE thing he can do to them (take away ice time)…he backs off entirely and says he is confident they can do it and they will do it.

    Not only that…”We won’t be beating ourselves anymore”…

    More verbal diarrhea from the master…at the very least he’s given me a good reason to find other activities to do on game nights.

  10. staal how bout Drury has he not sucked? Why not get on his case? He seems to have the ability to be invisable night after night. Quite ab talent no?

  11. So if we have the horses, and they aren’t collectively playing up to their potential, isn’t that Renney’s fault? Isn’t it the coach’s job to get the most out of his players?

  12. I think it may have been geared towards motivating his players and making them believe that they are capable of it.



  13. I like the game plan these rangers were built to play. Skate hard and fast and make things happen by having the feet move faster than the eyes. I think that the off-season signing of two fast, hard working, and smart hockey players to long contracts is a clear example of how the brass thinks they should be running a hockey team.

    However, if a large portion of the roster cannot skate fast enough to play the game this way, we have problems. A step has been lost by the mainstay defensemen, and Malik and Rozival can no longer play the game the way they had previously. While Rozival has improved in some aspects, the amount of odd man rushes means that the group he skates with is a step slow, and that means death to the game plan.

    I don’t care why they are slow, cause it doesn’t interest me in the reason, suffice it to say, that half the top minute getters on the team arn’t able to skate fast enough for the whole time there out there, and that is a large weakness.

    What is more, the legs capable of eating catching some of those minutes are underneith underaged heads. They will be much better in a two or three years, but can not be top line forwards yet.

    It isn’t one thing wrong, its a whole problem with the group of players not being physically able to do what they need to. Jagr, Shanahan, Rozival, and Malik can not skate fast enough right now, for whatever reason, than they are required to skate to win.

    Therefore, if their lack of speed catches up with them, a couple goals against can be counted upon regualarly, that just didn’t exist last year.

    And may i remind all of you, that last year there was a certain Brad Isbister on the top line, serving no other function than that he could skate, cause goodness knows he couldn’t do anything else.

  14. What Renney says to Sam and the other reporters and what he says behind closed doors could easily be 180 degrees different. I hope so.

    How many “turning points” can one team have in a season before they’re so dizzy they puke and fall down?

    Sam, are there any players out there you think would make good, reasonable additions to the Blueshirts? Any guys rumored to be on the block you think would be improvements?

  15. ZG: Good point about speed. A lot of team’s have it and many Rangers don’t (especially on D). That’s been a glaring flaw all year. Of course, nothing’s been done about it. That would, you know, make sense and require admitting the management made mistakes…

  16. *CJP* = My favorite poster. Great post.

    “emotionless visage last seen popping that mouthpiece in his glove…the one move he’s shown this year with any consistency”

    meant to laugh about this before… it’s so funny…. he’s always spitting that foul thing into his fouler glove… such filth…so funny that you noticed that too, thought i was the only one.

    And what the hell is it with drurys WRISTS? Damn dude…you gotta protect those with cuffs on your gloves or at least slash guards….not only does he not pad them, the pulls his sleeves up so that you can see where he’s vulnerable… the fact that he’s not been injured yet is surreal… if i were opposing him and he posed an actual thread to my team, the first thing i’d do is chop down on his wrist and put him out for 6-8 weeks minimum.

  17. salty why would an opposing team wanna hurt him? Him playing helps the opposing team.


    re – read my post, I said IF he actually posed a threat!

    From last thread:


    “Arent goalies forbidden from wearing the C?”

    Ed Belfour captained the Black Cawks for years if I’m not mistaken.

  18. From The Daily News

    “Whether it was the early afternoon start Sunday or fans of both teams focused more on the New York Giants’ and New England Patriots’ NFL conference championship games later in the day, the crowd was quite subdued considering this was a matchup of Original Six teams fighting for important points.” – AP

    #1 afternoon games are always dogs
    #2 the Rangers are boring to watch. They do not hit, they do not fight, they do not score, they are rarely in on a forecheck anymore

    Just no emotion at home when the Bruins come right into your building and push you around.

  19. Salty…I bought into all the nonsense regarding Drury in the off-season, although I didn’t think much of him in the playoffs other than when he scored that killer goal (which had more to do with the Rangers collapsing than “The Born Winner Chris Drury”.

    I can appreciate it when a guy does the little things, I’ve been watching hockey for almost 30 years…and I’m well-schooled to know when a player does all the little things and plays with passion and fire.

    Drury plays with ZERO passion. And for a guy who couldn’t wait to play for his boyhood team, it’s not only disheartening it makes you think he was bullshitting everybody. He’s invisible on most nights because he flat out doesn’t do anything on most nights. His +/- rating puts to bed the rumor he’s great defensively…

    Really, other than being a good face-off guy…I just don’t see what the big deal is. And the “wait til he gets to the playoffs” crap is just that: Crap.

    But let’s not hang it all on him, this team is flawed up and down the roster…add to that the disgusting lack of heart and passion…and a coach who has not a clue what to do or how to do it…and you’ve got one hell of a depressing year.

    This isn’t their year…not even close. And it’s time to cut the dead wood and move along…

    BTW, I do believe that there is a rule in the NHL that a goalie can’t be captain. Sometimes a goalie can be referred to as the “unnamed captain” but I do believe it’s a rule.

  20. You are mistaken Salty, goalies cannot wear the C.

    Per the NHL rulebook, section 6.1:

    “No playing coach or playing manager or goalkeeper shall be permitted to act as captain or alternate captain.”

  21. czechthemout!!!!! on

    Dave Maloney made some very telling comments about the rangers on xm radio today.I did not hear them but some of the comments were relayed by some posters over at another blog.He basically said that the rangers need to dump alot of what is currently on the team.The comment I found most troubling if true was how Renney tries to make players into what he wants them to be rather than what they are good at.To me,that explains the drop in offensive production from a guy like Callahan and even Prucha.

  22. Really, at this point when Renney opens his mouth he sounds just like the teacher from those old Charlie Brown movies.

  23. Jagr’s personal PR man on this blog has one job to do. turn the conversation away from him and onto Drury.

    no way, Jose.

    has drury played well consistently or up to expectations? no

    but the biggest underachiever, the biggest disappointment, the true cancer on this team by a mile is Jaromir Jagr, the Incredible Sulk.

    and no amount of your bs trying to change the subject by bashing other players is going to fly, pal.

  24. Hockeyman Rangers on


  25. Graves9…Did you think Drury was a savior? He’s doing exactly what he’s done in the past. He’s scored some big goals for us this year but if you expected him to come in here and score 40 goals and 80 points then you’re going to be disappointed. His goal and point totals aren’t that far off from his career numbers.

  26. what Renney conveniently leaves out is the fact that they DID have to go outside to get the motivation they needed last Feb.

    namely Sean Avery.

    if they had just stuck to what they had last year, had not acquired Avery, they would have gone NOWHERE the last 2 months. they would have stumbled along just below .500 like they did all season.

    so it is a flat out lie to imply they did it last year with the guys they had.

  27. LOL… FYI I think all 3 of Renney, Jagr and Drury should go take a warm bath together… I’m not trying to deflect anything off Jagr, I don’t think anyone is.

    And I seriously remember seeing a lot of pictures of Belfour, in net, wearing the C around when I first started getting into hockey around 92-93… always thought to mysels.. “they must suck if their best guy is a goalie” I know for a fact I saw this!!!

    Then again I have been smoking crack since ’88 so…. make what you will of that.

  28. DITTO dlb,
    Remember it all starts with Jagr, as Jagr goes so go the Rangers.
    I don’t think its Drury’s fault at all, come on look who he is playing with. Avery, a proven 3rd liner and Shanny, a former great player, past his prime. What the Hell do you expect. Last year Drury played with a different caliber of player this year, no one is setting him up.

    And graves9, I admit, Drury has always been one of my favorite players. He is a proven clutch guy no matter what anyone here says.
    Let me pose a question. Excuse the language but WTF has Jagr done since Pittsburg when SuperMario carried his bags to the Cup?…NOTHING! He’s a sulking baby! He bombed with the Caps. He’s the worst Captain this team has seen in ages. Leetch was better and so was Kelly Kisio.
    Jagr takes lazy, stupid penalties. He has done nothing!! and he is far from being a leader.

    Drury at least moves on the ice. The team is playing so bad around him, what do you all expect. He is not lazy. He works hard. Maybe his +/- is so bad because his linemates and defense are hanging him out to dry.

    The fact of the matter is…this team has so many problems we all don’t know where to start, so we point fingers at the highest paid players.
    A team with Drury is better any day than a team without!

    Jagr should step back, surrender his “c” and play third line minutes. Put all the old bags on one line and let the hardworking younger guys ie, Drury, Gomez, Dubi, Prucha, Dawes, Etc. play

  29. On the Drury/Jagr debate… IMO – jags has been more of a let down and furhter away from playing to his potential than Drury. Jags performance bears more weight on the success of the team than does Drury’s. Just sayin, 2-3 more goals from Dru, with 5-10 more assists, and he’s right about where he should be as far as season averages go. jags on the other hand is sooo far behind where he should be, or at least where we felt he was capable of in sept.

    Not that the play of either one of those guys will change a complete season.

    salty – without the rest of my statement, the connotation of the quote is lost.

  30. Love the post about Drury’s mouthpiece. Hey Renney, old horses are shot or put out to pasture.

  31. Well I guess maybe I should stop smoking crack? All in favor say ‘Aye’.

    I could swear Belfour used to wear a C with the BlackCawks.

    Beer I was just saying the notion of Renney “finally” saying something to motivate his players is unreal, and if you think that’s anything but lipservice and soundbytes for the press and fans…. well then I commend you for being a much more dedicated Ranger fan than I.

    But when we go 0-2 vs ATL, *then* can we have your soul and get you on the “Slay Renney” wagon???


  32. To all you Jagr haters ….

    So Gomez with 45 points is great and Jagr who has 43 points is a bum.. I just want to be clear on what everyone is saying…

  33. LOL @ Koffy

    thats not gonna work on thi sforum chauncey, the people in here actually *watch* the games and know *who* dies *what* on the ice. Jagr shoul dhave a lot more goals, and a lot of those goals should have come from Gomez feeds. And vice versa.

    You obviously have no idea wtf you are talking about and you just made that painfully clear to the rest of the world via the internet. cheers mate.

    In wins 22 8 16 24 11 16 3 0 4 – 71 11.27%
    In losses 27 6 13 19 -14 24 1 0 0 – 79 7.59%
    Clutch – 0 5 5 – 4 0 0 0 – – .00%
    Blowouts – 0 4 4 – 2 0 0 0 – – .00%

    jagr has scored NOT ONE single clutch goal all season, according to the official stats.

    and his poor play in losses are big main reasons FOR those losses

  35. The worst part about JJ this year isn’t that he’s not scoring, it’s watching him take lazy penalties and watching him drag his ass up and down the ice like an unhappy child.

    But Dave Maloney’s point about Renney seems spot on, for players and for the team: he wants them to be players and a unit they are not, instead of the players and the unit they naturally should be. Frustrating. And it explains the shite power play too.

  36. Sam – I’m surprised that you’d claim the Rangers are more dangerous with Jagr (who’s obviously lost his passion for playing, either on this team or period). What’s your basis fo those thoughts?

    At this point, I’m more surprised when Jagr has a scoring chance, much less one that results in a goal, than ever. Conversely, when the 3rd line is out, I expect plenty of scoring opportunities.

    Don’t you see the problem with this scenario?

  37. Ahhhh, and so finally y’all understand why so many of us used to call the 1999-2004 Rangers “The Glue Factory.”

    And yes, stop smoking crack, I am proof that you don’t have to be a crackhead to root for this team (it just helps).

  38. the columns are tough to read in these small boxes, but the gist of it is that Jagr is -14 in losses

    and he has zero goals and five assists in clutch situations.

  39. Yeah, of course Maloney’s right. You have one of the weakest defensive corps in the east, be that a product of bad players or inexperience, you’re loaded up front with forwards who can allegedly put the puck in the net, but you are forced to adopt a defense first system because the defensemen, if left to their own devices with no help from forwards, will commit endless amounts of bad turnovers and own goals that will result in repeated drubbings. And so we’re stuck with a team that has a bunch of high scoring forwards trying to play defense first. Of COURSE it doesn’t work.

  40. Salty – I’m in it till the mathmatics prove we’re out. And that’s just to say that I’ve lost hope IF that happens. But I don’t see that this team is playing so poorly due to coaching. Hey, I could look for and find tons of things wrong, as can everyone else here. But it all comes down to execution. And I’d have to agree with Maloney (ugh) and those that are pointing out the lack of physical play on our part. Moreso, the lack of physical players. Something that we need to look to slats on. I think he mis-read the post-lockout league a bit. If that grit is in htfd, then we can do nothing but wait. Renney is the right guy for those kids. again, imo.

  41. I see our coach says “we have 21 losses that’s brutal”. 1 small correction Tom – we have 27 losses. I don’t subscribe to Bettman math.

  42. No way you trade Jagr. Why does he get ALL the blame? What has anyone else done that’s so great?

  43. the devils have a WORSE dman corps than the Rangers, yet they are still able to finish ahead in the standings. they lose rafalski and now have

    the great raccoon-neck, oduya, mike friggin mottau, and greene, brookbank, vishnevski .

    yes, paul martin and colin white are OK, but that is about the extent of it.

    and the canes won the stanley cup with a rookie goalie and a very mediocre dman corps, the great mike commodore and glen wesley.

    most teams in the east would love to have the ranger 3some of girardi, tyutin, and staal

  44. I was hoping that the rangers were going to be in first place when they hung leetch’s jersey to the rafters but just like when richter’s jersey was hung. The ranger fans will go to salute leetch and than when the ceremony is over half of them
    won’t stay to watch the rangers play because they stink.

  45. Salty:

    I have forgotten more about hockey then you will ever know !! So obviously YOU don’t know wtf you are talking about.

    You probably are like Renney and want to play Betts, Hollweg and Orr the whole game!

  46. Doodie Machetto on

    Just to respond to some responses to my post from this morning. First of all, thanks for the positive reception it received. Second of all, yes, Drury has a 5 year contract, not 7, my bad on that. I just got the millions confused with the term. It still doesn’t change what I said about him.

    As for Nylander, yes, having him for 5 years would have been bad. But instead of signing him for 5 years, they could have signed him for 2 or 3 if they threw enough money at him. He got 5 million for 4 years. If they signed him for 2 or 3 years (the most Jagr would be around) for 6 million per, not only would we be saving money from what we paid for Drury, but we would still have Nylander!

    Someone said make Hank captain, but it is not allowed to make goaltenders captains. If it were, don’t you think that Brodeur would have been the captain in NJ for some time? DiPietro probably would be captain too.

    As for someone saying Shanahan should be captain, I disagree. I understand wanting to send the message about Jagr, but Shanahan has been playing listlessly as well! I could understand the argument at the beginning of last year, when Jagr wasn’t doing much and Shanny was playing hard, fighting Brashear, etc. But this year he has been just as bad. Someone said he took a paycut, but in fact, he did not. He actually got a raise. Just because his base salary is lower, doesn’t change the fact that his cap hit is larger and he is being paid more money. Selfish.

    We’re in serious trouble folks.

  47. between the postgame and today reality set in.

    they realize that they have veteran high-salary guys with big contracts near the end of their days that they cannot move easily or for any immediate help, just draft picks.

    the only tradeable assets the rangers really have are the younger, better players, and that would simply be mortgaging the future.

    so, the only quick fix available is to fire renney. I am all for that, and it is deserved, but why do you think renney has all of a sudden changed his tune since yesterday. because HIS JOB is the one change most likely to make any difference short term, so now he says everything is fine.

  48. czech I don’t believe Dave Maloney would come out and say that. Some posters hear what they want to hear. Recheck that, it’s highly doubtful, he works for MSG. And I don’t think he he believes that.

  49. As far as Captain goes… if the Rangers do indeed decide to let Jagr walk at the end of the season I say have a season with a revolving captain, or three “A”lternates.

    I let Jagr, Malik, Shanny, Hossa, Mara, Hollweg and Vally leave. Still up in the air on Straka and Rozival, but most likely Rozy and keep Straka if he wants to play that veteran role.

    I sign Avery to a 3-yr deal, ank long term, a good back-up and I let Callahan, Straka, Avery, Prucha, Moore, Dawes, Dubinsky, Gomez, Drury fight for the top 9 forwards. I alternate the “A” around these guys throughout the season and by the following season I look to give the “C” to either Staal, Girardi or Dubinsky or whomever proves from that group that they want it.

    Sanguetti, Staal, Girardi and Tyutin could be our top 4 next season with a low-cost, tough UFA over the summer as a 5 with Liffiton, Baranka, Sauer or Pock as the 6th D.

    Right now. I’d take Dawes, Callahan, Liffiton, Moore and even Hugh Jessiman over Jagr, Shanahan, Hossa and Mara.

  50. Rangers6830,
    Jagr is taking the blame
    1. because he is the “captain”
    2. because he is not “leading”
    3. because he is not “scoring(at least not on the ice)
    4. because his lazy play is sickening
    5. because of his pathetic penalties
    6. because apparently this is “HIS TEAM”
    7. because as Jagr goes so goes the Rangers and since Jagr isn’t going neither are the Rangers.
    8. because as opposed to the end of last season, he seems completely unmotivated and unwilling to work and not willing to change things. He does the same crap every night

    That my friend is why Jagr is getting the blame.
    if you read more carefully you will see he is also sharing the blame with Renney, and unfortunately…Drury.

  51. bklynblue – I can confirm Maloney’s statements, though not to the word. Got an email from my brother not long ago asking if I heard it. Apparently he tore it apart piece by piece and player by player. Wish I coulda heard that one. You may not see him on the next ‘inside the rangers’! haha

    doodie – I can’t see shanny being made captain either. And to add to your thought… b/c of the discussion that he and jags had some time back, remember that, when they spoke in the locker room till midnight or so after a bad loss @ msg? They know what’s going on in terms of leadership.

    And as far as the Nylander thing goes…who knows if an offer like that was never presented to mikey?

    An observation on Shanny. I can’t say he has been playing well, as much as he would say the same. But if jags had 60 points right now and prucha had 20 goals, and hank had a 2.00gaa. Shanny’s #’s would be looked at in a whole different light. no? Not bad if that’s just your token ‘this is how we did it back in the old days’ vet.

  52. staal wart, that was your post? nice job. the ‘scoring’ line was a nice touch!

    vogs – lots of youth there, huh? I hope there as good as we think they are. That made me think of that blueshirtbulletin post that up there right now. They take a look at the D of detroit and find that there’s only 3 players under 30. And speak to the point that a vet D corp. It’s a good read.

  53. I saw that John Grahme cleared re-entry waivers. 1.4 for the year, so at this point it’d be somewhere around 600k? I’d have to believe a guy with some extra nhl TOI would have to be better than vally no? Is slats even looking for a backup?

    I like vally, just not as OUR backup. haha

  54. Funny,
    after 9 years of not making the playoffs and watching panic move after panic move ( money’s no object)The thing that impressed me about the “New Rangers”, from 05-06 thru 06-07 was the composure and lack of panic….This was both on the ice and from the coaching staff. I liked the stability that Renney seemed to project and I think it carried its way to the ice and they had two pretty good years ( compared to the Lindros/Bure days)
    Now, for some reason, that composure seems to have mutated itself into lack of spirit, lack of desire and yes…lack of scoring confidence. ( every mediocre goalie who stops a few shots makes them want to stop shooting altogether)…..
    Maybe I’m just panicing and this “stay the course mentality” is the way to go but it just does not feel right anymore

  55. Beer Me!

    Yes, lot’s of youth, willing to play the game after the team is turned over to them like it should be. I mean who else is there? Bringing in another UFA like Jagr at the end of his career?

    I think we’ll see that happen since it is getting more and more difficult to obtain the best ones because they are too expensive for small market teams to hold onto. The salary cap handled that issue. Nor does it seem like the best ones will ever get to Free Agency because teams lock them up.

    I think our youth is as good as anyone elses youth, it just needs to be given the chance to develop.

    A lineup of Gomez, Callahan and Dawes – Drury, Dubinsky, Straka – Avery, Moore and Prucha would give us more effort and better skating than what we see right now.

  56. vogs – I think our youth does not come close to Pittsburgh’s youth or even teams like Chicago for that matter. none of the guys you named for the Rangers were drafted top 5 in the draft and that’s where the Lemieux’s Sakics Stevie Y’s etc are drafted. the kind of guys that lead their team to a cup or 3. and if you really think that 2 yrs from now a guy like Dubinsky will be captain I have a bridge for sale you might be interested in.

  57. “I don’t know whats more painful,watching the Rangers play or coming here and reading the comments.”

    Comrade Spooky
    Its definitely the comments

  58. Sam – re the subject line in this thread – can’t help but think of the movie “they shoot horses don’t they”

  59. Doodie Machetto on

    “Shanny’s #’s would be looked at in a whole different light. no? ”

    No. He is still making 5.3 million this year. Those are not the numbers of someone being paid 5.3 million, even if he is a vet.

    The people blaming only Jagr are wrong. Because he isn’t the only one playng listlessly. The only forwards that are trying are Gomez, Prucha, Dawes, Dubinsky, Hollweg, Betts, and Orr. And the last 3 suck. The only reason why Jagr hurts the most is bcause when he’s on his game, he can carry the whole team. So yes, he deserves it, but so does the rest of the team. Spread it out.

  60. the wash, pens game on versus has more hitting and scoring and action than 4 ranger games. that says plenty about Tommy boys little system

  61. Doodie – I think most forwards are trying. they might even be trying too hard ie gripping their sticks too hard. Straka and Drury are certainly trying especially on the defensive end (despite Drury’s +/-). Obviously Drury is so far not worth the $. but it’s not for lack of trying. and some forwards Straka, Shanny Avery Jagr are pretty banged up which is hindering their performance. I agree with you that Shanny did us no favor with that contract $ increase but I do believe he’s trying. none of these guys are Valeri Kamensky.

  62. So on the site are people saying they take Jessiman and Lffiton a D man over jagr. We also say they should play 9 forwardss none bigger then 205 lbs..

    NEWSFLASH… The Rangers have the talent to be a top tier team.. Have they done it? NO…

    The last few days Shanahan has looked cooked… They cnnot score at the end of the day, with the week 5 and 6 d man henrik being decent but not great the lack of scoring is the whole story..

    jagr, drury, shnahan, prucha, and the cast of characters cannot score. Think if Roszival or Girardi were having the scoring year expected the scoring would be even worse.. They play like the Devils but the Devils play this boring system better and Brodeur is still better then Henrik..

    I hate Brodeur but the guy has been great for 15 + yrs. he is the best goalie of all time by far…

    The ycan turn it around, will they that is another story…

    Pitt is without crosby, fleury, eaton, and others and still are playing real good, why can’t the rangers turn it around.

    On Avery nice 3rd liner or really a 4th liner, he can skate, and pass, but he is a bricklayer.. Check out his career stats the guy cannot score……….

  63. The Wolf Pack suffered their first overtime defeat of the season Saturday, losing to Portland at home, 5-4, and then fell again in overtime at Providence on Sunday, this time by a score of 4-3. Defenseman Andrew Hutchinson and team points leader P.A. Parenteau, both with two goals and three assists for five points in the four games, were the top point-producers for the Wolf Pack during the week.

    Renney: We have the horses…..WELL????

  64. wash caps won again. they now are 1 point behind rangers with 1 game in hand. they are playing WAY better since they canned their coach.

    but of course, that is not possible in NY because the soft ranger media will never call out Renney for anything.

  65. Malik plays? We suck. Malik is injured for a month? We go on a nice winning streak. Coincidence? I think not!

  66. Roszival is a better player when he plays with Staal, Malik’s tendency to give the puck away and not use his size against opponents always leaves Roszival trying to clean up his mess. OK, so Staal has made a very occasional rookie mistake and he’s no Chris Pronger but, Malik makes Roszival a bad player.
    As for Drury, his numbers some up short because he had to play 1/3 of a season on the 3rd line and when he is on a top line he’s being asked to play with wingers who are either off-form or injured or he’s being asked to change his game. He needs a good play-making winger and a power-forward, not a sniper and an agitator.
    In terms of stats Jagr is OK. He has 7 goals and 11 assists in the last month (15 games), he is also a -1 for that stretch, but the problem for me is his lack of production on the PP.
    I would trade Malik and Hossa for Rob Blake and start resting avery, Jagr and Shanny and give the younger guys like Greg Moore, PA Parenteau, Callahan, Bourret a few games to see if any of them can make themselves undroppable.

  67. SAM can you verify this post about Dave Maloney on XM?

    “He basically said that the rangers need to dump alot of what is currently on the team.The comment I found most troubling if true was how Renney tries to make players into what he wants them to be rather than what they are good at.”

    That almost sounds like 2 contradicting statements. The first one is getting rid of players, the 2nd part is blaming Renney for trying to change them. No doubt he wants them to be defensively responsible, and has probably hurt the offense of most. But the only weak part of this roster is the missing a tough guy on D. Many of the rest are under-performing including Lundqvist.

  68. What? “Over”?
    Did you say “over”?
    Nothing’s over until we decide it is!
    Was it over when the Germans
    bombed Pearl Harbor?
    Hell, no!
    And it ain’t over now.
    ‘Cause when the going gets tough…
    (Patriotic instrumental music)
    the tough get going! Who’s with me?
    Let’s go! Come on!

  69. Beer Me,
    I have two things to say.

    1. News Flash, it wasn’t the Germans who bomb pearl harbor, it was the Japanese.

    2. I personally think the rangers are a done team because I have not seen anything that has changed with this team this year. It’s been the same boring, not scoring, no PP, lundqvist
    giving up soft goals, shaky defense, poor coaching strategies.

  70. TOMG

    Just so you know, Beer Me was quoting John Belushi’s speech in Animal House. They also play this at the Garden when they want to get the crowd fired up. But you are right it was the Japanese.

    Renney is in denial. The Rangers are their own worst enemy. They should stop playing like a team that is expected to win by the fans and play like a team that they know can win. It’s getting tough to watch a complete game.

    Let’s hope Sather doesn’t sell the farm to add to this miserable season.

  71. BillyNJ1,
    I’ve been a very long time ranger fan and if Sather trades any of his young players to fix this mess than I am truly done with this organization.

  72. All our growing exasperation with this team & its numerous flaws would be a non-issue if the EFFORT,INTENSITY, & PASSION were present, which, with the talent level, would make us competetive with all but two teams in the NHL.
    After watching the NY GIANTS gutty efforts all season & mental & physical toughness, the contrast between the two teams is staggering.
    Die hard NY sports fans will be forgiving of ALOT, but NEVER A LACK OF TRYING.
    It’s not too late to turn it around ONLY IF an effort adjustment or heart transplant takes place. GO RANGERS (& GIANTS).

  73. tomg…. it was indeed the Germans that bombed Pearl Harbor..ask anyone on this blog, *right guys?*

    I do agree this team is done and has been done since the get go. Renney may have the horses but he doesn’t know how to ride em…. nothing has changed all year. Jagr has not paid once for his weak efforts. This team is going down in flames and I will be here to talk about it into the dog days of summer.

  74. It’s sad that everybody jumps on Beer Me for the German quote yet nobody recognizes its from Animal House. you should all be ashamed of yourselves and head over to Blockbuster right now.

  75. Not only was it from Animal House I believe he did it exactly the way it is in the movie music and all. I laughed at that one for sure. Because I realized what he was doing.

  76. I was a little late but its funny how several people were so quick to correct BeerMe’s “history”…


  77. Ok, so I was punked, what can you say. I only saw the movie once and that was when it originally came out so I forgot, I’m bad.

  78. I like to think that Sather has gotten out of that trade everyone for success mode that has doomed the Rangers every year. 94 was great and 95 wan’t too bad, but after that we felt the effects for the next 7 years.

    Malik should be traded or released, he is constantly making mistakes and although he does occassionally make a good play ot two, he is inconsistent and that is the problem for this entire team. The Rangers cannot handle inconsistency.

    I am also getting tired of all of Jagrs penalties, If he gets one is is always hooking or holding. It would be nice for Jagr to go to the box for roughing one of these times. show some heart. Stop killing rally’s by being lazy. Ask Renney to keep you on the bench for a shift or two if you are tired.

    Play a full 60 minutes. I’m sure you have all watched games tis season where Sam or Joe say that was a great period by the Rangers, lately those periods are followed by really bad ones and the result is yet another loss. Why is it that each team we face looks like a Stanley Cup Contender?

    Lastly, this coaching staff needs a fresh slap in the face. Can they see what’s going on?I have read countless articles saying “Renney Rips Rangers”. Who cares? We need a coach that can discipline and jar these players, during the game, not in the newspapers afterwards, to get the most out of them. The threat of benching should be hanging over everyone’s head all of the time now. Let’s bring up Montoya and give Henrik a little competition before we give him a 50 year deal.

    This team drives me crazy!!!

  79. If the Rangers did some ballsy sh1t today like dropped all the weak sauce players and kicked lipservice Renney out on his ass I would be as proud as ever and would possibly even get a Rangers tattoo on my tongue .

  80. Geez guys – that went so far over some heads here I got a better chuckle out of that than even looking up the exact quote from the movie in the first place. I even picked it b/c it’s played on that HUGE screen that’s right in front of you at games, and heard over the HUGE p.a. system that msg provides. How could you miss that? To those that ‘got it’, hope you enjoyed it.

    lol – remember when we dropped that A-bomb on Korea? :P

  81. I am going to the game tonight. I might bring a sniper rifle and take out Malik. And when I am done I am taking out dancing larry and dancing granny. Ha. Joking of course, but that is the kind of mood I am in.

  82. Just so I don’t violate terms of service I want to make it clear that I was joking just now. I wouldn’t want graves9 to try and get me banished from the site again. :)

  83. Maybe 2 games against Kovalchuck will get Avery playing like the Avery of last year and get the team moving in the right direction.

    I would also like to see someone knock Exelby through the boards into the 1st row. That would put a huge smile on my face.

  84. If I had tickets to the game I would sell, sell, sell just like sather should do with the dead wood at the trading dead line.

  85. Rest easy Nasty1. We have the horses…so we can make plenty of glue.

    If slats can find a taker for Malik, I will no longer bash him for anything in the future(the past is a different story). He’s gotta be the hardest player to dump off on anyone right now. Really, what is his value? If he ends the season with the rangers I wouldn’t be surprised. Not b/c we want to keep him, but we just don’t have a choice. I know sending him to htfd is an option, but why interupt there push for the post-season with that burden?

  86. Nasty 1
    January 22nd, 2008 at 10:38 am
    The tickets are free and the train ride is too. I might as well go.

    Free, huh? No beer, hot dog, nuttin?

  87. I was away this wkend. I missed the Saturday game and watched the Sunday disaster on NBC.

    Abandon ship is on the tip of my tongue….I hope we turn into a trade deadline seller….Jagr, Malik, Shanny (useless lately, utterly useless) should be packaged to a team. Sadly, I see Dubi or Dawes or Prucha going for someone like Keith Tkachuk or Ed Jovanovski in a clear and utter Glenn Sather more-things-change-the-more-they-stay-the-same moment. I will cry like T.O. if this is the case.

    Sam said something in his post at the top that I wholly disagree with. The Rangers are not a more dangerous team with Jagr.

    Here is why: First, the other team puts their monster D men out there (see Chara) and who just sits on a slower, more-predictable-than-ever Jagr. The team is easy to defend when Jagr is on the ice. Clog up his wing with heavyweights and hustle when you have the puck because Jagr will take penalties. Second, other guys’ creativity is hampered when Jagr is on the ice. “How can I get the puck to Jagr?” is all they think about. Third, like the second point, dump and chase and bump and grind hockey is thrown out the door when Jagr is on the ice. The Rangers are better when they are hitting and forechecking. No one out there is playing like this when Jagr is around. Fourth: Real leaders’ voices on the team are being stifled due to Jagr’s presence. When he is gone, you will see this team’s new identity shine through. It will be a lot more exciting. 5th: Jagr’s lazy, stupid penalties are demoralizing the team. If I see the team leader acting like a total baby, giving up, etc., I am less likely to care. He sets a bad example. Yes he tries and gets frustrated. But his actions are not one who is determined to tough it out and get the job done.

    We need to ship out Jagr while we can get something valuable for him.

    My view.

  88. nnewman – THAT’s the way its done. I hope everyone who ever objects to a point made by anyone here takes something from that retort. You laid it out in a way that’s hard to dispute otherwise. nice job.

    I h8te 68.

  89. Wanted to share this good ‘ol Bowman moment with you all. I was watching a bit of NHL Network this weekend and caught this story. I don’t remember the exact season, but it doesn’t really matter.

    While the coach of the Detroit Red Wings, the team was on a road trip and Scotty didn’t want the team out too late ‘on the town’. So he handed a hockey stick to either the doorman or the bellhop or an employee of the hotel that would be in the lobby. He told this fella to get an autograph from every player who walked into the hotel after the coaches imposed 11p.m. curfew. So the next day at the a.m. skate he scolded the curfew violators as they looked at him with a blank ‘how the hell did he know’ look on their faces. So there with signatures and all he had them caught red-handed.

  90. Kelly Kisio = real number 11. 16, too.

    I know I’m crazy but I really believe this team doesn’t have to suck. They just can’t be squeezed into a defense lockdown hole. They can’t maintain that; it’s not who they are.

    If you’ve got the horses, Renney, let ’em run free…

    Oh, and lose Hollweg.

  91. Beer Me!:

    I think it’s pretty obvious that Renney has had the team on “double secret probation.” But don’t worry, that’s all over now and they’re gonna start kicking ass.

    Of course, if I graded them, they’d get worse grades that the Delta house.

    Zero point zero.

  92. Black Stallion on

    We apparently have the horses…problem is they’re too busy pullin Beer Me’s beer cart.

  93. HAHA – As humorus as it may be to quote Animal House in respects to the Rangers….it can’t be a good sign.

  94. And, one more thing, enough with the Henrik apologists. He’s playing badly, and hurting the team. Maybe he’s got personal or physical reasons, maybe he’s got family issues, or teeth issues, or whatever. But he’s letting in a goal against a game he shouldn’t and over-reacting to everything.

    I, and others, have said it before: he needs competition.

    And to find the focus that can sometimes make him a franchise player.

    Give him a contract, already. But discipline him and get him focused.

  95. When Messier was the Captain of the Rangers (or any team for that matter) he didn’t stop skating when the puck was a few feet away from him and an opponent as close as him, he fought for the puck. If Jagr is going to be the Captain of this team, he needs to show the team the way, and lead by example!! He is playing a lazy game (as is evident by the amout of hooking penalties he is taking). This team needs to get a stud defenseman, and they need their CAPTAIN to step up and say, “I am getting my nose dirty, so you need to do the same”! If not Renney needs to make a move, or sit said players (no matter who they are)!!! They have the horses to do it, but the horses need to stop watching the game, and they need to start playing it. Renney needs to START watching the game, and stop playing favorites with the veterans. If Nigel Dawes makes a mistake, he sits the rest of the game, but if Straka makes a stupid play, he goes back out for another underachieving shift. Lets go TOM, start giving the fans what we want, a hard working team!!!

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